SPEAKER_00 0:05

Let's whoop it's back.

SPEAKER_01 0:07

I don't want it.

SPEAKER_04 0:12

Greetings and salutations, and welcome to Hacker Slash. If you're joining us again, welcome back. Do you want to head someplace safer like my van? If this is your first time listening, welcome to the party. We are a horror movie review podcast dedicated to telling you whether a movie is a hack, a total joke, a waste of time, or a slash. Totally killer pun intended. We believe horror is for everyone, and as such, we're rating these movies with a perspective we've all gained from our varying walks of life and the flavors of fear we fancy most. My name is Chris, I'm your friendly neighborhood slasher enthusiast, and this week I'm joined by the gore lover Alexis. Hey everyone, the cowardly creeper Ryan. It's a rock show. This is my rock look. And the Scream Queen Paris.

SPEAKER_00 0:54

Where's it at, Monastat?

SPEAKER_04 0:56

This week we're checking out a 2009 film led, written, and directed by women. While initially received poorly at its release, it's developed a cult following over the years and applauded for its actual intended message. Now, before we get down to discussing exactly what that is, we have some follow-up.

SPEAKER_00 1:12

Let's get right to it. We recently reviewed the third installment of the Scream franchise, also known as Scream 3. And when I tell you that this is the most votes we've ever gotten in our poll, that's what happened here. I think I've said this before, but we've broken the record. 18% of our listeners and our poll voters gave this a hack. People are showing up. And 82% gave it a slash. So I remember when we recorded the episode, it was very like, this movie isn't well regarded, but it seems to have aged very well, at least amongst our fans.

SPEAKER_01 1:45

I'm glad people are here for Scream 3. I'm glad someone showed up. You know, we appreciate it.

SPEAKER_00 1:50

We have a comment from Daniel on Twitter who said, The only unforgivable sin of this movie is Creed.

SPEAKER_01 1:55

Yeah, Creed is always a sin, okay? It's always bad. And leave it up to Scream 3 to just let it run rampant.

SPEAKER_04 2:03

I'm just saying I have fond memories of Creed in the mid to late 90s and very early 2000s. Not that I ever listened to it, but it was certainly music of my childhood.

SPEAKER_00 2:13

We have a comment from Darren, one of our patrons, who said, Scream 3 is a slash in my opinion. It's often seen as a disappointment or even unfairly labeled as a bad film. The problem is the first two Scream films are horror classics, so Scream 3 never stood a chance of getting a fair shake when it was released. Plus, we have to bear in mind that when it came out, the meta horror genre was played out. I struggled to get anyone to go and see Scream 3 with me, whereas three years earlier, everyone wanted to see Scream 2. Also, if you haven't seen Scream 4, you really should. It's my second favorite of the franchise behind the original Scream.

SPEAKER_01 2:43

I would have gone with you, Darren. Yeah, I'm on board with that. I think there's a point to be made there about how the meta thing is really getting worn out when Scream 3 comes through.

SPEAKER_00 2:51

That's fair. We have another comment from Rob who said, This show is becoming maddening. Scream 3 is the definition of a hack. What is happening?

SPEAKER_01 2:59

Rob, you're so right. And I'm just assuming this comes from a place of love. Because you've been with us for a long time. Don't betray us now. We're here to hold it down. I I'm here. I'm here to hack things.

SPEAKER_04 3:10

This is our thing with Rob. We just dance in circles around each other, sometimes agreeing and meeting in the middle, and sometimes just on polar opposite ends of the spectrum.

SPEAKER_00 3:18

I think we're slowly driving Rob to madness.

SPEAKER_04 3:22

We're just doing a really nice waltz with him.

SPEAKER_00 3:24

And then finally, I wanted to read a comment from one of our patrons, Freya. We mentioned Freya has a ranking of the gayest Scream movies. Freya said, You guys, I'm so happy this was a universal slash. I think three was the gayest one in my original ranking, but I see why Max says it would be the first one, because Stu and Billy are definitely gay, and they seem modeled after the gay serial killers Leopold and Loeb. But four is also obscenely fruity and obscenely overlooked. Lighting a candle for my Hayden Penitier Scream 5 summon circle right now. I think this one, because of all the camp and satire, seems the absolute gayest. Parker Posey being such a ham is just marvelous. The way she jumps into Patrick Dempsey's arms kills me every time. Now the two Gales would be a fantastic Halloween costume. Would Mac in Paris do the honors? But who would be which Gale?

SPEAKER_04 4:08

I love this comment. You're amazing, Craya. Obviously, you'd be Parker Posey.

SPEAKER_00 4:13

Oh my god, how dare you? I am the OG Gale.

SPEAKER_04 4:16

Mac doesn't possess the campy chops to pull off Parker Posey, though. So you gotta, you know, play to your strengths here. Also, you're the younger, hotter gale, obviously.

SPEAKER_00 4:24

Okay. You know what? Flattery will get you all everywhere. I'll do it. I'll play the Parker Posey Gale. And that is our follow-up.

SPEAKER_04 4:31

Well, nine years after we got two Gales and Sidney Prescott encountered Ghostface for the third time, Megan Fox starred in a film written by Diablo Cody, who was following up on her Academy Award-winning success with Juno. While Cody originally sought to tell a feminist tale of a female empowerment and the relationships that exist between best friends, the film ultimately suffered from skewed marketing. Test greetings were aimed at two groups, fans of Cody's work Juno, and then, on the other side, 18 to 24-year-old men. The film was torn to shreds by test audiences, with the former group noting a lack of desire to see something so different from Juno, and the latter group wanting to see more of Megan Fox's body. Marketing for the film continued to miss the point, with executives ignoring Cody's vision of the film and instead focusing on hypersexualizing Fox and leveraging her status as a sex symbol. While the film was considered a commercial failure upon its release, it's found new life in the wake of the Me Too movement. And of course, there's also been renewed desire to apologize to Megan Fox for the treatment she received after speaking out on inequities and working conditions in Hollywood. Now this film follows a tandem of best friends as they navigate the complications of one being possessed by a demon and the other one trying to stop her. This week we're talking about Jennifer's body. Who's seen this one before?

SPEAKER_01 5:43

This movie took me on a ride because if you asked me if I saw Jennifer's body, I'd say absolutely. And I think it took three-quarters of the movie before there was one single scene that I recognized. And then at the end I was like, okay, I definitely have seen at least some of this. But God help me if I know if I actually saw the whole thing.

SPEAKER_02 6:01

I am the total opposite. I didn't think I saw this movie at all. And once I started watching it, came to realize that I had seen it, but it wasn't as familiar. So I'm not sure at what point I watched it. I don't recall ever watching it still, but I know everything felt familiar, especially Colin in this film. He felt familiar and him in this role as well.

SPEAKER_00 6:24

So I have absolutely seen this movie before. I actually went to see it in theaters, and that is because at the time, and actually to this day, I'll say it, I am a huge Panic at the Disco fan. And they wrote an original song for this movie, and that's how I found out about it, because I don't think I was the target demographic for this marketing. But I was like, oh, Panic at the Disco has a new song, and it's for this random movie called Jennifer's Body. Sure, I'll watch it. So I saw it in theaters and then may or may not have ended up purchasing the DVD.

SPEAKER_02 6:51

Paris, I definitely knew you had watched this before, but I really want to ask you a question from our birthday episode last year when you said my tit during that episode. Were you quoting this movie?

SPEAKER_00 7:04

Of course I was, Alexis. Of course I was.

SPEAKER_01 7:08

I heard that and I said, yes. I actually had a moment at the end of this movie and I was like, is this where this comes from? Or is this just a thing people say? But it definitely has to be from this, right?

SPEAKER_02 7:21

He definitely said it just like her. Yeah, I know. My tit.

SPEAKER_00 7:26

Oh, for sure. If you listen back, I'm always subversively quoting this movie.

SPEAKER_02 7:30

Oh gosh.

SPEAKER_04 7:31

Go find the Easter eggs. Yeah, I also saw this movie when it came out, surprisingly. This was actually one of the first few movies I saw in theaters in 2009, because this was coming off the wave of going to boot camp, going to A school, then getting assigned to my first ship, and then being out to sea all the time. And I remember taking myself on a date to see this movie in the fall of that year.

SPEAKER_01 7:53

Ooh.

