SPEAKER_02 0:04

Nun into it. Keep that in the further. Maybe he wants to go further. Keep that in the further, like I said.

SPEAKER_00 0:14

Greetings and salutations, and welcome to Hackerslash. If you're joining us again, welcome back. Don't worry, it's not the house that's haunted. If this is your first time listening, welcome to the party. We are a horror movie review podcast dedicated to telling you whether a movie is a hack. A total joke, a waste of time, or a slash.

SPEAKER_01 0:32

Totally killer pun intended.

SPEAKER_00 0:35

We believe horror is for everyone, and as such, we're rating these movies with the perspective we've all gained from our varying walks of life and the flavors of fear we fancy most. My name is Chris, I'm your friendly neighborhood slasher enthusiast. For this episode, we have a different makeup for our spooky scary skeleton crew. This time, it's Ladies' Night. Joining me are the gore lover Alexis. Hey everyone. And the cowardly creeper Ryan. Hiya. This week we've got Demons and Fiends Aplenty. In fact, we've got mediums and creepy ghouls galore. Before we determine how many spooky wonders one astral cavern can hold, though, we have some follow-up.

SPEAKER_02 1:08

As you all know, Dead Alive made me dead inside. And I was excited to see that at least some people agreed with me. Our poll results gave us about a 57% slash and a 43% hack for Dead Alive from 1993.

SPEAKER_00 1:22

I'm gonna be real, I actually kind of thought it would be uh the other way around.

SPEAKER_02 1:25

Yeah, I I would hope it would be 100% hack, but you know, here we are. This is life. You guys like craziness. So we have a comment from one of our patrons, Anthony. He says, Although this movie was gory as all heck and very original in many ways, it's not something I found myself really enjoying. The comedy of this horror comedy was hit too hard, mocking airplane, naked gun style while not making me laugh. Pikita was annoying, geez, didn't like her. The music is what YouTube should have cut out, and the ending, like the very ending after Lionel turns into Ash with a lawnmower was just silly and actually inconclusive being a zombie flick. Definitely won't watch it again. It's a hack. I'm actually surprised this didn't get a universal hack. And let me tell you, Anthony, I totally agree with you. I don't understand what's going on that we didn't give that a universal hack.

SPEAKER_00 2:08

I actually love this because typically Anthony and I I feel like are pretty aligned in our feelings on movies. So to see him showing some support to Ryan warms the cockles of my heart.

SPEAKER_02 2:18

Yes, it is lovely. And from Twitter we had Zach who said, I love it. Definitely the one that made me a fan of Peter Jackson. Screw Lord of the Rings. Damn, that's harsh. It's kind of offensive a little bit. I'm gonna be honest. I love Lord of the Rings. Please don't do this right now. And then Eric said, Dead Alive. Such a wonderful love story when you think about it. A man's love for his mother and his love for Paquita. Strong as heck. And I'd like to note, we have one comment here loving Paquita and one comet hating Paquita, and I just didn't know she was such a divisive figure. Oh, for sure.

SPEAKER_01 2:46

She definitely is. I thought she was annoying.

SPEAKER_00 2:48

I thought she was one of like the universally good things about that movie. Yes, absolutely. We loved her. And that's our follow-up. Well, in Dead Alive, we saw a rat monkey violently slap a real monkey, so we thought, why not feature a film with a demon who also has a penchant for slappin'? Following James Wan's success with his early entries in the Saw franchise, he realized the visceral gore and violence depicted in them inspired some hesitants in folks to work with him. As a result, he reteened with Lee Winnell to prove himself. To prove he could make something terrifying without intense violence. Now the result is a film that premiered at the Toronto International Film Festival in 2010 and went on to win multiple awards that gross more than $97 million worldwide, inspired three additional films, and earned a reputation for having what's known to some as some of the best jump scares in horror. This film shows one family's moving to a new home and the subsequent efforts they make to stop evil spirits from snatching their child. This week we're talking about Insidious. We've seen this one before.

SPEAKER_01 3:50

Definitely seen it for sure. But not as many times as I thought I had. Surprisingly, I thought I've seen it like, you know, five or six times, but I f really feel like I've only seen it like once or twice.

SPEAKER_02 3:59

Yeah, it's one of those ones like it's hard to actually find anyone that hasn't seen Insidious or isn't like deeply familiar with it. And I have seen it.

SPEAKER_01 4:08

I have Oh my goodness.

SPEAKER_02 4:11

I know it's so impressive. But what's weird is that I think I think I've decided I have like a two-year time limit of how long I can keep things in my brain and then they get purged. And so I watched this truly as if it was the first time I had seen it. Like I only remembered the spoilery things and everything else. I was like, wow, what a new movie this is.

SPEAKER_00 4:30

I love that for you. Now I have a specific memory of watching this movie because I distinctly saw it in theaters a few months after getting back from deployment, and I was settling into like what a normal life was supposed to feel like again. So this was one of the first movies that I saw in theaters after coming back. I haven't seen it since though, and I haven't seen any of the other movies in this franchise. Same. Since you've both seen this before, what was the experience like watching it again?

SPEAKER_01 4:55

It was just as tense, um, surprisingly. Um, since I knew the spoilers, I I knew about everything, it still didn't take away from the mystery. I was glad that I was able to find a shit ton of Easter eggs. Saw Easter eggs in particular that I caught on to, so I'm very happy about that.

