194: The Lodge (2019)

SPEAKER_04 0:04

It's like 99 red balloons floating in the summer sky.

SPEAKER_02 0:13

Greetings and salutations, and welcome to the new year with Hacker Slash. If you're joining us again, welcome back. You have nothing to be scared about. If this is your first time listening, welcome to the party. We are a horror movie review podcast dedicated to telling you whether a movie is a hack, a total joke, a waste of time, or a slash.

SPEAKER_00 0:30

Totally killer, pun intended.

SPEAKER_02 0:32

We believe horror is for everyone, and as such, we're rating these movies with the perspective we gain from our varying walks of life and the flavors of fear we fancy most. My name is Chris, I'm your friendly neighborhood slasher enthusiast. This week I'm joined by the Superfly Space Guy Mac.

SPEAKER_00 0:44

Hola, muchachos, the gore lover Alexis.

SPEAKER_02 0:47

Hey everyone. The cowardly creeper Ryan. Hiya. And the Scream Queen Paris.

SPEAKER_05 0:51

Hey sweets.

SPEAKER_02 0:52

This week we're kicking off 2022 with a wintry atmospheric film currently streaming on Hulu. Before we get down to business though, we have some follow-up.

SPEAKER_05 1:01

Let's follow up on a movie. That's the end of the song. We recently reviewed a classic, I'm pretty sure this movie's a classic, and it's remake. And I'm talking about Poltergeist. Now we wanted to hear what our listeners thought, and we wanted to see which of those versions they preferred, either 1982 or 2015. And it was a overwhelming majority, with 92% of the vote going to the original 1982 Poltergeist and a mere 8% going to the 2015 version. That feels right to me.

SPEAKER_02 1:28

Yeah, that 2015 version was trash. Wasn't also the original trash?

SPEAKER_03 1:33

No. Less trash. Kind of iconic, yeah. Listen, the word iconic means nothing to me after this podcast. Y'all say everything is iconic just because it's old.

SPEAKER_02 1:42

Yeah. I I think I use it a little bit differently, but that's fine.

SPEAKER_05 1:46

Iconic means it made an impact in the culture, either currently or in the past, at least to me.

SPEAKER_03 1:50

And doesn't mean it's good.

SPEAKER_05 1:51

True. Iconic is not necessarily good, which might be why I have never seen either of these movies and was not on these episodes. I do know though that that old psychic woman with the voice, she transcends beyond anyone ever having seen this movie, and I know that she exists and is in fact iconic. But we wanted to hear some comments from our listeners, and Tony had this to say on Twitter. I love both of these films, to be honest. I'd compare these to both versions of child's play. Both are getting a slash, yet, and by a lot, I prefer the original.

SPEAKER_00 2:20

Thanks, Tony. I I'm I'm there with you. I don't think either of them were bad. Obviously the original's better, but the the remake was still enjoyable.

SPEAKER_05 2:28

And we have another comment from one of our patrons, Joseph, who said, I'm with you guys on this. I saw Poltergeist as a kid years ago, and I thought it was scary. But now watching it as an adult, it's definitely a soft, soft slash. It deserves that because of what it brought to the horror genre. The remake, they could and should have done it differently. Keep the general story, but change it to some kind of modern, more mature storyline. So the remake definitely gets a hack for me. Waste of time.

SPEAKER_01 2:52

I totally agree with that.

SPEAKER_05 2:54

And that's our follow-up.

SPEAKER_02 2:55

Well, two years ago, attendees of the Sundance Film Festival witnessed a Veronica Friends and Severn Fiala film that was originally penned by a Scottish screenwriter. The pair liked much of the original screenplay, but decided they wanted to explore a darker, more serious tone that they felt existed within the film subtext. They ultimately began one of their screenings by apologizing to their mothers, producers, and everyone in the audience for what they were about to witness, not because of its fright, but because of the emotional reckoning the film would stir. This film features a young woman on a holiday getaway with her fiance and his children. But when her fiance is called away for work and she's snowed in with her soon-to-be stepchildren, she's forced to confront the demons that have haunted her life. This week we're talking about The Lodge. Who's seen this one before?

SPEAKER_03 3:39

Oh my god, Plot Twist, I saw this movie before. Honestly, I'm shocked. Me too. And the thing that's really great is I've tried to reference it on the podcast several times, thinking we had already reviewed it. Because it's so rare that I get to watch a horror movie and we don't review it. And it turns out we hadn't. And many times I've been like, you know that movie with the snow? Nope. But now we're finally here. Many movies with snow in it.

SPEAKER_01 4:00

Yeah, it's always a long conversation when I'm trying to remember the name of this because the lodge doesn't make sense. I agree with you. So I've watched this fairly recently, but I can't remember for sure when it was, but I know the circumstance it would have been in, which was me being hung over in bed and just needing something, you know, slow and eerie, nothing like too chaotic, not a lot of gore. Just I need something chill. And I'm obviously I put this on somehow.

SPEAKER_00 4:27

I think chill is the right word. Uh this was my first viewing of the movie. This was the first time I found out about it as well. And uh going in, I didn't actually watch a trailer or anything, so I had, you know, I had no idea what I hadn't seen.

SPEAKER_05 4:39

Like you, Mac, I have also not seen this movie, but I do recall a couple times where Ryan had referenced it, so I did know it existed.

SPEAKER_02 4:46

So I have seen this movie before. I saw it on long distance date night back in 2020, and I'm gonna be real with you, totally fucking hated it when I watched it. It I don't know what I was expecting going into that. I'm pretty sure I walked in with a completely open mind, hoping that it'd be a really good, eerie, suspenseful kind of film. But I ended up being pretty bored the whole way through. So going into this one, I was really expecting to be able to separate myself from that. Like I got surprised by it once, you can't surprise me again. Let me sit back and and watch the movie for what it is and and see if there are any details that I can pick up on now that I understand the plot in its entirety. But what were you all expecting?

SPEAKER_01 5:29

Chris, that's exactly what I was expecting. I didn't get the movie the first time. I was left with a lot of questions, and because of that, I disliked it. So I was wondering and hoping watching this a second time I wouldn't be as clueless.