SPEAKER_04 7:54

I have very fond memories of this first taste of freedom that I had. What was interesting to me is I thought I could tell you that I remembered every bit of this movie because I've seen it several times. But when this movie started, just like Ryan, I was like, what the fuck is this? I don't remember this. And then I realized I just didn't remember the opening because it didn't have Megan Fox in it.

SPEAKER_01 8:15

And that was the moment that I found out Chris really has a thing for Megan Fox. And I would say, not normally the girl that I would pin for you. What kind of girl would you pin for me?

SPEAKER_00 8:26

Blonde.

SPEAKER_01 8:26

I don't know, but she's so hot, I don't think it matters if she fits your type or not. Yeah. I think it's just like a general Megan Fox vibe that I wouldn't initially be like, oh, this is the this is the one. But listen, I'm not here to complain. Okay. I get it.

SPEAKER_04 8:40

Outside of that initial surprise though, I found myself really taking a different lens when looking at this movie again, like so long later. I think the last time I saw this movie was probably like 2014 or so. Needless to say, it's been a long time since I last saw this movie. So about seven years or so. And I found myself in equal parts surprised by some things I missed early on. But then also how many things were familiar once things get rolling right after that initial scene that we get with Needy. I found myself thinking, oh wow, yeah, this actually is way funnier than I remember. But then also, a lot of the languages that would not hold up if you tried to remake this movie now.

SPEAKER_02 9:23

I would totally agree. I had laugh out loud moments, but at the same time, some of this stuff just doesn't sit well. Obviously didn't laugh at this, but doesn't really work. Some jokes don't, but the overall atmosphere while watching that, while watching this was pretty, I don't know, kind of annoying. It was just like very valley girl every time Megan Fox was in the picture. I guess after some sort of things happened and she was more lively, but it was just that sort of valley girlness that wasn't my fave.

SPEAKER_01 9:54

That's interesting. I'm kind of surprised by that. I quite enjoyed I I don't know. I couldn't figure out if this was a movie from 2009 that was trying to be hyper 2000s or if it just is is actually that way, because sometimes, you know, a movie's trying to do a thing, right? But I felt very much like immersed in the 2000s. I felt the I felt the throwback of it all, and I enjoyed that. And I don't know, I I I didn't feel a lot of deep feelings about this movie, and I know that Chris is gonna go on a deep feelings tour, and I can't wait for her to share what she felt. I felt mostly like I was staring at a hot chick for a long time.

SPEAKER_00 10:35

And you were sad for all of them.

SPEAKER_01 10:38

Truly. A lot of lips, a lot of big juicy lips in this movie.

SPEAKER_04 10:41

I will say I did watch this movie with Ryan over FaceTime, and there were plenty of times where we made eye contact, which is hard to do over FaceTime, but yeah, I think we're on the same wavelength in some moments.

SPEAKER_00 10:52

But sensual nonetheless, yes, not uncomfortable eye contact. For me, it's actually been maybe four or five years since I've watched this movie. I started to watch it on the plane from a trip I took a couple weeks ago, but then like the Wi-Fi on the plane was shitty and I couldn't watch it on Hulu, so I was like, whatever, I'll wait for the pod. And there are some things that I will say, having some distance from the movie, they don't quite hold up. There's a specific moment of violence in the very beginning that I was like, ooh, yeah, I don't like that. And I don't know that I ever felt anything about it before. It was just kind of like whatever, but now I'm like, ooh, yeah, that part, no, cut that out. Like Ryan was saying, it's definitely a really thorough and authentic tour of the late 2000s as far as like the fashion, the music, the language that we used to use in high school, the words we used to say that we definitely wouldn't say anymore because now we have more sensitivity and awareness and we're more conscientious. We've evolved since then. But overall, this movie to me feels like a comfort movie. It feels like a a warm hug of a movie because it kind of overlaps like a mean girl's energy with like a dark-sided murder energy, and you know who I am, and you know that's what I like.

SPEAKER_04 12:03

If ever there was a brand for a movie for Paris, that would be it. Mean girls and dark side murder.

SPEAKER_00 12:09

Truly.

SPEAKER_04 12:10

Tell you what though, there are a number of things that surprise me looking at the distance from this movie, just like you said, Paris. Having seen interviews with Megan Fox post this high point in her career right before everything that came out in the wake of you know her confrontation about Michael Bay and hearing what she sounds like and her thoughtfulness about, you know, not only her presence in the world right now, but the way the world operates and you know how she navigates motherhood and things like that. She's so different from Jennifer in this movie. And I think the stereotypes that she was painted out to be in the early 2000s that we all just kind of took the bait and fell for because we didn't know any better. And that made for a really interesting experience to really take in how nuanced her performance is in this movie, and it really just reframes that whole experience. The other thing I was really surprised about was how many other fucking people were in this movie. I forgot about J.K. Simmons, I forgot about Chris Pratt. It was a wild time watching this.

SPEAKER_00 13:14

Don't forget about Amy Sederis, who I also always forget is in this movie.

SPEAKER_02 13:18

Yeah, absolutely. Anytime she's in anything. Chris, you alluded to this and spoke about it in the intro, but I wasn't expecting and was surprised and slightly disappointed all at the same time on how much you know this play on, I guess, Megan Fox was and the relationship that her character has with Needy. Like I wasn't expecting that. And to me, not having any experience in that sort of environment didn't it feel it felt a little fake. It felt like it was a guy's depiction of what this sort of relationship would be like in 2000s, from like you mentioned, an 18 to 24-year-old man.

SPEAKER_01 14:01

So I I think that that's really funny you mentioned that because I felt the same way as I watched this movie. I spent a lot of time thinking, wow, what gross men make made this movie? And obviously I realize gross men didn't make this movie, but just because gross men didn't doesn't mean it doesn't have the same energy. Because it does, it just has exploit hot chick energy. And not to say that that's wrong, I guess. I think that there was something that was trying to be done, and again, Chris is gonna take us down this path. We're all buckling up right now. But but I will have to be honest about what it feels like when you're just watching a movie, because uh normal people don't do the research that we do for a podcast. And by we, I mean Chris. True. So when you're watching this, there is like a level of like, this just seems like what some guy thought, oh, we'll get you know, some hot girl to do this in this movie.

SPEAKER_02 14:54

It's awkward, but it wasn't an awkward that they were feeling it was awkward because I knew that that probably is not how it would have played out.

SPEAKER_01 15:02

Yeah. No, see, I will say, I don't think that scene stands out for me as that, but I can understand where it comes from.

SPEAKER_02 15:09

Oh, I'm just talking about in general, the whole idea. Yeah, even in the beginning when she was talking about it, I'm like, huh?

SPEAKER_01 15:16

Yeah, it's interesting.

SPEAKER_00 15:17

I totally feel where you're coming from. I've always felt like this movie was if a gay man wrote lesbian fanfiction.

SPEAKER_01 15:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 15:24

So it's surprising to learn that this was written by a woman, and furthermore, Diablo Cody of all people, who I'm slowly realizing I'm a fan of.

SPEAKER_04 15:32

It's really interesting though, because looking at the way she frames this story and hearing about like even just her inspiration, right? Like she wrote this based on some of the female friendships she had early on. And it's really cool to look at. Okay, so first, prior to any research, prior to any knowledge of what she was trying to do, this didn't feel male gazy to me in terms of like the dynamic between Jennifer and Needy, because I've been in those positions of being so close to someone and having this really intense connection that's borderline romantic, but also isn't at the same time. So that never felt in any way disingenuous to me because there's also a lot of these things that you'll see as we'll get into the second half of the episode of moments, glances, touches, exchanges of words, and then just like the whole point of what is or isn't done to certain characters that it really for for me always felt like a love story between two people that didn't just go in a very romantic way, and obviously one of those a fucking demon, right? But then post-research, right, and and hearing about Diablo Cody's experience writing this film and what her intentions were, it makes so much sense for them to have the dynamic that they did. And when you look at the way a lot of these moments are cut between them and the way they interact with the men with the world, and then the way they interact with each other, it's really poetic and really beautiful.