SPEAKER_02 5:11

Wow, I'm excited to hear about that. I also found myself very tense during this. I can sometimes, especially if I watch a scary movie like in the daytime, kind of trying to like rush it, not rush it for the podcast, but like fit it into a slot of my day. I tend to be more scared than normal because I kind of am like not in the mood for horror, you know, it's like not the right setting. And this was definitely one of those for me. So while I was watching, I was like not prepared for the level of stress I felt. And and also spent so much time just really wishing I could remember what I thought the first time I saw this, because I have no idea. It's just like in my brain, you know. I know I saw Insidious, I just don't know what I felt.

SPEAKER_00 5:51

Yeah, you had no opinion of it whatsoever. I have no idea.

SPEAKER_02 5:54

Again, everything just gets purged and whatever, you know. I know there's uh uh Darth Malls in it. It's an incredible flick.

SPEAKER_00 6:01

Yep, it's true. Ooh. Yeah, I uh I had fun watching this again, and I remember enjoying it the first time around. Now, to be clear, it's not like it's a it's a campy romp, right? There's not like lots of laughs along the way, but it is engaging, and to completely agree with both of you, it's hella tense. I was telling Ryan before that this movie feels like it kind of keeps you with your shoulders hunched and tense, and even if it doesn't make you jump, you're subconsciously like tensing the muscles in your body. And at the end of it, you exhale, you let your shoulders relax, and then you just realize how much the muscles ache because this movie is full of moments that keep you on edge. And I think that's the biggest thing that surprised me. I've always joked about this movie because of how silly like one of the jump scares is. And I mean, come on, if you know this movie, you know Darth Maul. When you look at some of the scares out of context, it can be easy to poke fun at, but I was really surprised just how tense this still managed to feel when I went into it expecting, oh, I'm probably not gonna be able to take this seriously. It's already been ruined for me.

SPEAKER_02 6:58

You know, it's funny because I agree with you, and I was surprised by the tense feelings, but at the same time, I was also really surprised by how goofy some things are. Like, I mean, I guess I uh you kind of know it, right? With the like you said, like the Darth Maul joke, but there's certain scenes that stood out to me, and I'm just like, is it this silly? And it is this silly, like we do have Ghostbusters, that is what's happening. And I totally forgot about that part. It was so surprising to to take note of all those moments together.

SPEAKER_01 7:30

Yeah, I think to me it was a little bit silly, and it was so weird because I didn't want like to be silly watching this, but like because I had so much like tense moments watching it the first time. There's a lot of stuff that I felt was very frightening and still remember that, and it was like etched in my brain. And what surprised me is like the timeline on this movie. I didn't realize like there's a point in this movie where three months has gone by, and I'm like, damn, this has been going on for this like movie takes place. When I thought of it, I thought it was like a few nights long, but it's it's a very interesting the timeline on this movie.

SPEAKER_02 8:05

It is one that seems like a like a one house ditty, you know? Yeah, they move in, spend a week losing their minds.

SPEAKER_01 8:12

Yeah, that's how I feel about paranormal activity. I'm like, to me, it's just I know they have like count the days and stuff like that, but to me it's just one night. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 8:19

Yeah, no, these demons are in it for the long haul. They're committed. They're not afraid of monogamy, they're here to lock it down. Uh pretty sure they're polyamorous, but you know. Okay, technically, sure, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 8:30

Try to get down with everybody.

SPEAKER_00 8:32

What I'm saying is they're they're committed to this family.

SPEAKER_02 8:34

Yes. Or really anyone they can get. Yeah. Sister wife committed though. Yeah, got it.

SPEAKER_00 8:39

I'm so stoked to hear what you both thought in terms of how scary this movie was, because for me, look, I I wasn't scared, but I do think this movie comes closest to being successful because it has a ton of stuff that's really effective at just being creepy. The things that could very easily, you know, look at your curtains a certain way, look at a shadow a certain way, and it's just like, ugh, it gives you the heapy jeebies.

SPEAKER_02 9:02

Yeah, I agree. I think I would be hard pressed to say, like, I watched this and I was afraid of it. It definitely has again the same thing that we keep saying, but that tension that it it carries with you the whole way through. It's there's not a single moment where it's like, you know, people walking through a field of flowers, everything's fine. You're not fine. As soon as you start this movie, you're not fine.

SPEAKER_00 9:22

You mean you're not tiptoeing through the tulips?

SPEAKER_02 9:24

No, not tiptoeing through tulips, you know, but you it's sometimes at some points you don't even know what you're afraid of. So if someone asked me, I would definitely say this is a scary movie. Although I didn't find myself scared this time.

SPEAKER_01 9:35

Oh, I was definitely still scared. I don't think as scared as I was the first time though. Like, there's a certain shot that's like etched in my brain, and it goes along the lines of like when you Devil's Advocate with Kiana Reeves and Al Pacino, there's a part where you see this face and you're not expecting it, and it just got me when I was a kid, and then this l this freaking frame uh is terrifying to me, and it was still terrifying even though I was expecting it. But I think like you said, Ryan, there was a little bit of silliness that I didn't pick up on the first time, but I still was I was still frightened in this movie. Like, not as obviously not as bad as the first time, but it definitely left a little like let me pull my curtain back a little bit in the shower kind of vibes.