SPEAKER_03 5:45

Honestly, I I think that I've watched this twice and and not fully understood things. And it's interesting. I definitely didn't have any expectations going in the first time. I very often just turn on movies and run with it. You know me, I don't like a trailer. This time I thought, oh my gosh, so exciting I get to watch this movie again because I couldn't remember really what happened at the end. This is one that's just kind of been purged from my brain except for a few details. And yeah, I I think I'm still connecting dots, which is interesting after a second watch.

SPEAKER_00 6:15

I connected some dots while watching it, but I didn't know what to expect going into it. I honestly thought this was gonna be a movie just about like an evil stepmother torturing her kids.

SPEAKER_05 6:23

I knew nothing about this except that it took place in the cold and there was a woman and children in a cabin. So my expectations pretty much non-existent.

SPEAKER_02 6:31

Mac, I think it's hilarious that that's what you're expecting. Uh, an evil stepmother. I mean, this is not owned by Disney, so I don't know where that came from.

SPEAKER_00 6:40

But there is white snow, just no snow white.

SPEAKER_02 6:42

Mm-hmm. Yeah, that is that is true. This is the inverse of that, good sir. I I will say though that when I was experiencing this film a second time around, stepping back and really knowing what was in store from the beginning helped me appreciate details in this movie that were completely lost on me the first time around. I and I think that's what really kept me from feeling completely bored again. I think this movie has some pacing issues, and I think it really tries to do a lot of like what The Shining did with drawing things out, letting you sit in silence, letting you sit in a moment of discomfort. But ultimately, I think that's more problematic for me. I think I have myself to thank for not being bored.

SPEAKER_05 7:25

That's interesting, Chris. When I was watching this movie, I was actually super intrigued and engaged the whole time. I can definitely see though why it could be something that gets boring because it's one of those movies that's very I think we said this before, mumblecore. Is this mumblecore? It's very much like long stretches of no dialogue where you get like little bits that build up into something. Um, but the whole time there was like a mystery unfolding, and I was very much like, what is happening here? I had ten different theories throughout. Um, some of them were right, um, some of them ended up not being right, but ultimately I felt like there was a lot of really palpable tension all throughout this movie, and that's what I remember feeling.

SPEAKER_01 8:04

Totally. To me, watching this movie, it almost felt like a slow descent into madness, and you really feel that. And Chris, I can see why you'd probably get a little bit bored from those stretches, but to me, it was building the tension a little bit more. And I know we'll talk about characters in a little bit, but this movie did something with the scenery with all of these elements besides the dialect that added to this, which I thought was really interesting.

SPEAKER_03 8:34

Yeah, I think w the thing that this movie has is pregnant pauses, like really, really, really big pauses that that hold some amount of weight for one reason or another. A lot of times it's just seeing something on screen, but it also has a lot of like silence and discomfort, which is what I feel like is real to the situation here. And so this movie makes you feel what it may feel like to be in the car with your soon-to-be stepmother and father when your mom just killed herself. You know, like you feel that feeling here as much as you can, being, you know, someone watching a movie at home. And it's just, I don't know, it's interesting. I think this movie does the thing that I expected. I don't know, movies like I think hereditary or maybe mother in a way, like where they want me to feel things and get into the feeling of it. I don't know. This does it a little better than something like that.

SPEAKER_00 9:24

I think you've mentioned you've all mentioned some points that I agree with. So the discomfort's a big one, the tension's a big one, and it leaves you with this feeling, left me with a feeling of like, I just want to go home. It felt like you're somewhere where you you are stuck, kind of like the characters in the film, and you just can't wait to leave. And it's not because you're I wasn't necessarily bored, it's not because you're hating the experience necessarily, it's because you're like, this is so uncomfortable that I just want it to end. Um, but kind of in a good way, because it it made it for just such a tense watch. It was great.

SPEAKER_02 9:52

I think the tension of the watch is something that surprised me more this time around. I remember being struck by how depressing this movie felt right in the beginning. It really hits you hard. And I really, really appreciated that. So the longer it went on, and then we got more of those pregnant pauses, like you're talking about, Ryan. I feel like I just really lost the impact of that because the beginning of the movie feels so tightly paced, and everything else just is really stretched apart and in ways that I didn't particularly appreciate. But one thing that really surprised me on this rewatch was really focusing on the intentions and the motivations of each character and keeping in mind how that contributes to the overall story. And then really, the first time I watched this, I was furious on behalf of one of the characters in this movie because what a fucking shitty outcome for them. But this time around, I think I appreciated that a little bit more. I think I allowed myself to try to relate to the kids a little bit more. I think I allowed myself to relate even to Grace a little bit more. And I find that this movie was like a better swallow for me the second time.

SPEAKER_03 11:03

You know, it's interesting what you were saying about being surprised, like and that the tension kind of wore off throughout. Because for me, I was surprised by how much it still felt really tense for me. It felt really tense the first time, and the silence and the the pauses and everything. I it's impressive how well it worked for me, even a second time around. Like I wasn't expecting to care about what was happening. I wasn't expecting to be like into it because I've already seen it and I know it moves slow. I know it's quiet. Sometimes quiet movies are real hard to pay attention to. This one keeps me like tied into it for some reason.

SPEAKER_01 11:35

So interesting for us who have seen it already that that's the feeling we're getting because I'm also surprised and how tense I was watching this. And it hasn't even been that long since my first watch of it.

SPEAKER_00 11:47

The the pacing here, I think, is really everyone's surprised. I mean, it it's it's going to be slow if you're used to fast pace, but at the same time, it like embraces it. It knows how to use it and when to use it to build tension, but it's not afraid to completely slap you in the face all of a sudden.

SPEAKER_05 12:02

And that, Mac, surprised me a whole lot. Also, just the in general inclusion of Alicia Silverstone in this movie. I was not expecting that. And the way that plays out, I think, was a huge um moment for me where I was like, oh, what is this movie? But I was also very much surprised with how this movie managed to tackle a maybe taboo sort of theme or subject matter, but in a way that you can really understand the motivations of everybody involved, and it ends up just being this sort of really unfortunate mess in a way that I think was nuanced and surprisingly effective.