SPEAKER_01 16:58

I would just like to note that my feelings about the male gaze of this movie are not in relation to Needy and Jennifer and their relationship, it's just Jennifer in in and of herself in this movie. So if that matters at all, because I agree with you in regards to their relationship, I do think it feels genuine for me. With that being said, my surprise in this movie was actually how vicious and violent it is. And I wasn't expecting the level of things that happen here. I wasn't the kills are intense, the the types of kills that we get, the types of interactions that we get are intense. I wasn't ready for any of it. I for some reason remembered like some soft version of like Jennifer's Body in my head, and I think I relate it to a Lindsay Lohan movie. Is there a Lindsay Lohan horror movie?

SPEAKER_00 17:43

Confessions of a Fienage Teenage Drama Queen she was in, but also Lindsay Lohan was in I Know Who Killed.

SPEAKER_01 17:49

That's what I that's what I aligned this movie with in my head, and they are so different.

SPEAKER_00 17:53

Okay, but kind of similar because a character knows who killed them in this.

SPEAKER_01 17:58

Same, same, but different. I don't know why they're aligned in my head, and it's dumb, but I think that is a much softer movie in in terms of the violence that occurs compared to this. But you know what didn't surprise me? It's how unscared you were by this. That's right. A hundred percent. I felt no fear except for the fear of cleaning my floors a lot, like people in this movie.

SPEAKER_00 18:20

I mean, right before that scene, Ryan, is what I consider to be a fairly suspenseful scene with Amanda Seyfried and like a little bit of like a home invasion element. And that I think is done well to the point where I've seen it a bunch of times, but I'm still always a little bit tense. But that's really the peak of the fear factor for this movie, because after that there's really nothing to be afraid of.

SPEAKER_02 18:41

Yeah, when she closes the refrigerator, I'm expecting a jump scare, and I don't get it, and then I'm like, I'm gonna get another one, but I don't get that either. So I'm glad that they don't base this movie if it is meant to be frightful, on jump scares, but I think it's more the visuals that might be frightening.

SPEAKER_01 18:58

Yeah, there are some tense moments, that's for sure.

SPEAKER_04 19:01

I mean, this movie is a horror comedy, and it was originally intended to be more of like a straight-up horror movie, but Diablo Cody tends to make things pretty funny as she's writing naturally. So there's a lot more of that dark comedy that's woven in through this whole thing. So it's less about trying to scare you and more about leveraging other tools within horror to tell a story, right? A about a woman finding her power and and really, you know, exacting revenge.

SPEAKER_01 19:28

This movie is a horror comedy as much as I am a comedian, which is that I'm not a comedian, but I am sometimes really funny. That was that's what this movie is. This movie is not a comedy, but it is sometimes funny.

SPEAKER_04 19:40

For as unscary as it is, it does have a lot of parallels with some other horror movies. And I think what's really cool about this one in particular is that despite its similarities to ginger snaps, despite its similarities to The Lost Boys, and despite its numerous inspirations, right? We've seen succubus in films before. It's not a new concept. But the application of this and the lens through which Jennifer is viewed in this movie, not just as you know, Megan Fox being insanely attractive, but really looking at the dynamic between her and Needy and looking at Needy's journey throughout this movie, that is different, and that is singular, and that is why this movie is experiencing the renaissance that it is.

SPEAKER_00 20:24

So, Chris, to your point, I feel like this movie is very original. However, I have never seen Ginger Snaps, nor The Lost Boys, and now I may, I may consider them more than ever before.

SPEAKER_04 20:36

Ginger Snaps is way more up your alley than The Lost Boys. The Lost Boys is like if you're in the if you're feeling like vampires one day, check it out. But Ginger Snaps is very on brand for you.

SPEAKER_00 20:46

Definitely noted, I appreciate that. But for me, this movie really strikes a balance between the two genres, which is like high school comedy drama, like teen girl coming of age energy, but also like revenge horror, and I can't think of anything that does it in the same way that this does.

SPEAKER_02 21:08

Yeah, this movie had a lot of things that were familiar to me, but somehow when it was crafted and pulled together, it was still original in my opinion.

SPEAKER_01 21:18

Yeah, I have mixed mixed feelings about this being original. I think one thing that I really enjoyed is the turn that it takes with the plot of the story and why things are happening, because it's not necessarily what you would expect going into a you know sacrifice type of situation. So I think it's like 50-50 for me with originality. It's got some it's not 100%, you know, the only time we've seen a movie, of course, with these kind of things happening.

SPEAKER_04 21:46

But was the ending satisfying to you?

SPEAKER_01 21:48

Oh yes. Yeah, it felt good for me. I think it was what we wanted, and uh also makes you feel like positive about the story, which is weird.

SPEAKER_00 21:58

Totally. We definitely get the thing that we Want and the thing that we need to feel satisfied as viewers. And there's so many things in the ending, like scenes, bits of dialogue that I just love so much.

SPEAKER_04 22:08

So here's the thing for me. On paper, I don't dislike this ending at all. I don't know if I'm fond of exactly where it where it ends. Now, the post-credit scene, well, not post-credits, the during the credits scene is great. I'm a big fan of that. But what I don't think I like is the bits right before that. I'm just I think always I I've never really been a huge Amanda Seyfried fan. She's okay. She was great in Mean Girls, really enjoyed her there. But she's not a bad actress, don't get me wrong. She's great at her job. I just don't like her. And so when we experience her out of the context of her dynamic with other characters on screen, and we're just existing with her in a singular moment, I could kind of take it or leave it. You know what I mean? Like it's it's it's whatever for me.

SPEAKER_01 23:00

Chris is really just here for Megan Fox.

SPEAKER_04 23:03

That's it. I'm here for the two of them together.

SPEAKER_01 23:06

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_04 23:06

Not necessarily like one more than the other, because a lot of the time Jennifer's dialogue drives me up a fucking wall when it's not outstanding. Most of the time it's not. But I really just like their relationship and their dynamic together.

SPEAKER_01 23:21

Sure.

SPEAKER_04 23:21

I have a lot of feelings, and I I can tell that you all have some feelings as well. We'll see how those feelings end up shaking out. But before we get to the actual ratings, Alexis, how many people died in this movie?

SPEAKER_02 23:32

There was some carnage in this movie, especially during a certain part that up the body count a lot. But when we're talking about physical bodies you see in this movie, there is 11. Not bad. And what about the animal report?

SPEAKER_01 23:45

Yeah, we actually have like a plethora of animals in this movie. But they're all safe and happy little beans, so it's all good.

SPEAKER_04 23:53

Well, let's move right along then to our ratings. Jennifer's body from 2009. Was it a hack or slash?

SPEAKER_02 24:00

I feel like I'm standing here and I still don't know what I'm gonna score it. Which to me means it's not that bad to hack it. I don't know if I necessarily would watch this again, but I thought it was entertaining for the time. When I look back, I don't think it was a total joke or a waste of time. And that's really all I have to say about it. So I'm giving this a slash, a normal slash, basic slash, basic slash, no add-ons.

SPEAKER_01 24:26

You know what's really funny, Alexis, is actually when Chris started saying before we get to our ratings, I was like, oh, wait a minute, I have to rate this movie. And I had not considered for even a second if it was a hack or a slash. And I watched this like 24 hours ago. I've had time, I've been thinking about it. I talked about it with somebody earlier. So I also am in a very similar situation where I have no idea how I feel because I don't feel strongly one way or another. I wouldn't say I'm a fanatic for this movie. I don't love it. I don't feel passionately about it. I do feel some things about what comes off as the male gaze for me, but at the same time, I also was gazing at Megan Fox the whole time. So can I get mad about the feeling of a movie that gives me like, you know what I mean? It's something I enjoyed, even though it's maybe not like ideal. So I don't know. I I think I also go slash question mark period dot dot dot, you know, like a a chill slash.

SPEAKER_04 25:30

Question mark period dot dot dot is uh how a lot of women summed up their feelings about experimenting.

SPEAKER_00 25:38

The bicurious energy of that that slash.

SPEAKER_01 25:41

It is. That's exactly what it is, Paris.

SPEAKER_00 25:44

This is incredible.

SPEAKER_01 25:45

Everything is uncertain. This this movie makes you feel uncertain. There's a lot of feelings. This movie does some things, does some things really well. It is creepy, it is enjoyable as a horror movie. I don't obsess over it, but I would like to experiment with a slash.

SPEAKER_00 26:02

I love Ryan and Alexis that you were able to find things that you did enjoy about this movie. Ryan, you said you didn't obsess over it. That's fine. I'll obsess over it enough for the both of us.