SPEAKER_00 10:19

That sounds so dirty. See, here's the thing though, I didn't mind the comedy because it felt look, okay, I'm not a person who can have pineapple on pizza, but I respect that people like sweet and savory together on for some reason pizza. This movie felt like a better balance of that. It's you got you got some chuckles in to diffuse the tension because the tension is super thick up until that point. So I actually really enjoyed that element of it. I think the biggest thing about this movie is the way it carves its own identity. This feels good as a spooky spirit movie. I know I gave Oculus shit because a dad moves his family into a house, and surprise, surprise, the house or an artifact within it of his choosing was haunted. But what I appreciate most about this movie though is that yeah, a family does move into a new house, but that's totally irrelevant to what's actually going on, and it does something different with its haunting.

SPEAKER_02 11:11

Yeah, I think I give it originality points. It's like one of those things, it's hard to look at it now because of how much we've had of this, but it definitely does something new. I I don't necessarily know if I love what it does, but it does it originally.

SPEAKER_01 11:26

Yeah, it's definitely an original story to me. You're just especially you're dropped in and you get the story later, so which I appreciate. I don't need this whole backstory on how they got there. And yeah, Chris, it is like a it's a haunted house movie, but one, they didn't get dropped in the haunted house. But you know what? It's it's crazy because I always mix up this franchise with the conjuring all the time, which is understandable. They're kind of essentially in the same universe, but yeah, and I I get you know paranormal activity vibes, obviously poltergeist vibes, but it essentially to me sits on its own, especially with its like scares that it has too.

SPEAKER_00 12:01

Yeah, you know why you confuse it with the conjuring?

SPEAKER_01 12:03

Because James Wan also made that?

SPEAKER_00 12:04

The thing is, he muddies the water, so he does this, and then he does the conjuring, and he's like taking all the lessons learned from Insidious and taking it to the conjuring, which, yeah, dope, that makes sense. Then he's like, Wow, I sure have learned a lot on the conjuring. I'm gonna put all that to work in Insidious 2. And then it's just like a bounce back and forth between franchises, and they have very similar identities because of it.

SPEAKER_02 12:26

I feel fortunate that I don't pay attention to directors and producers and writers and things like that, so I never get lost in this web that you appear to be lost in.

SPEAKER_00 12:34

Well, here's the thing though. I think a lot of people can say, especially like after the conjuring, all the ghost movies feel exactly the same. And they do because they're all by James Wan. Yeah, that's true. In a way. Either directing or producing. So it has his style on it. Even like Annabelle Creation. Very pretty movie, very hollow shell. The same old stuff, just with new cinematography. A hollow shell, like a doll. But looking at this movie specifically and the way it ends, I don't think it's bad overall in theory. I feel like a lot of ghost movies, it just I think paranormal activity is the one for me that felt really, really good and felt really, really different for the time. This movie isn't bad, and though and the way it wraps up isn't bad on paper. It makes sense, but I'm disappointed in how the editing reveals how everything happens. It's very apparent and very obvious as you're going through those final moments, and it kind of ruins for me the shock of of one of the kills in the movie.

SPEAKER_02 13:32

But see, isn't it kind of like the whole movie they they lay out on a platter for you? They they make you a charcuterie board of explanations. That's the whole thing. So I'm not surprised when we get to the end and we get that. So for me, it didn't kill it for me.

SPEAKER_01 13:46

I'm interested to hear about this, Chris, because I like the ending. I didn't really see that coming, and I thought the twist was fun, and I think the ending should have been explored a little bit more. Like I feel like there could have been a little bit more cat and mouse towards the end, and they could have done a little bit more with that, but that's the only like con I have for that part. It's not that we saw it coming or anything like that.

SPEAKER_02 14:08

That's not what we're trying to say. It's just the way they kind of like lay it out. Like they give you a recipe.

SPEAKER_01 14:15

Well, they have to be very paranormal. So like the anything is possible. So okay.

SPEAKER_00 14:22

Am I good with a recipe? Absolutely. My thing is they treat the final moments like, oh my god, what is just happening here? It's so shocking. But the editing of the movie in those last moments make it very obvious. So you're like, oh damn, this is happening right now. Wow, this is really about how it's about to go down. Mm-hmm. Yeah, I agree with that. But look, we're gonna explore that further, but um after our spoiler break. But before we get there, we have to score this movie. And before we can score the movie, Alexis, what's the body count?

SPEAKER_01 14:55

Well, everyone, the body count is one. But yes, a lonely soul did perish in this movie. Just a single one.

SPEAKER_02 15:05

But was the soul an animal soul? No, we didn't lose an animal soul. We had we had chill vibes again this week. It's so nice. I'm just soaking up all the moments I can have of clean animal reports because boy, it didn't start this way, and I'm sure I'm gonna go down a dark path again.

SPEAKER_00 15:20

Yeah, we'll try to hold off for as long as possible. But hey, you do see a good boy in this movie, and that boy happens to show up in a photograph, and it's apparently James Wan's dog. Oh, I love that for him. All right, well, let's go ahead and get into our scoring then. Insidious. Is it a hack or a slash?

SPEAKER_01 15:37

This movie is definitely a slash for me. Visually, it's stunning. Um, I just love the way these dep in this movie. Um, the jump scares you have aren't typical, oh, open the closet. There it is. You know, it's very like catches you off guard. And I appreciate that. And I don't think it's something that, you know, at that time people were used to. It's just like a different flavor you get this time around. The first time you watch it the second time, even if you know the twist, it's amazing. And I wish I would have watched number two and three in uh the final skeleton cave, whichever the last one's called.