SPEAKER_02 12:33

I think nuance is a really good way to describe this movie. I think one of the things that really stands out to me though is is how much it makes you feel. And while it makes me feel tense, it doesn't make me feel scared. There's one thing in this movie that I was scared for, and it did not treat me well. Did not treat me well. But beyond that, I find that like the things that we see unfold, you know, even the reality that things aren't always as they seem, none of it did anything to truly scare me.

SPEAKER_01 13:06

Yeah, I wasn't scared per se, but I think this idea that you bring up like religion and cults and I feel like that can be scary, especially to be quite honest. I've been to Catholic school and I can see where I'm kidding. But I think in a very self-referential way, you can think about experiences and people use religion a lot to excuse some behavior, and you can totally see that in this movie and just see it coming to light. And it's just to me, if you've been in those situations, then you could understand.

SPEAKER_00 13:42

I didn't really find the movie itself like that scary. There was a lot of tension. It's it's kind of like the feeling when you're driving and you're on the highway and somebody nearly takes you out, and if they would have hit you, it would have been like a horrible car accident. And you're like you're almost there for a lot of the movie.

SPEAKER_03 13:57

That's a pretty scary thing.

SPEAKER_00 13:58

Well, yeah, but it's like that feeling of knowing like they didn't hit me and I drive safely so I don't have to worry, but like had they been like, I don't know, two seconds slower, this would have been game over for me.

SPEAKER_03 14:08

Yeah, I can see where you're coming from. I I think this movie isn't scary, but it is that psychological thing that that really does it for me. So I don't need it to be scary. I don't think most psychological kind of thriller type of things are really scary, right? They're just so intriguing and keep you on the edge of your seat the whole time. And that's what this did for me.

SPEAKER_05 14:28

Honestly, same Ryan. I was on the edge of my seat the whole time. I think by the time we get the the release of tension, it's done in such a way that is not scary, but more evoking of other emotions. Um, so I think this movie did a good job of building suspense, but not necessarily a good job of following up on that.

SPEAKER_02 14:46

I will say though, the way that it does just that, Paris, felt really, really good. I think the last movie to make me feel this tense was Midsommar. In a way that like it opens up with such tragedy and it really just throws you into the thick of those feelings. I I do think that Midsommar does a little bit more to shock you than this one does. This feels like it feels like that kind of film mixed more with the shining. And I think maybe what it is for me is that misery is the only type of winter horror I can really get into and sink my teeth into and feel that like sense of isolation. But I think for for it being that movie, for it being that mix of the shining, for it being the mix of Midsommar, maybe that's just me that feels that. I do think this was a a perfectly competent original film. I think the way that things play out makes complete sense, but it's a turn that I haven't seen in another movie.

SPEAKER_03 15:43

Yeah, I'll go for some originality points here. I think it has some similarities to other psychological thrillers. They all kind of have a similar are they going crazy baseline, but this one does at least feel a little original.

SPEAKER_01 15:55

Yeah, the plot to me is super original. I mean, there are elements that have been in other movies before, but the way this is all intertwined, I think was something I haven't seen in a while.

SPEAKER_00 16:04

It it definitely has a familiar setting and it sets the stage in a way that like you might think it's gonna go a certain way, but the way that it depicts trauma, resentment, um triggering, like literally seeing someone triggered on screen. Um, ever the way everything's done is just like really phenomenal and it's it's very just a mental film.

SPEAKER_05 16:23

I totally agree with everything everybody has said. This movie has a familiar scent, but tastes singular.

SPEAKER_02 16:28

I'll tell you what doesn't taste singular though, and that's how I feel about the ending. I feel like this was another one that, regardless of how stretched out some things felt, this movie started really high and it didn't end as high for me. It felt very very felt very sudden. It felt like we could have lost some of the stuff in the middle to see a little bit more of a conclusion versus being suspended in that moment.

SPEAKER_03 16:53

Oh, I feel like what happened is what had to happen and there was no other option. Like once everything, you know, once the cookies were crumbling, this is what we had on the plate.

SPEAKER_01 17:01

I agree. I think the intensity that builds up throughout this movie, the point that it comes to to me is definitely a payoff.

SPEAKER_05 17:08

That's super interesting that you say that, Ryan, because as the end was unfolding, I was like, okay, this can go one of at least six different ways in my mind. And I don't think I was expecting the one that it ended up going with. Um, but I do agree with you, Chris. The movie started higher than it ended.

SPEAKER_00 17:23

It does seem almost musical in a way, the way it kind of ends very similarly to how it begins. Like it's got this nice mirroring effect to it, so I still enjoyed the way it ended.

SPEAKER_02 17:33

Well, I can appreciate how musical you find this ending to be, but let's see if we find much more appreciation in the movie overall. Now, before we give our official scores, Alexis, how many people died in this film? We had a total of two bodies in this movie. And what about the animal report?

SPEAKER_03 17:49

Yeah, it's not a good animal report, dog. It's it's uh in the words of Paris, is is a little bit of a pupsicle, you know? Which which sounds cute, but it's really not what you want, and that's really what we get.

SPEAKER_02 18:01

We're really starting off badly here to 2022, but let's see what these scores have in store for us. The Lodge from 2019. Was it a hacker or slash?

SPEAKER_00 18:09

I'll get us started here. So this is definitely a slow burn. And I decided to watch this after working something like, you know, whatever it is, nine hours that you work, and then you get home and it's, I don't know, ten o'clock at night, and settle in and then turn it on and fell asleep, and then had to go back and restart it. And that's not a fault of the movie, it's a fault of my own. Now, if it were some kind of action movie, sure, I probably wouldn't wide awake because it forces you to stay awake. This movie does not force you to stay awake, it just forces you to think, which is a great thing. It's definitely what it's got going on for it. It's very in your brain, it makes you think about like existential questions. How do I know if I'm alive right now, for instance, is a is a big question that you're gonna end up asking yourself. So I I think the way that it deals with its characters is brilliant. I think the way that the characters interact is interesting and intense to watch on screen in many scenes. And overall, after finishing it, I had to think back and think like this was just kind of a great movie to me. This is a slash. Um, there's parts of it that are really hard to watch because of their intensity, not because of how bad they are. So overall, just a slash.