SPEAKER_01 26:12

Okay. I thought you were about to go the other way, and I was like, there's no way.

SPEAKER_00 26:16

No, this this is a movie that I would have written had I had the wherewithal and the capacity and the means and the confidence to do so. This is for me one of my top like ten movies of all time, horror or not. It's like I said, a combination of the two things I love most, which is like bitchy teen girl high school bullshit with like girl killing boys, mostly for pleasure and also to like look better. Like, ugh. And it also straddles the line of like being deceptively superficial with like a surprising amount of depth. And that's something I picked up on watching it this time. Like, it's been a while since I last watched it, and I think every time before this, I really just enjoyed like the superficial, like dumb bitch essence of it because there's so many like great one-liners, so much great like 2000s lingo, the style, all of that, Megan Fox, Amanda Seyfried. But this time around, I really got more of the like the true feminism and not like the feminism I thought I understood in the 2000s. But now that I've learned the production behind this movie, which is something I went into uh after watching this this time, I was like, you know what, let me do some research. And to hear like how female produced and this came from like a female mind makes me feel so much better about this because I can see it now with a new eye, and that just shows me that like this is exactly what I wanted it to be all along, and for all of the right reasons. So, for that, this is probably my slashiest slash of all time. I'm so glad we did this movie. Find this movie, it is worth watching. It is something that I think somehow has aged better over time. I loved it at first, but maybe not for the best reasons, and now I love it even more for all of the best reasons.

SPEAKER_04 27:54

So, this is a female-led written and directed film that was critically panned, a commercial failure when it came out in 2009. And ten years later, in 2019, we also got another female-led, written, and directed movie called Black Christmas. And you know, there's just this theme of feminist films being put out there and then being ahead of their time. And it's not until with a lot of time and distance that people tend to come around to them. I enjoyed this movie when I first saw it, but because I saw a lot of myself in some of these characters, and not necessarily because I could wrap my head around the depth that the story was telling all along. And I'm a big fan of this movie. It's really funny in some spots, it's beautiful in so many other spots. Like there's a split diopter shot in this, and it doesn't get too heavy-handed with that. The cinematography is stunning, it's star-studded without being overwhelming, and you don't get like desensitized by how many people are crammed in this movie. And beyond that, this is just a master class in looking at the dynamic between two friends and how tense that relationship can be, while still feeling compared, like you said, surface level in some ways. It can be deceptive in that way. So it gets pretty heavy hitting without beating you over the head with it, and you can still walk away from it feeling light, like you had a good time. But then it gives you a little bit of something more to chew on. So for that, this movie gets a slash, and I'm gonna be honest, I did not expect this tonight. But Jennifer's body is under universal slash.

SPEAKER_00 29:42

I didn't expect it either, Chris. I texted you beforehand. I was like, at best, three slashes, at worst, two.

SPEAKER_04 29:49

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 29:50

And I'm so proud.

SPEAKER_04 29:51

Well, with that universal slash, listeners, it sounds like you should check out this movie. You can find the streaming online, you can find it available for rent or purchase. But either way, check it out. Then join us in the second half so we can learn more about this story together. See you in a bit.

SPEAKER_02 30:11

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SPEAKER_04 30:50

Welcome back, folks. You are now entering the spoiler zone for Jennifer's Body, which has honestly, shockingly, earned a universal slash. And we have a lot to get to here, but before we get into the specifics of why we enjoyed this movie enough to slash it, we have the matter of gore to get to.

SPEAKER_02 31:04

Alexis, what's the gore score for this film? The gore is pretty surprising in this movie as well. The gore score on this is medium. And I know you guys are like, what the hell? I think this is a lot of gore, but I don't know. No, I think it's medium though. I I agree with medium.

SPEAKER_00 31:18

Yeah, I agree. The gore is high quality, but not high quantity.

SPEAKER_02 31:22

Yes. It I feel like it's jam-packed kind of in certain kills and in certain situations and aftermaths, but even a lot of deaths you don't even see the carnage until afterwards, or you hear about it.

SPEAKER_04 31:35

I think the shadows we get of the deaths and the quick flashes of the aftermath, honestly, are what make it feel even gorier to me.

SPEAKER_02 31:46

Like it leaves more to the imagination. Oh, yeah, I would totally agree with that. Behind that screen when she's pulling Colin apart, whew, feeling bad for him. You know, he was just trying to be nice to everyone. He's a fuckboy.

SPEAKER_01 31:58

Nah, I take that back, actually. I mean, he seemed nice, but you know.

SPEAKER_02 32:04

Intentions. I feel just as bad for him as everybody else. So with 11 deaths, and there was that carnage in the beginning, which I was referencing, and they say about 12 or 13 people died in that portion. But out of the deaths you do see, what's your guys' favorite?

SPEAKER_00 32:21

I have to say it goes to Colin. I don't think this has always been my favorite kill because it's the one you don't really get to see. But now that I'm older and more mature, it's the silhouette that really does it the most for me. Seeing Jennifer just absolutely devour his innards through that screen, and seeing her like very like mud flap girl silhouette, like flip her hair back, and like you see the blood spray, and it's very like carnal, it's very sexy. It's just like such a hot kill. And then afterwards, you see her like scooping up blood in her hands, almost like it's water, and just like sipping it out of his body. That was just like so hot to me. Also, like the teeth and the profile, it was just like very like visually beautiful to watch.

SPEAKER_04 33:10

So I'm gonna go with the different one as a backup, but that was actually my favorite kill, and it wasn't just everything that you described, but it was the added duality of Jennifer and Needy in different ways ravaging these guys, but then also Needy's scene with Chip is hilarious because he's so fucking oblivious and she's experiencing this horrific thing and just goes to point out how dense teenage boys are. But the I the intention there, right, is to show that they're two sides of the same coin and that they're so connected to each other, and they don't actually belong with these men, right? That that they're messing around with. But my runner-up is actually gonna be Chip, not because I think he had a special death, and I don't even really care about the emotional thing he has with Needy there in that moment. I was just ready for him to go because I he was like the fake, pretentious, nice guy that you're supposed to be rooting for, but he's also just a jerk. Honestly, when she calls him and she's concerned about her best friend being in a van with these strangers, he's like, Who cares about her? He's just an asshole the whole time. He's an asshole.

SPEAKER_02 34:21

Maybe this is for another part of the podcast later on. I don't know. I felt like it was I I don't know. I don't think Amanda's portrayal of Needy during that time was very like, oh my gosh, this happened. Like all this sort of stuff happened. Like, I want I needed more emotion in it, but we'll save that for another time. What about your favorite killer, Ryan?

SPEAKER_01 34:44

Well, I have to go for Jonas because he was the first one that we get, even though we don't really get to see the kill, it's the first time we figure out what Jennifer is out here doing. Okay, because things get crazy. And for me, it's like the little animals around and everything are just so interesting because this is a part of the movie where I couldn't remember what was happening. I was in it deep thinking, like, I swear I've seen this, but I don't remember anything. So the animals like circling around and you know, they're just waiting for their turn, basically. It's so creepy. And then, of course, most importantly, the shot that we get when they find his body and he's just like wide open in the woods. Ugh, it's so disgusting. And it's the first time we see how far she takes it with these kills.

SPEAKER_04 35:31

Ooh. It hit me this watching it this time around again with the animals there. I'm like, look at how very snow white this is, right? Like, look at how very fairy tale this is, but in a really dark way. It's so snow white.

SPEAKER_02 35:42

They're still celebrating and rallying around her. Yeah. I got all the vibes, especially this was Snow White with long hair. Very pale, dark hair. Yeah, ruby red lips. Exactly. We just needed the dress. Well, my favorite death, everyone said them all. Pretty much. I do appreciate the low shoulder members' kills during the credits. That was pretty cool. I like Vengeance. Y'all know that after our teeth episode, so it's not shocking that I love that they're dead. I wish I saw more of it, but Chris, I do like Chips Death for the fact that you actually get to see this look on Jennifer, her transformation, which I don't feel like you've gotten the full picture of up until now. So when she turns, I wasn't expecting all those teeth. And to me, that was so graphic.