SPEAKER_00 16:11

Oh, yeah, it's when Kate Hudson joins the Insidious franchise.

SPEAKER_01 16:14

Oh, there you go. Okay, I mixed the two. Okay, I I figured I did. It seemed a little plausible right there.

SPEAKER_02 16:20

Alexis, you know, you're not wrong about a lot of these things. I'm gonna be straightforward here and I'll give this a slash. It's not like the hardest slash, you know, maybe not like a full decapitation, but it's a little slash. Um, there's a specific reason for me that this movie is a slash and not a hack, and it is because of the way it's shot. So there's a feeling that you get when you see a scene in a movie where someone is standing in their bathroom sink and they open their medicine cabinet and the camera's in the mirror, and then they close the medicine cabinet and you're like expecting something to be back there, right? That that feeling, they manage to take that feeling and apply it to an entire film where every single shot here feels like there's a chance that someone's gonna like jump out of a corner. And so it keeps you super, super tense, even just little silly things like someone's hand as they're reaching into like a drawer. Like you're so worried about what's about to happen the whole entire time, and it makes it so good. It's it's what keeps you like into this kind of goofy story that's laid out ahead of you, and like, you know, you really, you really just gotta like go down the paranormal path of darkness. You gotta go into the further to be down with the story because it's you know, that's just how it is. Like, you know, you know me, I don't think ghosts are real, so it it's it's a long walk. The way they keep the tension in this through literally what feels like every single frame of the movie, it's just so good. I can't take anything away from it. This is not everyone's cup of tea. You know if you like these types of movies or if you don't, and there's no reason for me to say, like, this one will be the one you love. It won't. If you don't like it, you're not gonna be down for it. But uh I have a hard time saying anything too bad about Insidious. It's like the pinnacle of this genre of movie in my head, and I think on a lot of people's heads.

SPEAKER_00 18:08

So that's my slash for Insidious. I can respect that, Ryan. I think when I examine this movie, it has to come from a place of acknowledging that I'm not a big fan of supernatural horror. I'm also admittedly not a huge fan of James Wan. I feel like when it comes to his movies, he starts off strong and then it balloons into some cash cow that just continues long past it when it should have stopped, like the Curse of La Jorona, for instance. Now, this movie though was a fresh entry to the supernatural spooks, and it stands up well today for me, so it's a slash. For me, it was the exorcism of Emily Rose from 2005, Paranormal Activity from 2007, Insidious that hit theaters in 2011, and the conjuring in 2013 that had a strong hold on the supernatural reign. And then after that, things started to get absurdly redundant for me. But look, we're not talking about that redundant stuff though, we're talking about Insidious, which has just earned a universal slash on Ladies' Night. Now you can find this movie streaming on Amazon as of the time of this recording. Check it out, then join us in the second half so we can dig a little further. I'll see you in a bit.

SPEAKER_01 19:16

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SPEAKER_00 19:55

Welcome back, folks. You are now entering the spoiler zone for Insidious, which, surprise, surprise, is our new universal slash. We have a lot to unpack here, but before we get into the specifics of our ratings, we have the matter of gore to attend to, and I can't say that without laughing to myself. Alexis, what's the gore score for this movie?

SPEAKER_01 20:13

Yeah, I'm sure you can't help but laugh at it, because there's freaking none. I mean, even the parts that I could have shown shown gore, they didn't. I don't know, there's a part when you know he's going through the house and the girl has the gun. Would have liked to seen someone's head blown off, but it's okay. No, just a little dot on their stomachs. Yeah. Just just uh use your imagination in this movie when it comes to gore because it's very low, non existent in this movie for sure.

SPEAKER_00 20:38

Wait, was there even a bruise on the neck after he strangles her?

SPEAKER_01 20:41

No, there was like there wasn't literally, I think she just died from like terror. Like Lyn Shea definitely died from that. Or like it honestly looks like she's died for being cold. She's like so gray.

SPEAKER_00 20:53

And it's just so weird because he was like going at her, right? You'd think there'd be something like bloodshot eyes, bruising on the neck, but literally nothing.

SPEAKER_01 21:02

Yeah, nothing. And then there's when the kid is like Dalton's like throwing people against the wall and shit. No. It's all in darkness. With that said, and we only have one death. I mean, this movie is filled with so many jump scares, and it's not even these like cheap jump scares that you see like jumping out of closets, like I mentioned before. Like, it's just like very good ones where you're not expecting it. And I and that's what I one of the things I love about this movie and why I gave it a slash. So I'm just interested to see like what kind of jump scares really got you guys.

SPEAKER_02 21:30

Mine's like super, I don't know, cliche probably, but it is the first Darth Maul scene with where we get, you know, Red Rocket face behind Josh. It's always stood out to me. And of course, you know, I feel like it's the memorable scene from this movie. It is for sure. And yeah, I know for a fact it got me the first time I saw this movie. Like next level jump scare, you know? Yeah. And it's just so good. I had I that has to be mine.

SPEAKER_00 21:58

And here's why that scene worked. It's because in horror you end up matching the speeds of a scare like you match comedy and pizza three, right? Everything runs in threes. In this movie, you have I count them shots of Josh specifically. One, two, three, four, five, six, flashback to the past, seven, eight, nine, and then on the tenth time that you see him, Darth Maul, in your face. And it's still like I was expecting to see that and laugh at it, and I still didn't.