SPEAKER_03 19:17

I would like to follow that slash with an additional slash. I had seen this, and when I thought back on it, when I realized I had seen it, I couldn't remember what I felt. I was like, man, but does it have like a weird ending? Like, does it get does it get strange? Are things questionable? Like, does it go like a weird, I don't know, cult route, which maybe it kind of does, but I wasn't sure. And re-watching immediately, I was like, oh, the best thing about this movie is how it's shot. And if you're not on board with like the slow, silent movie, you're not gonna be on board with this. And I'm not always, but this one does it in a way that I think is so intriguing and pulls you in rather than making you want to scroll Instagram. So for me, like the silence, the feeling of things, it works so well. This story is interesting because I've realized that I didn't notice in my two times watching somehow that things were not what they seemed. And I'll talk more about that, of course. I still like the movie, having realized I thought it was something else happening the entire time. And that's a lot. I mean, I like it now more knowing that, which is hard to explain because we're not talking about it. You just have to stick with me on this one. It's a slash. I really enjoy this movie. It does have that misery feeling to it, that isolation, and I like it. I like a psychological thriller. That's my kind of jam. Like it does what I need. That's my home, that's my spot, and that's my section of horror.

SPEAKER_01 20:42

I agree with you, Ryan. This isn't typically a movie I would like. You know, it doesn't have a lot of gore, it's pretty slow, and it reminds me of this new horror that's coming around that kind of lacks for me the typical horror plot lines and the rhythm. I have to admit though, watching it the first time, it left me in this really weird spot. And I know we've talked about it earlier, and I didn't get it, and I actually thought it was kind of stupid watching this. I was like, what is this? This is just trying to get me to think, and I just I just I'm not getting it, to the point where I actually went on YouTube and w had a guy talk me through the entire movie and still thought it was stupid. But I'm glad I gave it a second watch because this is a different feeling. So many chills, and it's just great seeing this spiral of grace, and it's terrifying. Not a typical terrifying like it would be in a regular horror movie, but just this awkwardness, this madness that you get. And I think it was especially effective. And I love how this movie isn't dependent on the dialogue that you get from between the actors, but the feelings, the pauses, everything but the dialogue. And I love that. So I'm glad I gave this a second watch because I'm definitely giving this a slash.

SPEAKER_05 21:54

So I obviously watched this movie for the first time, and from the first kill that we get. It had my full attention because anything that can shock me that much and keep my mouth agape for at least 45 seconds after a moment um is deserving of my attention, I think. And truly, I actually loved this movie so much. Okay. It is beautifully filmed. It is also like beautifully written and performed. It's haunting, it's painful, and it's like absolutely unhinged. You basically have a morally questionable character preying on the trauma and the vulnerabilities of another character in order to create this absolute monster and this absolute nightmare of a situation. And the dynamic between these characters, and it's so minimal in its cast, that you really feel the motives, the emotions, the feelings, the awkwardness, the tension between all of these characters all throughout. And there were times where I was like, tell me it's not this, and then it was that. And there's times where I was like, oh god, but is it this? And it wasn't that. And the way this movie really had me on an absolute ride, is definitely deserving of a slash. I was gagged, I was already recommending this to people. Um, this is a very good movie in my book.

SPEAKER_03 23:07

I just need to point out the word that you used, unhinged, because I think that is the perfect way to describe this movie. But it's not like other things that I think have been unhinged. Like, like again, like the hereditary, those are the kind of things that just go too far off the deep end. This one I feel like stays right on the diving board, but it's a little loose, you know? There's some screws loose up in there.

SPEAKER_05 23:27

And they're only getting looser.

SPEAKER_02 23:29

So this movie gives me some complex feelings. This is one that I absolutely hated the first time around. And it's one that I found super boring. I find that it really just really dug up all those feelings that I have about the shining being needlessly long, really drawn out. It really dug up all these feelings. And I think what this movie was when I I started like at a zero, and if you can imagine a scale of positive 100, negative 100 with zero right in the middle, the first watch took me all the way, and I have a diagram in our in our little note section here. Uh, it took me to a negative 100. But that was a large amount of ground to make up for on a second watch. Now, when I think about the feelings that I had watching this, when I think about having a more complete understanding of the plot, being able to look back on the intention of it, the looking back at like the finer details of it, I think this movie did just enough to get it into slash territory. I still don't love this movie. I really don't. I think it's not as haunting in the in as as misery can be. And I know that that sounds weird because I mean Kathy Bates isn't actually haunting anybody. She's just a fucking psychopath. But aside from its pacing issues, aside from that, and aside from like the you know, the general feelings I have about some of the decisions of two characters in particular, I think this does do a really good job of showing how how imperfect people can be and how they can respond imperfectly to a situation that nobody wants to be in, much less anyone else in this fucking scenario. So with that, I'll give it a slash, barely a slash, but a slash.

SPEAKER_05 25:13

I love that we're starting off with a universal slash when last year it was a universal hack with Jack Frost. But Chris, you you brought up the Shining a couple times, and I forgot to mention this, but I was left with this feeling that this movie did the thing that the Shining was really trying to do, but a lot better, and in ways where you could understand what actually was going on and why.

SPEAKER_02 25:31

So the slow descent into madness?

SPEAKER_05 25:33

Yeah, in a way that actually has cause and effect, as opposed to kind of just, sure, I'll go with it.

SPEAKER_02 25:40

I can respect that. I still have some qualms with it, but we'll get into that in the second half. But for now, the Lodge from 2019 has earned a universal slash, and yes, we are starting off the year better than we started 2021 and even 2020. Now, you can find this movie streaming on Hulu, so go check it out. Then join us in the second half so we can unpack the craziness together. See you in a bit.