SPEAKER_00 36:33

I also love when we got to see those teeth with the Jonas kill because she's also like a little bit topless and just like approaching him in the woods. And in any other circumstance, the boy would be like, oh fuck yeah. But in this circumstance, it was just like his undoing. And I love that.

SPEAKER_01 36:47

Yeah, it was awesome. And Alexis, you're right, it does take all the way until the very last kill with Chip before we get to see the entirety of Jennifer's form.

SPEAKER_02 36:56

I know, I wish you got more of that because I think the visuals are add to the gore in this movie. So I want to talk about maybe an iconic scene in this movie, maybe not, maybe just the grossest one.

SPEAKER_00 37:08

They're all iconic.

SPEAKER_02 37:10

In Paris' library of movie context, this is reference highly.

SPEAKER_00 37:16

This is in my library of Congress.

SPEAKER_02 37:18

The scenes that you see with Jennifer vomiting, that is actually Hershey's chocolate syrup that was used, along with some CGI animation. Oh my gosh. Yeah. So specifically the first vomit scene where Jennifer has arrived at Needy's house after being murdered and inhabited by the demon. Fox said the liquid that she was given is spit out, yes, was actually Hershey's chocolate syrup. And you know what? She wasn't loving it. You know, not because she was actually spitting it out in this scene. And she didn't want to be advertising this sort of Hershey Kisses scene.

SPEAKER_01 37:58

I feel like a mouthful of chocolate for any amount of time would be disgusting. So I think the thing about movies and what I always think about having things in your mouth and having to, you know, take vomit or something is no matter what you put in my mouth, if I have to just sit there with it for any amount of time and pretend to throw it up and I don't eat it, it's gonna be gross.

SPEAKER_04 38:18

Okay, but the Hershey syrup, did you guys ever have magic shell on your ice cream? Oh yes, I did. You said Hershey syrup, and all I could think of with like little spiky bits in the vomit is just that being magic shell, pointy magic shell shards in Hershey syrup.

SPEAKER_02 38:35

Oh my god. It did sometimes hurt my mouth, but it was my favorite topping. My parents always got the Reese one for me, and I love that.

SPEAKER_00 38:42

Oh yeah. Honestly, like if your parents got that, then it was like a good week.

SPEAKER_02 38:46

It was good. You knew your parents, I got paid, I feel like, when they got the Hershey Shell syrup.

SPEAKER_00 38:52

That was a total splurge.

SPEAKER_02 38:54

We never had ice cream in our house.

SPEAKER_00 38:56

Oh, interesting.

SPEAKER_02 38:57

That's unpecked. I don't think you're missing out on a lot, but what ended up happening is the effects team ended up rigging these clamps to the with tubes that come through the back, and she would just chomp down on this piece that would be on the side, and it would just projectile anything that was put in, any sort of liquid, which obviously was revised in the pool scene. So, what you see in the pool scene is actually this mechanism that was created for that.

SPEAKER_01 39:24

Nice. I I I appreciate that. Engineer something. Please don't make me have Hershey's syrup in my mouth for a long time.

SPEAKER_04 39:33

Look, I'm gonna be honest here. I'm with Ryan. My gag reflex is so bad you put anything in my mouth and I'm throwing up.

SPEAKER_01 39:40

So since we're talking about some of the effects with Megan Fox, I have a few things because this movie does something different than what we see in most movies that came around its time or even soon before, which is actually focus on practical effects rather than just using CGI. So they made it a point to make very specific requests of the effects companies that they had working on this film. They had particular appreciation for effects from older movies and were like basically, hey, does it really help to use all the CGI? Or should we go for practical effects and then add a little bit on top to make things feel a little bit more finished? So that's what you get in this movie. I think the practical effects for me don't stand out as practical effects, like, oh my gosh, these are some old school techniques they're using, but at the same time, it doesn't stand out as horrific CGI as well, which I think is pretty cool. And then one of the other things that I found to be super interesting is that as they were changing Megan Fox's face, they found that anything they did would kind of ruin the allure of her beauty. And I know that sounds kind of crazy, but basically, if they did any warping of like reshaping her cheekbones or anything like that, they said the magic was lost basically. And, you know, it's just those little details in life that make you feel better about yourself, just knowing that any little change could make you or break you as Megan Fox, or you know, just make you like one of the rest of us. And then lastly, we were talking about at the end where you finally get to see Jennifer's like final form and more you get to see more of her like mouth and everything like that. So the way they had to do that because of the labor that it took to work the mechanism of the jaw that they had built for her, they would basically have Megan Fox act it out and they would record it to see kind of how she would be if it was her. And then because it took so long, they would hire someone else to sit in for her, put them in the the appliance that is the mouth, basically, and it would take like 10 days to shoot shots of that jaw. And from what I can tell, it seems like that's part of why we only get a little bit of it all the way until the end, because it took so much labor just to get shots of that gigantic, disgusting jaw.

SPEAKER_03 41:50

Oh wow.

SPEAKER_04 41:50

Honestly, it may it may have been convenient, and that maybe maybe that's why we have so little of it, but I love that it doesn't come across as, oh, this was too hard. It comes across as like really controlled restraint, and I love that.

SPEAKER_01 42:02

I totally agree. I think here with the horror of Jennifer, they did something that, like, for instance, when we just watched Basket Case, something they did horribly, which is you don't put your monster on screen all the time. Your monster has to have some some mystery about them.

SPEAKER_02 42:19

Yeah, he had some mystery in the beginning, but after that, he it was it was a loose canon.

SPEAKER_01 42:24

Yeah, once we saw rubber thumb with arms, we were like, cool, nobody cares. And then, you know, contrast that with something like this movie where you just get a little bit of Jennifer and then it's just creepy every single time. Leaves everyone wanting more, doesn't it?

SPEAKER_00 42:37

Less is gore.

SPEAKER_01 42:38

Yes. So with that being said, I think it's easy enough to say my favorite visual element for this movie is Jennifer and most importantly her creepy teeth.

SPEAKER_04 42:49

Ooh, it's funny because I was gonna say Jennifer and her tongue. Of course you are, because you are into this. Oh my gosh. Look at that lighter burning her tongue and then it just healing on its own.

SPEAKER_00 43:01

One of the most iconic shots from this movie.

SPEAKER_04 43:03

Yeah. Okay, but there are many more things to appreciate, specifically the lighting in this film, the way they give away so much with just shadows. Even you know, thinking about that shot with Needy on the phone with Chip, and then we see Jennifer's shadow in the background when Needy's over on the right hand side of the frame. Beautiful little moments like that. It brings a suspense and the horror of this film when it isn't just Jennifer's monstrous face, beautifully monstrous face that the horror of her not locking the door when she opened it.

SPEAKER_02 43:37

I was like, this is cringy. So true. My favorite visual also has to do with Jennifer, surprisingly enough. I liked her at her worst, essentially, when she's covered in blood, even sometimes when she hasn't fed in a while, and she's talking, my hair, I'm breaking out, because everyone can relate to that, and it just Brought this familiarity kind of not to the bloodiness, but like, I'm like, okay, she is a human person, this not so perfect person.

SPEAKER_01 44:09

Okay, but also run down Jennifer, still a dime. Literally frustrating how beautiful she is when she's just like, Oh my god, I feel like trash.

SPEAKER_04 44:18

I'm like, okay, I wish. That's me on a good day, girl. Yep. Genuinely stunning. Also, I would say you picked out a stellar visual because I would say that's also when Megan Fox is at her peak performance. I think so too.

SPEAKER_00 44:32

And I totally agree. I feel like Jennifer goes through a visual journey, several ups and downs in this movie. I'm thinking of the shot where she's really starving for boys before the dance, and you see her in the mirror, just like applying liquid foundation with her hands, with just like the most listless, dead look in her eyes. And to me, like the juxtaposition of like trying to like cake on beauty while feeling so not beautiful is just like ugh a really compelling visual for me.

SPEAKER_04 45:02

God, you're so art house.

SPEAKER_00 45:04

I know, you know me.

SPEAKER_04 45:05

Smears it on with her pictures of herself on her desk.

SPEAKER_00 45:08

Also, just like putting liquid foundation on with your hands. Ladies, get a beauty blender, do yourselves a favor.

SPEAKER_02 45:12

So true. Even a brush, really. Yeah, I was gonna say a brush works.