SPEAKER_01 22:30

That's so interesting. That's probably why it really got me, because it's so memorable. And that's what I was like referencing um before the spoiler break was that scene, it like very much reminds me of the Devil's Advocate scene. I'd have to see that movie like fairly recently to like recall exactly what it was, but it was like some demon and it was a similar, very like similar shot. And I was like, oh my gosh, it's so terrifying because you're not expecting it. Mine definitely was a baby monitor scene for sure. One, how are you about to hear some shit on your baby monitor and still stay downstairs just saying? Literally never. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 23:02

I mean, I I guess if you're if you're talking it up to interference, I know that is common. Like, especially I guess if your neighbors have a baby monitor.

SPEAKER_01 23:10

Understandable. I guess that in today's day and age, yes. And probably when they're living in Cal looks like California, then yeah. But then you have um long-haired demon guy who looks like the Undertaker um behind like the crib, and it was just so shocking because I was not expecting to see that like at all. And it was it was definitely a jump scare for me.

SPEAKER_00 23:29

That time when you see him there, because so there's a baby monitor scene, he she doesn't see anything, she's just like freaked out. For me, my favorite moment of this whole movie in terms of like this jump scares was when she walks into that room after that shit's going down downstairs. First off, Josh's scoping the place, the door is just it f it's flung open, right? After he races up there to see that there's no demon in there. And the front door is open in the background. You're expecting something to happen there. It's probably not a hall, but there's like a darkness to his uh to the left of the frame. You expect something to happen there, and it reminds me of the strangers from 2008 when uh Liv Tyler is in the kitchen and then the stranger just walks in the back completely unnoticed, and that moment of chaos, the alarm going off, the mother upstairs, the fiend behind the curtain, nowhere to be found now, that was like the pinnacle of fear in this movie for me.

SPEAKER_02 24:26

Yeah, I agree. And those things, like those spaces in the frame for something to jump out that are constantly there, that's what like got me in this movie. Because all the time, that whole time, I'm like, man, that front door is open. Things are gonna happen, and nothing happens with the front door, it's just there to be creepy and stress me out.

SPEAKER_01 24:45

So, my favorite part, I know we've talked about this, and you know, there's no gore in this. And people will be mistaken because um Dalton has this part where he's got this bloody handprint on the bed that is coming from, you know, your red rocket killer, also known red face demons. And if you Google that, there's a plenty of images. It's like so it's like a classic, like super popular, like search, and that's what comes up for you. But in all actuality, yes, there is lipstick used on this demon's face, and what you see on the bed is not blood, it's lipstick. That is so funny. I never would have expected that.

SPEAKER_00 25:24

Homie's just out here trying to express himself.

SPEAKER_01 25:26

Exactly. I would like to know what he uses because it stays on pretty well.

SPEAKER_00 25:30

I didn't know if it was a stain, a cream, you know, like Well, you were saying how you need to do more red lip like Milamendez.

SPEAKER_01 25:38

There we go, there we go. I just knew the right shade. He had it was a little like a blue undertone instead. It gave me like Mac Ruby-woo vibes, you know, that's the classic right. So the film's musician and composer, um Joseph Bashera, who is playing the demon in this movie, also plays um the crazy, like demonic witch in the conjuring too.

SPEAKER_00 26:01

Oh.

SPEAKER_01 26:01

As well. So yeah, not the conjuring too, but just the conjuring.

SPEAKER_00 26:05

All the conjuring This Galantine's Day, find you a man who can do it all. Exactly.

SPEAKER_01 26:11

So it's really interesting because James Wan, you know, took interest in like protecting his characters, especially underaged. So Ty Simpkins, who played Dalton, he actually had him sit in the room while Bashar was putting on his makeup just so that he could get used to it and show that, you know, this is clearly all fictitious, which I thought was really cool. You know, he's caring about the kids and not giving them nightmares at night.

SPEAKER_02 26:36

Yeah, not like uh what's what is it, the exorcist that is likely responsible for several people's deaths, uh, deaths and or miserable lives. Kurt films, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:46

After filming, yeah. We don't want to be that, right? Exactly. Take care of your casting crew. Yes. And that is the gore you know.

SPEAKER_00 26:54

It's ironic that on the night that Mac is not here, we end up talking about makeup.

SPEAKER_02 26:59

That is very true. Poor Mac, he's really missing out.

SPEAKER_00 27:02

He is, he really is. Yes. But talking about your boy, the demon, the cinematography in this movie is stunning. I know, Ryan, you were mentioning that earlier, but there's specifically one shot that is just peak cinematography for me with the way they're moving the camera. Specifically, when Josh is in the further, he's there with Dalton, Dalton's tied up, and then all of a sudden, you have the camera twisting and turning and pulling out from the speaker in time with Tiny Tim singing, whoa, like in tiptoe to the tulips. And the demon is sharpening his claws, just there vibing, you know what I mean? Just like listening to this dope music on this nice record player. Uh, and he's just there with his little like monocle, like magnifying his claws so he can sharpen them. He seems like he's got a pretty sweet deal set up there.

SPEAKER_02 27:50

Dude, why would you want to leave that, man? He's got everything he needs there, and that song is ironed into my brain. I briefly forgot that I, you know, had it in my brain before, and then as soon as it played, I was like, oh god. I'm like getting in my car today, humming it, and I was like, oh no, no, no, no, no. I don't like.

SPEAKER_00 28:08

I actually listen to that song very often, apart from this movie.

SPEAKER_02 28:11

Oh, please never out loud near me. Because it gives me the creeps. It did exactly what they were going for.