SPEAKER_00 26:09

Your kids are the worst. They're loud, they're messy, they have no respect for authority or boundaries. They're disrespectful. They blame you for every tragedy that befalls them and gaslight your new partner into reliving their childhood traumas. What's a parent to do? Raising kids is hard. You want them to have a good life, and you know that in order for this to happen, they need an education. But it's not easy when your children are aliens. The Lone Oak Institute for Way with Children is here to help your children grow into responsible adults who will never speak ill of their parents again. At Lone Oak, we believe in tough love. So if you're looking for a softer touch, look elsewhere. Because here at Lone Oak, we give zero fucks about being politically correct or offending anyone's delicate sensibilities. Lone Oak, where discipline is no joke.

SPEAKER_02 27:03

Welcome back, folks. You are now entering the spoiler zone for the launch from 2019, which has earned a universal slash to kick off the new year. Now we have a lot to get to here, but before we get into the specifics of our ratings, we do have the matter of gore to attend to.

SPEAKER_01 27:20

You know, for this movie, it was on a fine line, but between medium and high? What? I feel like the two images you get of obviously someone blowing their own head off is very freaking traumatic for me. Like to see that, and like usually, I mean, in movies it turns, it looks something else, but I was so shocking to see that to me, even though there's two deaths, you seem up close, not extremely gory, but I'd say more violent.

SPEAKER_00 27:47

So is it rated high because the gore we get and the two small bits seem realistic? Or is it emotional gore?

SPEAKER_01 27:53

Maybe it's a mix between the two. Maybe I was just in a weird state.

SPEAKER_03 27:56

No, I mean I think you're on to something. It's like as far as how much gore we get, it's low. Yeah. But as far as like what kind of gore, the shock value is a medium to high. Yeah, it's it's insane. Like the two kills we have here are shocking to say. Like, like shocking isn't even really the right word.

SPEAKER_05 28:14

Intense.

SPEAKER_01 28:15

You're yeah, you're not prepared for either one of them. Especially the first one. I think that sets off the intensity of this movie. And then by the time you get to the dad's death, that's when you're like, oh crap. And then you see the back of his head blown off at the kitchen table, and you're like, okay, this is like, I don't know, something it and I would love to like see how they created a shot like that because it's so fluid, or maybe it's great acting too. It's I'm sure it's a combination of all that, but the fluidity of that shot, I think, is what made it so realistic to me that it was just shocking.

SPEAKER_02 28:47

You keep saying fluidity, and it keeps throwing me off because I'm just thinking about the fluids coming out of the head.

SPEAKER_01 28:55

I think it's the when the the revolver clicks. I I don't know the parts of a gun. Um, you you click the switch on the bottom that releases the bullet, and then then her head cocks back and then it splatters in the back. It was just that's I guess that's what I'm talking about. It was great, a great shot. Yeah, okay, there we go.

SPEAKER_03 29:13

Good camera work. Also a great shot. Wait, it's uh they did what they needed to do, and it like just like the rest of this was shot so well, they didn't hold back there either.

SPEAKER_00 29:22

They went for a more realistic approach, which reminded me of like war movies, where in a lot of horror movies they need to like draw it out, you need to see like the wounds, you need to see the splatter, it needs to look like really gruesome. And this one, it's it's like real time, which is definitely more of like, you know, if you're watching like Band of Brothers or something, where people could just get dropped in an instant, and I think that's definitely adding to that shock because I was in total like Instagram mode at the moment that that happened in the beginning of the movie, because I was okay, it's starting out. Um I get the idea, I see what's happening, and then all of a sudden I looked up and I was just like, What the hell just happened? I was not ready for this.

SPEAKER_03 29:54

Because it had just been silent for too long. Where if you had stopped paying attention, you were gonna come back. Yeah, and that's what that's like what this movie does. It's like the silences are just so long that it's like, wait a minute, um, I just realized I'm scrolling on my in on my Instagram. Yeah, let me look back at the TV, and then something happens.

SPEAKER_00 30:10

Yeah, it's like, oh, prepare to get throttled. Just as soon as you think it's uh it's time to be chill, throttled.

SPEAKER_02 30:16

It's kind of like when someone's talking and you zone out and they stop talking, and you're like, fuck, I don't know what they just said. Exactly, but it's a kill. I do that a lot. Damn.

SPEAKER_05 30:26

My boyfriend did that same thing. He looked up right at that moment and he was like, wait, what? And I was like, I don't know. And I love the intensity of that kill because you really see that Alicia Silverstone is generally struggling, and all you hear from her really is when he gives her that news that he's marrying this other woman and that they need to finalize the divorce, and she just says, Okay, and then leaves. Because she's obviously been through it, and we don't even know everything that she's been through. But I was also kind of like, damn, because I thought it was very beautiful the way it was shot.

SPEAKER_01 30:56

Paris, I like where you're going with that because you get that action of her putting the lipstick on, like she's trying, and she well, you feel a disappointment from her, and the repercussions of that are great. And to continue on in visuals, there's a specific scene that stood out to me because I know this whole movie is just filled with so many visuals that are great. But mine was when they're at the funeral, and it's so geometric. You have this sort of outdoor area where it's open and then there's like little tiny cubes or whatever, but everyone's standing around and they're releasing the black balloons, which I know you're not supposed to do anymore because it's bad for the environment. But I don't know, something about that scene was just eerie, but I don't even know how to describe it. It it was to me visually stunning. I don't know if it was the black balloons against the white brick, but something about that just really made me feel good.

SPEAKER_03 31:49

Not really. Made you feel something.

SPEAKER_01 31:51

Yeah, it made me feel something. I don't know what it was, but it definitely was the first thing that stood out to me, and I was like, I love this. I'm not sure why, but to me it does something.

SPEAKER_02 32:00

Here's why it did something for you, because here's why it did something for me. I saw those balloons and I immediately thought of 99 Luft Balloons, which is an amazing song about how a pack of red balloons almost popped off World War III.

SPEAKER_05 32:15

That's not what I was thinking. I was thinking it had a very like Wes Anderson level of like whimsy to the cinematography.

SPEAKER_01 32:22

Oh, I hate him, so it wouldn't have been.

SPEAKER_05 32:25

Really? But it's also very geometric and like symmetrical in that way.