SPEAKER_00 45:16

Anything. I I was like two Thanksgivings ago that I saw my very best friend applying liquid foundation with her hands, and I said, Girl, what? We're we're grown now. What?

SPEAKER_01 45:26

But really, in this movie, because it's 2009, what it should have been is the little sponge that comes in like the compact. That's what you should have used. Cringe.

SPEAKER_00 45:35

That shit a little round one.

SPEAKER_01 45:37

Oh, and the face should have been orange. But you know, we were going for beauty, not authenticity.

SPEAKER_00 45:41

But as far as authenticity goes, shout out to the fashions in this movie. It was so accurate to what we wore back then: the boys, the girls, the emo boys, the emo girls. Yes. Except when it came to Nady's spring fling.

SPEAKER_02 45:57

Yes. Prom, whatever it is. Oh, you mean her quintenera?

SPEAKER_00 46:02

Yeah, her look was giving very like modern-day John Bonet, and it didn't make a lot of sense. But I was like, you know what? I'm not mad at it because it still looks good when you're running through the woods at night in this look.

SPEAKER_01 46:12

I think I saw it as like mom not necessarily as in touch with her in life and therefore not caring about what she's wearing. Like I grew up as a kid with a mom who didn't care about fashion in any sense. And so if I picked that dress, my mom wasn't gonna be around to say no and and say this isn't the look. And I felt that in Needy's life, right? Like she was missing that influence of her mom caring about things in that way.

SPEAKER_04 46:37

See, I love the various interpretations of this because I can see that and respect the hell out of it. And then I also feel like these moments of looking at like the parallels between Needy's dress and Jennifer's dress, it's just this like whole dive into Innocence Lost and the way she transforms visually throughout the whole movie. It's just wild to see. And then, like, Dan talking about her mom, let's not forget that moment in the beginning when her mom's saying, One day you're gonna call come crying for me, I'm not gonna be here. Then literally she goes crying for her mom, and her mom isn't there later in the movie, and it feels just like that, all wrapped up in one dress.

SPEAKER_02 47:16

So, my favorite scene involves Needy, and it's when she's doing all this research to find out exactly what's going on with Jennifer, and then the twist that happens is hey, this is actually what happens when you don't sacrifice a virgin, which I love to play on that. So that was my favorite scene, like figuring all that out.

SPEAKER_04 47:42

You know, it's really funny that you say that. One of the ways that this movie has received a lot of criticism is by saying that this is Twilight for Boys, and that wasn't supposed to be a compliment ever. And I was like, No, I don't fucking get it. That doesn't make sense. And then you just said the research of what Jennifer is, and like, oh fuck, it really is Twilight for Boys.

SPEAKER_00 48:01

Oh, okay, I see that. I don't see the rest of it, but I do see that. I also love just the quote our library has an occult section. She's like, Yeah, but it's small.

SPEAKER_01 48:11

The best part is she says, I've been through the library's occult section five times, and then immediately remarks about how tiny it is. And we're like, Okay, so you didn't do that much work, let's be honest. There's three books.

SPEAKER_00 48:22

So the yeah, the three books we saw in the montage, that was it.

SPEAKER_01 48:24

Yes. And also, since we're speaking of books, I just have to bring this up because these moments are kind of close back to back where she's researching, and then also when we have these scenes of like what actually happens in the van. And in both scenes, there are books that just say the most obvious things. Like in the van, they basically have a book that says what to do when you're in an occult. Everything is just like witches.

SPEAKER_00 48:50

Spells for dummies.

SPEAKER_01 48:51

Exactly. It's so silly. Like the names of the books and the way they're like each there's a camera view in the van of like three different books, and they just they're just so obviously placed and titled, and I was like, Oh god, I can't deal with the comedy of this. With that being said, on a completely unrelated note, my favorite scene is the fire. Oh, interesting. In that moment, during that fire, things escalated so fast, and I was so unprepared. I was like, cool, we're gonna have like a slow start. Once again, I couldn't remember any of this movie, so I'm just thinking we're gonna hang around for a while, get to know Jennifer a little bit, get to know her horrible habits. I don't know. But this one went quick. This is this is a fast start for a 2009 movie, I feel like. Sometimes we just hang around with characters for a bit. And then people are just on fire all of a sudden. And I was unprepared, but also thoroughly thrilled by it.

SPEAKER_04 49:45

Yeah, things for sure escalated very quickly in that scene. And it's borderline terrifying, borderline hilarious just seeing everybody react to that, then seeing how Nikolai is responding after that. Like, I'm in survival mode, I really want to get to a familiar place, and I feel like that's my van right now. Yeah. And he's just like really trying to pry them over, and it's so obvious what he's doing, but it sells as fucking hilarious to me.

SPEAKER_01 50:11

Yeah, it's so not funny, but it is funny. And then the intense fire followed by that intense stuff happening is just a lot at once. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_04 50:20

My favorite scene has very little comedy in it, and it takes place later that same evening as your scene, and that's Jennifer's sacrifice.

SPEAKER_03 50:28

Oh wow.

SPEAKER_04 50:29

And it is both funny in some ways because of the focus on finding a ritual from the internet, but 99.9% not funny at all, and completely traumatic and harrowing, and really, really, really emotional. And what I think is really interesting about this is not just how heartbreaking it is when you see this in the movie, because you see Jennifer at this point, she's a decent person, right? She's a friend, she has people who love her, she has people that she cares about, she's trying to spin any lie she can to get away. She's been abducted, she's there against her will, she's being tortured. She hasn't consented to any of this. But then you look at, you know, again, experiencing this later in life, realizing the way that Megan Fox was portraying Jennifer in this moment, and she said the energy that she was giving was how she was feeling at this point in her career, where the movie industry was bleeding her dry, making her do things that she didn't want to do because she couldn't be taken seriously. And to see that exhaustion and that pain come through in that performance is really devastating.

SPEAKER_01 51:35

Yeah, it was very intense, and I really wanted a moment of relief where before she was stabbed, she just yelled, but I'm not a virgin. And it didn't happen. And I I honestly, it would have made me so happy to have that because that intensity is felt and it's not okay. Like it's not a good scene, it doesn't leave you feeling good.

SPEAKER_02 51:55

Yeah, I had the same feels during that, especially you do get the comedy, and I'm hearing you out, Chris. There, you know, there's this back and forth between the whole online picking a ritual to do, but then it's like, what band do we want to be?

SPEAKER_00 52:10

Like Maroon 5.

SPEAKER_02 52:13

And then it's just I feel so bad. And with the screaming, and then Adam Brody's character who's saying, What's your name again? when they were trying to recite. I was like, wow, this is it just I felt so bad for her.

SPEAKER_04 52:26

Yeah, it is an awful scene, but it's also one of the most powerful in the mo in the whole movie, and it really just goes to show that's what the intent is of this movie, right? Is to show how often women are bound to the wills of men in that industry. And this isn't okay. This is what you see Megan Fox for, and this is like her just knowing like the pain that she had to channel in that performance is just traumatic. And I don't know, it it breaks my heart that she has something so relevant to bring into that moment.

SPEAKER_00 52:59

Yeah, Chris, I think I watched that same interview because hearing that I was like, oh, that makes way too much sense. That really paints that scene differently for me. As far as favorite scenes go, it's really hard for me to choose one in this movie, so I'm gonna be that dumb bitch and I'm gonna pick two, but they're both related. So the first scene where Jennifer and Needy make out for the first time, or at least the first time that we see, it's like so artfully shot, and it's like this super tight shot on just their lips and their tongues, and you can kind of see them like gently like coaxing each other and kind of like exploring. And every time I see that scene, I wonder if like I'm also a lesbian.

SPEAKER_01 53:34

Technically, yes.

SPEAKER_00 53:35

And it also sort of speaks to this psychic connection that they have together, which I've always found really interesting, and it comes to a head in the final scene where Needy kills Jennifer, and that I think has to be my favorite scene because one, we get so many great lines of dialogue, like, do you always buy your weapons at Home Depot? God, you're butch. And she's like, Do you know what this is for? It's for cutting boxes. You have this like final climactic moment between them, and you see like the the apex of their relationship, and then Needy tears Jennifer's best friends forever necklace, which like the iconic 2000s BFF necklace, we all had one, and for some reason I always remember the way they shot the slow motion of it landing on the ground because it like does this like really like interesting like spiral. I don't know if you all noticed this.