SPEAKER_01 28:17

I've mentioned that I really like, you know, the quality of this film and just the like vividness that it takes. Um, and it's crazy because even in like the first scene, I'm watching it, and it kind of, you know, no one can see this right now, but it kind of looks like Chris's uh screen that we're seeing right now, lots of black and white, and then the reds popping. It's like very like all of the vivid colors were popping out, like reds and um like some yellows, which I really liked.

SPEAKER_00 28:42

It's called me having a shitty webcam, but they did it on purpose for millions of dollars.

SPEAKER_01 28:47

They paid a lot of people to work on that. My specific scene that I really liked. So Josh is facing the mirror, and the old witch lady that was like haunting him is on the other side of the mirror, and then the camera's spinning, and like they're just in this abyss, and I just love that scene because it kind of reminded me of Candyman for some reason. You know, Candyman like goes through like the mirror, like oh, or that scene, it's it's crazy, and I love that. I just love that scene visually, it was crazy.

SPEAKER_02 29:16

Ooh, that's such a good one, and I don't disagree. There's honestly, it's hard to like nail down one visual element in this movie that's really good, but mine actually ties into my favorite scene as well, and it's also what Chris mentioned. So, my favorite visual is walking through the door, the red door, uh, after after Josh kicks the bouncer's butt. Um the demon bouncer butt. I don't know. So he goes through the really cool red door, of course, and then it's like this hallway with like the candles on the sides, and it was just like so spoopy and so creepy, and I loved it. Um, and then and then of course he goes in and that room and that I don't know, would do we call it a dungeon? It was kind of like a it was like an evil castle.

SPEAKER_00 30:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 30:03

He was really in there like a like a castle prince just like doing his thing.

SPEAKER_00 30:08

I have a confession.

SPEAKER_02 30:09

Oh god.

SPEAKER_00 30:10

First off, he had a vibe going on with all those candles. He was trying to set some kind of mood. Secondly, don't do this. That room looks like so many rooms I've built in The Sims. I cared more about like buying the most expensive like hobbies and craft items, so I didn't really care what the what the basement area looked like. So I just get a basement full of random shit that you wouldn't want to see in the rest of the house. But it definitely had candelopers and red walls and red floors. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 30:37

That was awesome.

SPEAKER_02 30:38

You know, I'm not actually surprised. James Wan knows me running. But yeah, like that is that scene, and there is a level of goofiness to it, right? Like when you get a shot of him looking through the monocle and his eyeball is like magnified, and like you know, what's really going on here? I don't know, but but I like the whimsy of that, and it is my favorite scene of the movie, and also what I think is the the best visual element. Although there are many throughout.

SPEAKER_00 31:06

Yeah, I gotta say though, when it comes to this demon, I did not need to see him so up close. I prefer the quick flashes. I think the jump scare behind Josh's head is the most I wanted to see him. But then there's the part where they're leaving the further, and like you just see his Cheshire Cat eyes, and I'm like, you're ruining it the more you show me.

SPEAKER_01 31:26

Yeah, it's like I agree. I love the mystery behind him.

SPEAKER_02 31:29

I didn't need to see his tongue. That's what it was for me. Oh yeah. Yeah. A little too much. Didn't need that. Thank you so much. Not into it, keep that in the further. Maybe he wants to go further. Keep that in the further, like I said. Yikes.

SPEAKER_00 31:43

I do also want to just point out, because this is a visual absurdity to me. Josh is a denier of all things Elise Elise is saying. And then he just happens to have these wild ass clues that Dalton himself has drawn. And not only did he draw it, he drew it months ago before his comatose state, and somebody unpacked them, and then someone pinned them to the wall, and yet no one thought, what's this weird shit that he was doing?

SPEAKER_02 32:08

Exactly. And then when he when Josh is in the further, he thinks back to, oh, oh yes, he told me exactly where it is, this red door. Wow, so impressive that all of a sudden he just knows exactly what to do.

SPEAKER_00 32:19

Yeah. Actually, look, I know later we're gonna talk about the worst parts of this movie. I gotta get it out of the way now because that is the worst part. James won trademark. You'd think it'd be Billy the puppet Easter eggs everywhere, but not only is it that, it's oh, you see this thing? We've shown you it before. Let's pause here, reflect on what we saw in the past, and then say, oh hey, isn't it convenient that you're seeing this now? Do you get it? I fucking hate it so much. It's so blatant.

SPEAKER_01 32:49

Oh my gosh. I I love the whole scene of like Josh going into the further and exploring his house in the further. You guys know, like, I freaking hate haunted houses, but everyone knows I'll watch a YouTube video going other people going through a haunted house, so because I love like the visual aspect of it and like the creativity, and I think that's what to me that this aesthetic like brought out. Um, so I just like ooh, look at these people and this and you know, this music and like these, you know, these just like vibes that I'm getting from this house, and I just like really enjoyed it. But I was able to not be in the house and be safe in my home. So I've I I appreciated that. But I did love that entire scene for sure.

SPEAKER_00 33:31

See, I appreciate the appreciation for the further, but I don't know that I could care less about the further. It was cool, right? It was cool looking, but for me, my favorite scene is probably an insignificant one in comparison to all the spooky stuff that you get. First off, Josh is an asshole. Second off, getting home late from work, Renee is sitting on the steps with the lipstick handprint on the bed sheet, she's calling him out on his bullshit, and then he says, I'm not avoiding stressful situations, I'm just dealing it with my own way. And then she says, Fine, deal with this, throws the sheet on his lap, and I'm like, at a girl Renee. Because I think it gives you this insight to how fed up she is, right? She's my favorite character in the movie, which we'll talk about in a bit, but also it is like the catalyst for Josh doing what no other horror movie dad has done before, and it's listen to his wife the first fucking time she says, I want out of here.