SPEAKER_02 32:29

I'll drop a link into the show notes about the song that I was referencing since you all uh have no idea what the fuck I'm talking about.

SPEAKER_04 32:35

Everybody knows that song.

SPEAKER_01 32:37

I don't. How does it go?

SPEAKER_04 32:38

It's like 99 red balloons, but it's also like a German song. Floating in the summer sky. Exactly that. Sure.

SPEAKER_00 32:46

I don't know it that way because I'm I used yeah, I'm I'm used to hearing it in German, but yeah, it's exactly how it goes. Luft balloons, not yeah, Luft Balloons.

SPEAKER_02 32:54

Dun dun dun dun dun dun dun dun dun dun dun okay. Alright.

SPEAKER_00 32:59

I I love that shot that you picked out, and it's one of many that I think are kind of insane visually. This movie could just be like printed out and put into a book because of, I think, the framing. The framing of the shots in this film, just absolutely insane. There's so many that you could just pick a still from the movie and like put it on the wall, and people be like, oh my god, how artistic. That looks so cool. Especially when we get to areas where there's snow or when we're inside and it's dark. Um, there's just like some really great shots of even part of a character or multiple characters, the way they're interacting on screen. Uh, it just like has its own tension, even without movement, and because there's plenty of times where there is literally no movement.

SPEAKER_02 33:37

Absolutely. I love so much in this movie how the darkness of the house is filled by the reflection of light off of the white snow outside, and what that does for the natural light within these darker spaces. There's one shot of Grace in particular that I absolutely love that I'm gonna drop into our notes. And it's her walking into the attic, and she has this like frost-bitten face, and this room that she's in has like a triangular roof, and it is just completely dark, but filled with like light coming in from the far window, and the lines that are coming out from around here almost looks like an amazing like halo effect. It's very, very poetic.

SPEAKER_05 34:18

I love that shot, Chris. I don't remember, I mean, I remember seeing the shot, but I don't remember it looking as beautiful as it does in this still here. But I think this also kind of touches on my favorite visual element in the film, which is the way that this movie mu uses muted color palettes to convey like a sense of numbness in more ways than one. I first noticed it at the beginning when you see Alicia Silverstone just sitting at the dining room table before I knew what was gonna happen. And I was like, wow, she's like you can tell that she's like so numb inside, and this like muted dining room is just giving very like I feel no joy. Um, and then that happened, and I was like, oh, okay, so she was truly void of joy, got it. And then the way it kind of played with emotional numbness and then like actual physical numbness as everyone is freezing their fucking asses off in this movie, I thought it was very thoughtful and very well executed.

SPEAKER_03 35:06

Yeah, I think it's insane, honestly, what they do with this movie visually, because I don't think it would be as good if it wasn't shot the way it is. The thing that stands out for me, and I don't know why it particularly stands out in this movie, if it's because of how they did it or how often they did it, but it's the shots that we get usually slightly around a corner or through glass or somewhere where it's like someone looking at something, and the biggest ones that stand out are like things that the kids would see or hear. Like you can hear the dad barely, you know, kind of muffled talking from outside the car when they're just sitting in the car with the soon-to-be stepmom, and little tiny things where they see stuff. Or at the beginning, when Laura comes in the house and he's like, She's not here, and she's like, Bro, I can see this woman inside your house. What are you talking about? You know, it's it's these little shots that we get where it's like you saw her at the front door, and then you see her going out the back. You see these things, and it's just so lovely and and makes you feel like you're a part of this movie. And that's the thing that I think is above and beyond with the quality of the shots that we have is like you feel like you're in this movie because you you see stuff like you would see it if you were there.

SPEAKER_01 36:12

Yeah, you always get little snippets at her. So I was like wondering when was I actually going to see this crazy person come into this movie and you don't see it for a while, but you hear her see her partially, and she's referenced, so I think it builds the intensity for the movie for sure.

SPEAKER_02 36:30

Ryan, I couldn't agree with you more that this movie makes you feel like you're there, and really there's no scene where I feel like you're ever more there than in the immediate aftermath of the kid's grief, right? So, you know, Laura's killed herself at this point. You are at the funeral, you hear, you know, you see her daughter crying, you see her son trying to like he's stoic, he's trying to be strong, but you feel the tension between you know the kids and the father. And that plays out where you see like the shadows of of Grace, and you see her, you know, through the frosted glass when she's coming over for like Thanksgiving dinner, for example. And there's this tension in that dynamic that reminds me of my own relationship with my father and you know the shit that he pulled when I was a kid, but it feels so relatable. I think this movie is at its best in the first in the first act of this film where we really have you know Laura taking her own life and the impact that has on those who loved her.

SPEAKER_03 37:35

I think that's really true, Chris. And I'm curious, do all of us here? Do you have stepparents back?

SPEAKER_05 37:40

I do not.

SPEAKER_03 37:41

Paris, do you have stepparents?

SPEAKER_05 37:42

I have a stepdad.

SPEAKER_03 37:43

We basically all have stepparents.

SPEAKER_02 37:44

I want to point out that I don't have a stepparent because my parents are still married, which is weird.

SPEAKER_03 37:49

Right. Okay, well, the yeah, the stepparent experience is very different from that, so the two of you are out of it. But yeah, I think this is an interesting movie to watch as an adult who has stepparents, depending on when they came into your life. I was pretty close to the age of eight in when I had a stepmother, when a stepmother came into my life, and it's just really interesting to like watch this movie and think about it and think about how things could have gone and how I would have handled this. I'm gonna be honest, had this happened in my life, I would have been real similar to these kids.

SPEAKER_01 38:18

Yeah, I feel like the dynamic that my stepmom and I had, especially when I was younger, was very different than the dynamic we have today. When I was younger, I mean, I would just call her a bitch behind her back. Like I was a horrible person in general, but she never did anything like wrong at all. But it didn't matter. That was just me processing everything at a young age.

SPEAKER_03 38:38

Yeah, also when you're a kid, you're like you don't really care about how people like you only care about yourself when you're a kid, truly.