SPEAKER_03 54:19

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_00 54:20

I did, but it's always like been a very like impactful visual for me, and then just like the way Jennifer's dying words are uh my tit with like that little bit of vocal fry, just like mmm gets me every time. To me, it's like a stellar performance for Megan Fox from top to bottom.

SPEAKER_04 54:36

Yeah, and then Cody Diablo was talking about in writing that scene, it's again the whole point of the movie, and again, looking at every everybody sees this movie and thinks, oh, this movie's how hot Megan Fox is, and she's saying, Yeah, everybody, you know, may uh Megan Fox as Jennifer is saying, My tit, and everybody's looking at my tits, but then Amanda Seyfried is there to point out, No, your heart. And the whole story is supposed to be pointing out Jennifer's heart.

SPEAKER_00 55:04

That part. Really, though, I feel like all of those scenes were just really great showcases for some incredible characters that we had in this movie.

SPEAKER_04 55:12

100%. This movie is so rich, and even the ones that I don't really care about, the ones who are just more in the background, I think their performances shine through and and them being played exactly as they should have been. The one I didn't really care for was Colin. Only because I saw this movie first, obviously, but then he's in the 2010 remake of A Nightmare on Elm Street, and I didn't really like Quentin in that movie. And then, Dead by Daylight, he has a hideous character, like his it's not even his face, really. He's just like this deformed monster of a man, and it has nothing to do with the actor himself, but that's all I could see. It's Quentin with eyeliner, and uh I I didn't like it.

SPEAKER_00 55:57

Wait, that's supposed to be him.

SPEAKER_04 55:58

I think you broke Kaparis. Yes, that is him.

SPEAKER_00 56:02

The horrible model for Quentin is supposed to be based off of that human-looking actor.

SPEAKER_04 56:06

Yes, exactly.

SPEAKER_00 56:07

Wow.

SPEAKER_04 56:08

Except in a nightmare on Elm Street, he looks way too sleepy the whole fucking time. He looks more normal in this movie.

SPEAKER_00 56:13

They beat him with the ugly stick for the game.

SPEAKER_04 56:15

Yeah. But one of the other things, and I'll shut up about this Diablo Cody interview, but she was talking about how she relates, in you know, in reality, she's more of a needy in life. She's less of a Jennifer. But she was also saying how she grew up and brought herself up in this way where she found herself like really shy, very needy for attention, and she created her alternate persona. Like she has her regular name, she made a more daring, more bold, alternate persona named Diablo Cody. And so these characters are the two sides of her, and that was a fucking mind-blowing realization. Like when you watch this movie back with that context, it's so fucking good.

SPEAKER_00 56:57

Because we all have a needy and we all have a Jennifer inside of us. That's true.

SPEAKER_02 57:01

Yeah, usually when I'm single, I'm more Jennifer, but either when I'm tired in general of life or I'm in a relationship, I'm more of a needy. No pun intended on that. I do agree with you, Chris. The characters had a lot of richness, even the supporting actors. Chip. I wouldn't say fave, but I did say fave. I just think he comes across with this innocence and cluelessness that I appreciate for a guy during the 2000s. I'm thinking of someone like that I dated back then. Yeah, I got reservations for the Cheesecake Factory, and you know, he's slightly jealous of Colin. And you know, I'm all for a guy who just admits he lasted four minutes. Jesus Christ. Take ownership. Okay.

SPEAKER_04 57:51

Hold on a second. I got a few notes here. One, you tell you say these guys are like this dumb in the early 2000s, but they're still this dumb. Be real for me. Very true. Very relatable. Two, he owns up to lasting four minutes. Okay, sure. But then he also has the nerve to ask her if he's too big. Like he's totally oblivious to the experience that she's actually having in bed with him, and he thinks it's just about how big his dick is. But he's nervous too. Then he's also not just jealous of Colin, he's also jealous of Jennifer. He's jealous of anyone else in her fucking life because he is a needy one here.

SPEAKER_01 58:26

To be fair, Jennifer did want his girlfriend. So like he sees Jennifer for what it is.

SPEAKER_04 58:35

There's something there. There's this isn't crazy. It may not it may not be crazy, but also he was fucking annoying the whole goddamn time.

SPEAKER_01 58:43

She didn't belong with him. For me, the thing about Chip that really I spent, again, an unnatural amount of time thinking about because sometimes I get fixed on things in movies, and that is me staring at his hair, remembering this hairstyle back in the day. Like when this was, I guess, a bit before Zach Efron, but like that Zacchaphron like swoop situation, and then I started thinking about like magazines and all these boys, all of the teen boys just had this swooping situation. And now, if I saw a man with that hair, I swear to God, it would be the laughing stock of my life if a man walked up to me with that hair, okay? But in this time, that was the thing, and it's funny because even in this movie, he's not perceived as like one of the hot characters, but it's so funny because he would have been in a different context.

SPEAKER_00 59:34

Honestly, Ryan, it's me. I'm teenage boys at this time. I absolutely had this hair. It was honestly, it got to a point where this was like the basic guy haircut.

SPEAKER_04 59:43

It was. It was also the basic lesbian haircut shortly thereafter.

SPEAKER_00 59:48

I will tell you this though. This hairstyle is absolutely coming back on some of like the younger teen kids. I've seen them like at the mall, and I'm like, ugh, the swoop is back.

SPEAKER_01 59:59

I don't want it.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:00

I can't say that I'm mad about it. I'm like, you know, it's still kind of cute. A little cute.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:05

I feel like long and curly is a thing with hair. Long and straight for boys is just it's a bit much.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:11

Well, long and straight, but flippy is ideal.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:14

I don't really feel much of anything about most of these characters. I don't hate them, but they're not exciting for me. I think Jennifer has a lot of character. As far as the rest of the students, Chip, eh, Colin, eh even needy at some points. I'm just like, okay, I'm very excited to see you get to your final form in the end of this movie, but I didn't care that much about things that were happening. And I think that just comes from a general, like, this movie didn't make me passionate kind of feeling. And with that being said, I gotta say, watching Chip have sex with somebody, doesn't matter who it was, Chip's side of that equation was truly the worst part of this movie. And I could have done without any of it, the condom conversation, the rubber band slap noise while they're looking under the covers together, the faces, the am I too big? It's all horrible.

SPEAKER_04 1:01:08

I could not possibly agree with you more. Could you imagine being in bed with someone and they say hopeless? That's never okay. Hopefully not.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:19

I I don't want to imagine that. But he's so oblivious and only focus on his own experience. To be fair, sometimes it's really hard to understand what people say in the moans of it all.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:30

That's true.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:31

And you can't say so.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:34

Been there, done that, do not do that.

SPEAKER_04 1:01:37

I will say, on a more serious note, I think one of the worst parts of the movie, I think really one of the most unfortunate parts of the movie is Ahmed's death. Oh. Because the kid just survived such a tragic, traumatic thing. He's in a country that he hasn't been in before, no one knows about him, and he just went through some shit. It wasn't even that he was giving in to the allure of Jennifer or objectifying her. He was just in the wrong place at the wrong time, and that was a bummer.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:08

Yes, and I would also like to say if she ate that night, why did the next day she need to go and eat Jonas? Like, we could have done without the Amet kill altogether.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:19

I don't think at that point she realized that she needed to feed to stay hot and healthy. She just had a lust for blood.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:25

Yeah, maybe you're right. A little horny.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:28

Yeah, absolutely horny. And that wasn't really explained in the best way. And for me, that actually comes as the worst part of the movie. Uh, so there is a scene that is deleted from this movie that was used heavily in the trailers, and it has some of my favorite quotes in it. And every time I watch this movie, I wait for this scene, and I'm like, oh fuck, I forgot it was a deleted scene. And it's a scene that makes the story make a little bit more sense because it sets up the scene where Needy explains to Chip, hey, she's gonna attack all the boys at this dance, it's gonna be like an all-you-can-eat buffet for her, because that part kind of comes out of nowhere, and I can see like there's always a little gap in my mind where I'm like, the story kind of takes a bit of a leap here, but the scene that they deleted is actually right before that, and it's Jennifer and Needy in the locker room. Needy's kind of confronting Jennifer, she's like, You're killing people? And Jennifer's like, No, I'm not killing people, I'm killing boys. And then she goes on to this like kind of little bit of a monologue about like how boys are disposable and how girls can play them as pawns and blah blah blah, and then explains like this dance is gonna be like a bloodbath for me. Like, I'm absolutely gonna kill at the next dance. And that's what tips Needy off is to be like, oh, okay, the dance is gonna be her next thing, we have to stop her. So that little like gap that they removed, and I'm not sure why they removed it, but I wish that that had been kept in the movie because it would make the story make more sense. And then you also get another great quote where Needy says, If you she says something to the effect of like, if you keep this up, I'm gonna finish you. And then Jennifer replies, You can't even finish gym class.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:57