SPEAKER_02 34:26

Yeah, how nice to remove because boy, let me tell you, we I'm not moving into a house and then moving into a new house. Yeah, moving sucks. It sucks so much. I'll take the demons, it's cool.

SPEAKER_00 34:38

Yeah, it's like how do you even list that property, really?

SPEAKER_01 34:40

It smells funny.

SPEAKER_00 34:41

Smells like demons, yeah. I'm sure.

SPEAKER_01 34:44

Don't worry about the doors just opening and closing. It's really just like the summertime, like the house gets loose. It's breezy.

SPEAKER_00 34:51

Yeah, there's like a weird guy who hangs up in the curtains, but aside from that, it's great. Other than that, we'll knock off a couple thousand for you. He's not there all the time. This is a great Zillow ad. Like, yeah, it's awesome that Josh is finally like, okay, yeah, I'll I'll listen to you. Let's not forget that he gaslighted her up until this point. Renee was so vastly more emotionally intelligent than he was. And I love the added depth that we get to her without even having to beat you over the head with it, right? It's a subtle thing like self-healing through music. And you can tell that there are things that she wants to do, uh, even with the tone of how she's playing her music. She starts saying, I'm gonna be somebody, I just can't be her today. My life, you know, is on pause, got some kids, gonna do some things eventually. She has this like optimism and resilience, and then as things start to unfold with Dalton, she just is utterly exhausted. And it's it's different because she was exhausted in the beginning. She's tired of Josh not telling her like not being able to take the kids to school. Like you can see and feel the burden on her, even though she's not the core focus in the movie, and I love that.

SPEAKER_02 35:58

I agree. You can definitely feel the burden grow throughout this movie with her. But I do have to say, like, the characters in this movie don't wow me. I don't hate them, but I it's just all kind of like, I don't know, a lot of the like beginning family scenes. I was just like, nah, okay. I mean, I I would say she that she is the best, but there's a lot of like the little goofiness, especially when we bring in the the Ghostbusters, those characters and like all the different interactions that they have throughout the contact, the way that they interact and all the stuff. And I don't know. I don't love the characters here, but I don't hate them, and I think that's probably just me. I just like me.

SPEAKER_01 36:37

That's so weird because I feel like completely the opposite. I feel like they have great characters in this and they fit each role. The dad was supposed to be a douche, he is a douche, he makes you dislike him. The mom, you feel for her, like you know, you you see all these people trying to help this family, and you have a little like comedic value with the Ghostbusters.

SPEAKER_02 36:56

I think for me it's the way everything is so set up. Like the mom is like, I know someone to call. And it's like, of course you know someone to call because obviously you've interacted with this woman and you had a reason to call her, like you know stay into two, chapter two and three, and then you know the whole freaking story. Yeah. Maybe I will, but I I don't know. I know it's just me being a little bit like harsh in a way, but I don't think, oh, the characters made me so excited.

SPEAKER_01 37:22

I don't know, uh Roseburn was so relatable when she was screaming on the phone in the beginning, like, let me speak, speak to an agent, speak to an agent. Like, ah, I would could so resonate with that so much. I was like, this is amazing.

SPEAKER_00 37:36

She's the unsung hero of the whole movie, and if I ever, ever, ever watch any of the other movies, it's only because I want to see what happens to her. And that's it. Her and Dalton and Foster, the kids are cute too, that's fine. But my main issues with Josh, who is a coward, just stays at work late. Like, okay, you have this thing that happens. Your wife has seen someone in the house, your door flies open, things are spooky, and yet you think it's a good idea to stay late at work. Just because you're not out cheating doesn't mean that it's okay. You're being absent. Also, he's an idiot, at least clearly said, Be quiet, keep one foot in this realm. They can't know you're not one of them. If they figure it out, they're gonna try to take over your body. And yet, where's my son? Have you seen my son? What are you doing, man? You think those guys in there are just going around asking someone for their son like they're asking for directions to the nearest McDonald's?

SPEAKER_02 38:31

Also, can I just say, uh, outside of like the further and everything, if you just walk into a place with people that you don't know and say, Where's my son? Not a very lucrative thing. You know, like exactly. They don't know where your son is. They're not gonna help you at all. You need to be like, Where is this person? He's this tall, he looks like this.

SPEAKER_00 38:50

Yeah. It's it's unproductive. And I know I was talking earlier about the ending, which I think, you know, I I said earlier, James Juan reminding us of things we've already seen is the worst part. This is an addendum to the worst part. It's the way the ending is cut so that you can clearly see the camera moving to Josh's body and looking for that vessel, while Josh is clearly communicating with his other like fucking ghosty bitch. He's busy and occupied, and there's a soul looking for his body. So it makes it very obvious that when that soul finally gets there, it's not Josh.

SPEAKER_01 39:26

Oh, I didn't pick up on that.

SPEAKER_02 39:27

I think I think it's like I'm not thinking it's pr it was predictable, but like once it happens, you realize it. They didn't need to go through the whole scenes of when she comes in and starts like flashing back to him, you know, the hand being the ghost hand and like the picture and all that stuff.