SPEAKER_01 38:46

Very true. And these kids, to me, played the ultimate prank that you ever could play on anyone. And I think this is my favorite scene, is when they go actually into the closet and they grab all the stuff when they realize she's actually going crazy, and they're like, Okay, we need to sort of fix this because I feel like it was a point in the movie where I hadn't put my phone down my first viewing because I didn't catch that. So it made sense now that I'm watching it a second time that I understood that because before I didn't, I was confused. I was like, Are they dead and in purgatory? Like I really was confused.

SPEAKER_03 39:22

Yeah, so I actually want to talk about that because that's what I was talking about when I was slashing this movie. Is I watched it the first time and it was a while ago, and I can't remember if I at the time realized that the kids were pulling pranks. This time that I was re-watching it, like I said, I didn't remember a lot, and I totally didn't remember and connect that they were pulling pranks because I was kind of doing a little bit of like a briefer watch today than than I normally would because I've already seen it. I was just like, oh yeah, like I totally remember she's going crazy. And then we get here and I'm like, wait a minute, I was completely wrong. She's not going crazy the whole time. The kids are go are are making her crazy, and then she loses it. But I don't know how I managed to miss that. I mean, there's really only like a couple of moments where it's clear that they weren't actually doing these things, like or these things weren't actually happening. But basically, the whole time we were watching in the past couple of days, knowing this movie was coming up, Paris was like, I hate kids. I'm never having kids. This is what I'm talking about. How do we get rid of these kids? And I was like, Bro, the kids didn't even do anything. And then I got hit today and I was like, Oh my god, wait, the kids did so much, they're terrible. Why would they do this? The kids did everything. Literally drove the girl mad.

SPEAKER_05 40:30

These kids viciously gaslit a woman that they knew had prior trauma and struggles with mental illness. Now, obviously, they're children, and how much do they really understand about the consequences of their actions? That I cannot speak to. But the cruelty of these children was first really highlighted for me in the scene where Grace is going out on the lake to ice skate with the family, and she's like really struggling, and she like has these two sticks, and the dad is like, Kids, can you help Grace? And they go over to Grace, who's like truly having a hard time standing up on these skates, and they just say, That was our mom's hat. And she's like, Oh fuck, she feels really bad because she didn't realize she made an honest mistake. She gives them the hat, now absolutely freezing her little hat off because she has no hat. The kids take the hat, put it on so that they have now two hats, and then just walk away, leaving her there stranded to struggle. And just like the way they had no care or regard at all for like this woman as a human person was just like so cold and so raw and so like harsh that I was like, wow, the pain that these kids are dealing with is manifesting in some really dark ways.

SPEAKER_02 41:42

Isn't it so crazy to realize like for a woman whose name Grace, she receives absolutely none this entire movie?

SPEAKER_05 41:48

But I think handles a lot of this with Grace.

SPEAKER_02 41:51

Up until the end, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 41:53

Till she can't handle anything.

SPEAKER_03 41:54

When she's pushed to it, frankly. Right. Paris, I think that you touch on a really important point though, which is that the kids have been through so much that it is difficult to blame them for this because the the circumstances of their family are real rough. Like, not just normal, bad. And most family situations are kind of bad. This one's really, really bad. So everything they do, they do kind of get away with it because like what else do I expect from them?

SPEAKER_00 42:20

And you guys mentioned the moment where, you know, she goes from handling things with grace to not being able to handle it. And that reminds me of my favorite scene. And and my favorite scene is when the kids are praying and she's coming in and they're like, hey, you know, this we're in purgatory, we're dead. And she's like, What on earth are you talking about? And they're like, think about it. Like, you can't prove that we're not. And she's like, I'm c I'm hungry, I'm cold, I'm alive, right? I can feel it. And they're like, Yeah, but what if that's what it feels like when you're dead? How would you know? And it's great because it's they're like, it's one, it's showing how horrible these kids are and really trying to mess with her mind. But two, those are the kind of questions that would drive you insane if you were stuck in a house in a blizzard. You would be like, oh my god, how do I know that I'm actually alive right now? And it's like totally, even if you're completely sane and have no traumatic past, would totally make you question existence.

SPEAKER_03 43:04

I have, oh my God, am I actually alive right now? Conversations with myself all the time, including at work around other humans that are supposedly alive. So God only knows what it would be like in a cabin stuck by myself or with crazy people.

SPEAKER_00 43:17

The equivalent, I think, would be, you know, if you've ever like realize, if you ever realize that you're sleeping, right? Like you're dreaming right now, and you tell yourself, like, all right, you're you're dreaming, wake up. Do that like feeling, like make that happen when you're awake.

SPEAKER_03 43:30

I have.

SPEAKER_00 43:31

Yeah. And like that's gonna mess with you a tenth of the level that that these kids mess with this woman.

SPEAKER_03 43:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 43:37

They also like fully stole her meds.

SPEAKER_03 43:39

Legitimately, which is not a safe thing to do. Like, that's actually dangerous. Because they could have been like physical meds, you know, not mental meds. And like, what if her heart just stopped? You know, crazy. Anyway, my favorite scene is the long trek outside to nowhere because it is isolated, it is miserable, it is cold. It's a a journey that takes you right back home, which happens every once in a while in a movie. And I honestly think I love it every single time because it adds to the psychosis of this movie for me perfectly.