I could see how that scene would help in the story, but also I was at a point where I was ready for this to wrap up. Like I needed a tight 120 here, and it was not a tight 120. So I I didn't need the rest. We for sure could have had that though instead of the chip sex scene.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:13

Oh, oh, yes, we could have. Yeah. Still could have had a tight 120.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:17

All right, hear me out. Worst part was the depiction of prom. It always is, or the spring fling, especially this outfit she had on. I thought it was more of an 80s sort of theme.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:27

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:28

I know there we've talked a lot about some other worst parts in this movie. And there's actually a couple more things that I have, but I want to go back to a compliment. I can't believe this escaped me. There is a stunning shot, and maybe no one else thinks this is stunning, but it's like Jonas's memorial.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:46

Ugh, in my notes.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:48

And it's a time lapse pushing in as the flowers wilt. Oh, so good. And it's just a little moment like that. A film that can feel at so at sometimes so silly, and then just remind you, oh no, this is a fucking quality production.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:03

Absolutely. In my mind, it's always like Jennifer's walking by the vigil, and that's what's like draining the life force from the flowers. But I don't know if that's actually true.

SPEAKER_04 1:05:12

It's good headcanon for sure. But I will say that it's moments like that, and moments like that home invasion bit with Needy. It's moments like the flicking the tongue with a lighter, it's moments like those that add such rewatch value to this because surprisingly, this movie visually stands out in a time when early 2000s movies didn't. Like this movie feel looks and feels dated because of the fashion and the language, but not with the quality of the cinematography in it. And I think that's a little surprising. Ooh, so true. I completely agree with that.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:44

I would surprisingly watch this again. I'm surprising myself all knife. Surprise I gave it a slash, surprise I'd watch this again. I don't think it was bad. I don't necessarily think it's a movie that I'm like, hey, I'm gonna watch Jennifer's Body tonight. I think it might be something that. I put on while I'm doing something. But I do enjoy the soundtrack a lot to this movie. It's a lot of the songs that I grew up with that I'm obsessed with. So yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:10

And Alexis, that's exactly why I expected you to love this movie. Cause I was like, ooh. Specifically, I said it when the certain song was playing. I was like, oh my God, Alexis is gonna love this. Well, for me, I can't imagine myself watching this again. I wouldn't be against it, like background somebody put it on or something. I wouldn't be like, oh my god, how dare you! But I'm not excited. I don't, you know, I'm okay with it. I just don't get excited to think about watching it again.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:38

And I do. This movie to me, like I said, it's one of my favorites of all time. It has all my favorite things. It's got beautiful visuals, great characters, great themes. And now that I know that it's like honestly gotten better with age, I'm not as like hesitant to like revisit it because honestly, before I rewatched it, I was like, is it still gonna hold up like I remember it? And I'm so glad that it did.

SPEAKER_04 1:07:01

Well, Paris, I'm so glad you feel the love. Alexis, I know you're gonna be re-watching it. Ryan, let's see if we can tempt you a little bit more with uh little bits of factor fiction here. We have some quick ones for you tonight. Number one, Megan Fox put a lot of effort into this role in preparing for it, and to do so, she dropped to 97 pounds and even stayed out of the sun so she could stay pale. Looks like that would be true. So fact.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:28

I think 97 is dangerous for an adult. I'm gonna say fiction, hoping it's true, but honestly, it's Hollywood, it's probably fact.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:38

Well, she's also like famously very short.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:40

We talked about this. Me and Chris had a whole conversation because I actually thought she was tall. I thought she was gonna be a tall queen and she's not. She is short. You're right, it's probably fact.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:49

It's like how you think Lady Gaga's tall, but then you see her and you're like, oh, she's literally a child.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:54

No, I think she looks like a child.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:56

Oh, I never realized until I saw her in concert.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:58

Megan Fox has that long torso.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:00

And also the low rise jeans certainly help with that.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:03

Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:04

I will say, knowing that Megan Fox was like really passionate about this role, I'll say this is a fact. She probably committed really hard.

SPEAKER_04 1:08:10

It is, in fact, a fact. If only we had the drive.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:14

The discipline, really.

SPEAKER_04 1:08:16

If only, indeed. Number two. The waterfall that goes nowhere, the devil's kettle from this movie, is actually a location that Diablo Cody invented for her short stories in high school. It feels like a fact.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:28

Yeah, I feel like you're not here to trip us up tonight. Fact.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:31

So I've actually always wondered this, like if this was a real thing that you can see, like at some small town on a road trip. And I know that there's definitely CGI in the scenes that they film it, but I want this to be real for some reason. So I'm gonna say this is fiction and that this does exist somewhere.

SPEAKER_04 1:08:46

It does in fact exist. It's fiction. It is actually at Judge Magney State Park in Minnesota.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:52

Oh my god, I used to live in Minnesota and I never saw this. I need to go back.

SPEAKER_04 1:08:55

You live so many places. You're the next Mac.

unknown 1:08:57

Oh no.

SPEAKER_04 1:08:58

The whirlpool isn't real.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:00

Well then wait, what is real?

SPEAKER_04 1:09:01

The actual waterfall. The water disappears into a glacial pothole.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:05

Uh, see? Glacial pothole. That's what they used to call me in high school. I'm just kidding.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:11

Number three. Alternate titles for international releases for Jennifer's Body include Devil Hid in You, I'm Thirsty for Blood, and Terribly Spicy. I'm Thirsty for Blood, please. Uh fact, why not? Fiction.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:25

I'm gonna say fact. The last one feels like an accurate translation of a translation.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:30

It's a fact. It is, in fact, called spicy in Taiwan. Yes. And we'll wrap things up here with number four. Now we've talked a lot about how marketing for this movie missed the mark, so to speak, and a lot of folks ignored the vision of the film. Now, one of the original ideas for the marketing was going to be for Megan Fox to do chats with amateur porn sites. I'm hoping for fiction. Same, so fiction.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:57

Yeah, this feels random, fiction.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:59

I'm so sorry, it's a fact. There are always facts with you. The director intervened, but the all-male marketing department from the studio was pushing Megan Fox's sex appeal so hard, and this was one of their ideas, and she begged them not to even mention this idea to Megan Fox so it wouldn't crush her.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:17

Ugh. In one of the interviews that I watched, Diablo Cody said that she remembers getting an email from the all-male marketing team about how they were gonna pitch this movie and like what the vision was for marketing it, and literally the email only said Megan Fox Hot.

SPEAKER_04 1:10:31

I believe it.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:10:32

Well, let's be better than those trash men. And we're starting off strong here because there you have it, folks. Jennifer's Body from 2009 has in 2021 earned a universal slash. Now we had lots to talk about here, and there's a lot more to say about this movie. We're dropping some links in the show notes to a number of articles and resources and interviews that cover this movie a little bit more, but for now we want to know what you think. Keep in mind there are a number of ways you can reach out to us, starting with our website, hackerslash.com, and on our social media accounts on Facebook, Instagram, and Twitter.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:03

And if you, like me, feel guilty about staring at Megan Fox during this entire movie, you can reach out to our Hackerslash Hotline to tell us about it. You can leave us a voicemail at 757-606-0128, or visit hackerslash.com slash contact to send us an audio message.

SPEAKER_00 1:11:18

And if you've lied about being a virgin to a band, you can send us an email to feedback at hackerslash.com. If you've enjoyed listening to this episode, consider becoming one of our patrons. You can visit patreon.com slash hacker slash to earn cool perks for as low as $1 a month.

SPEAKER_04 1:11:32

See you next time, folks, and remember, PMS isn't real. It was invented by the Born Run media to make us seem like we're crazy. Bye.