SPEAKER_01 39:46

Like it wasn't necessary.

SPEAKER_02 39:48

It could have been more mysterious. That's what we were trying to say.

SPEAKER_01 39:51

So the worst part for me was hearing this fucking baby scream the entire time. Sorry, I'm a very like Alexis hates children. Yes, it was the sound in this was like the worst for me. It was like dead silent, and I was like, okay, am I deaf? Or like, and then it would be like super high, high pitch, baby screaming, you know, freaking alarms going off, like chaos. And I get it, it's supposed to build that suspense, build like all that, which it did. I was just like, I think it was just a baby constantly screaming, just like ugh. I'm on board with that.

SPEAKER_02 40:25

It it is miserable. We always hate that in a movie, right? We're always like, the sound is so annoying. It is the horror of it all.

SPEAKER_01 40:32

Like, but I know typically, you know, if we gave it a slash, we would just talk about the worst part. But um, I really want to mention the best part I had, which was um, who knew that James Wan was plugging Saw the entire time in this movie?

SPEAKER_00 40:48

Who knew indeed?

SPEAKER_01 40:49

Yeah, I picked up on it and got so happy. First Easter egg, Billy the Puppet, when Josh was at school, he has a chalkboard behind him, and there literally is a drawing of Billy the Puppet from Saw. And also James Wan is on the detention list, which I thought was very interesting too. I didn't catch that at the first go, but I did read upon that. If I made movies, I would do stuff like that all day. Yeah. So your Ghostbuster dudes, uh, Ryan, did you know that he was a writer for this movie and for the Saw ones? So he played in this, and he also played Adam in OG Saw.

SPEAKER_02 41:27

There's a lot of overlap happening.

SPEAKER_01 41:29

I'm not surprised. Oh, I loved it. Oh, and I got one more for you. Our long-haired demon was um in Saw 3. He was the guy who remember he had to pull himself out of the chains in Saw 3. Oh, yeah. Yeah, that was him. And pull on the lip. Lee Wynn L, you're freaking amazing. I love your Easter eggs, James Wan. Just keep going with it. It's uh it's truly a pleasure to find these little eggs. Yeah, we do love Easter eggs.

SPEAKER_02 41:52

That's always something that stands out for us here on the podcast. We're always big fans of that. I will say, this movie and how we've talked about it makes me very interested in watching the rest of this insidious franchise. However, I don't know if I'm like running to watch this one again. Maybe I'll do another uh 10-year hiatus from it. I don't know. But it's not bad. I wouldn't be mad if someone turned it on. But you know me, I'm not really trying to watch it again.

SPEAKER_01 42:14

I think I'd watch this if I was like watching um in uh order like I do with the Saw franchise, so I'd definitely do it. I'd have to restart it from the beginning. So, but it's not a movie I necessarily like, you know what? I'm gonna put this shit on tonight. Like, it's definitely not a movie like that for me. It's also a little long.

SPEAKER_00 42:32

Yeah, it's it's a big boy. Although, Alexis, this would be easier for you to watch in the Saw franchise since there's far fewer.

SPEAKER_01 42:39

Yes, I've no I don't think I've ever made it fully through the Saw franchise. I get through s almost six most of the time, but then I'm like, okay, I've seen one in two like fifty freaking times.

SPEAKER_00 42:50

And then another one pops up, and then you gotta add that one to the back of the list. Then you start having nightmares.

SPEAKER_01 42:55

That's what it is. It's a little too much gore for a month. Who knew I'd say that?

SPEAKER_00 43:00

I could definitely watch this again. I think because it was so good a second time around, I'm no longer hesitant or skeptical to give it another shake. I think there's a lot there to discover, and I do think I I'd watch it with someone who wanted a good entry point into horror without a lot of the gore, things like that. Now, in Max's absence, we're gonna forego fact or fiction because let's face it, it's a James Wan movie, and when it's a James Wan movie, you know Alexis comes with the facts and she's been littering them all over the place. You're welcome. The blessing, truly. But there you have it, folks. Insidious has earned a universal slash. And you know what? Maybe there's something in the water when there's just three of us. Because the last time we did this, it was Paris, Mac, and I, and we gave wrong turn a universal slash.

SPEAKER_01 43:46

It's the curse of the threes.

SPEAKER_00 43:48

Yeah. It's easier. Yeah. Comedy works in threes, and apparently our taste in films is a total joke when we do this. So it's fine. Now, look, while we've certainly had a robust discussion here about Insidious, remember that. The conversation doesn't end here by any means. This movie is both critically acclaimed and critically shamed, so we want to know what your take is on it, and we want to know what you think. Keep in mind there are a number of ways that you can reach out to us.

SPEAKER_01 44:12

You can visit our website, hackerslash.com, or find us on Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram.

SPEAKER_02 44:17

And if you're tired of little kids playing weird things on your record player, you can also reach out to our Hackerslash Hotline. You can leave us a voicemail at 757-606-0128, or visit hacker slash.com slash contact to send us an audio message. And if you miss Mac, you can also send us an email to feedback at hackerslash.com.

SPEAKER_00 44:34

And look, if you've enjoyed this episode and our journey together into the further, consider becoming one of our patrons. You can go visit patreon.com slash hacker slash for options to earn cool perks for as low as one dollar a month. But regardless, we'll see you next time, folks. And remember, friends don't let friends bring home stray friends while astral projecting. Bye.