SPEAKER_02 44:11

The psychosis of the movie is really, really heavy. And I think this is where I have a love-hate relationship with it. I think I hated this movie so much because I think I hated a lot of the things my father did. You know, daddy issues, whatever. Because here's here's the problem for me. He and Laura are going through a divorce. He eventually pushes for the final divorce. They're separated at this point. He's with Grace long enough. It feels rushed. You know what I mean? Like the and I don't know the exact timeline of everything, but in this movie, I think we're made to feel like this is very, very sudden because he's decided to marry Grace before he's fully divorced from Laura. And even within that, it feels almost predatory because he's doing this research on cults. He is, you know, uh attracted to in a relationship with a woman who has struggled with mental health. And I think it's almost like he is like fetishizing it in a way. Maybe that's off base, but what kills me is this feeling of he didn't want to deal with Laura's shit. It felt like he left one woman who's struggling with her mental health to another one who seemed like she had her shit together, and his children pushed her to relive that. Like his seed pushed her to relive that. And I think it's just the reality that the problem here isn't the kids necessarily. The problem here isn't Laura. The problem here isn't Grace. The problem here is Richard. The problem is Richard, you know, did whatever he did. I'm not sure exactly, again, the timeline of his relationship with either of these women, but he really kind of forced the kids into this relationship with Grace far before they were ready. They didn't seem prepared for that. He announced this wedding to Laura, and then that was like it was like the straw that broke the camel's back and it pushed her over the edge. So you know she must have been suffering long before that. I really just hate that this this role that he plays in this entire story. And I'm not gonna say I'm glad he's dead, but I do think it's not a coincidence that he's the one that pays ends up paying a price in this movie directly from what we see on screen.

SPEAKER_01 46:24

Oh, I love that, Chris, because Richard he knew Grace's past and he kind of manipulated her. It seemed like he wanted to, hey, let's, you know, from what I understood, he was a psychologist or psychiatrist. And I felt like they only tiptoed on that, but I feel like he might have been using her. And to me, he's an asshole for that. I agree with you for that. And it just to see her spiral, and you know that this is the type of person that you're dealing with. You know she takes meds, you know, and it's the first time that she is meeting your children, and then you're like, oh, sorry, gotta go. You know, it's just it's just interesting.

SPEAKER_00 47:04

It is such a curious dynamic because I think in my mind, I needed to fill in the story with how all of this happened. And they don't tell us a lot, and it's on purpose, but I created the story of my mind based on what we see on screen, in which like he's doing his research for the story or for his book or whatever it is, and he ends up in this position of power over her in some way, even if not, it's you know, it doesn't have to be like literal power. He ends up like replacing her father in a way, and she was part of a cult in which her father was the leader. So that like it held like a lot of power in her in her mind, and she, of course, convinced herself she's in love with him. Maybe they were, who even knows, right? But it definitely felt like he kind of took that position with her, and she's like constantly trying to please him. Um, and then what it seems like's happened is like they started doing this when he was still married, and then like tells his wife like it's over, and she's been trying to like hold it together since then.

SPEAKER_04 47:58

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_03 47:59

Yeah, that's what it seemed like to me. I mean, I think you guys are reading a lot into a relationship which is probably mostly just based upon I was with this woman, and then this younger, hotter in my eyes woman showed up, and then I left my wife for that.

SPEAKER_05 48:14

Who he was researching.

SPEAKER_03 48:15

Who he was researching. Yeah, it's just like it's that thing that always happens. It's like, I think there is something to what Chris was saying is like you were with one person who probably had some baggage that was difficult at some point, and we're like, oh, wait a minute, there's like a younger, hotter version of you. So it's baggage, but she's young and hot, so I'll just go with that one. Like, that's what the whole thing seems like to me. And you know, he just seems like the kind of person that maybe isn't the one that should have kids, right? Because he clearly is valuing his personal relationship over the what his kids feel about anything. A good dad in this situation would be single for years and years after his ex-wife killed herself. Like it it just that's how it would have to be.

SPEAKER_02 48:55

Or even if he wasn't single necessarily, he wouldn't be forcing his kids to have a relationship with the woman he was seeing. Right.

SPEAKER_05 49:03

I'm not gonna lie, I totally agree that he is fully deserving of pretty much all of the blame in this, but I don't like how much time we're spending talking about him.

SPEAKER_03 49:12

I know.

SPEAKER_05 49:13

There's so many more interesting characters in this movie, specifically Grace. I feel like she was so compelling to watch, because you have this woman who is, I would say admittedly, like not that great at connecting with kids, but truly making like an honest effort to do so because her intentions are good, and the way they're just like icing her out throughout this whole movie, you can feel that like she's starting to feel like almost like a child again, where she feels like maybe she's like being bullied by these actual children in a way that is a little bit more innocent at first. And there's specifically a scene where she's like they've been giving her the cold shoulder for like so long, and she just like says, That's enough, like I'm gonna like talk about it. And she's trying to just like bridge this communication gap between them because it's like really uncomfortable for everybody, us as viewers, and them in the house. And I feel like that was so relatable, just the way she tried to get them to talk to her, specifically the son. And I also feel like that was probably a manifestation of her trauma, like she couldn't really handle the fact that they were like cutting off communication with her because that is like a form of like psychological manipulation. And I just thought again, with how coldly they responded to that, it was really heart-wrenching to see this character with good intentions be put through such hell.

SPEAKER_03 50:26

Also, I fully believed she was just losing it and going mad. Like I I was like, oh no, like this poor girl, she's really trying to do something here, and she just can't keep her grip on reality. When that wasn't the truth at all, until it was.

SPEAKER_05 50:39

Until she was roofied, gassed, gaslit, and deprived of her crucial medications.

SPEAKER_03 50:45

By literal kids. Yeah, it's crazy. I do still want children, just so we're clear.

SPEAKER_05 50:51

Just not these ones.

SPEAKER_03 50:52

They they give you what you give them, okay? That's it. They had a trash dad, it wasn't their fault.

SPEAKER_02 50:57

Who honestly probably gaslit his wife long before this ever happened.

SPEAKER_03 51:01

I think you're probably right. The last thing I have to say about characters, the boy that plays Aiden in this movie is just so good. I love seeing him. You know, we love him from it, but he just has like a face that says things, and I am very intrigued to see him age and hopefully go down a path of success as an actor if that's what he wants to do. I just feel like he has a lot of potential, and I it's just I don't know. As soon as I remembered that he was in this, aka when he was on the screen, I was like, oh yeah, I forgot about this. This is a great part of this movie.

SPEAKER_05 51:33

Yeah, there was really like not a turd performance in the bunch.

SPEAKER_02 51:36

Even the frozen dog was great. Oh my god, stop.

SPEAKER_00 51:40

That was I'm sorry, that was the worst part of the movie for me.

SPEAKER_02 51:43

Absolutely, absolutely the worst part of the movie.

SPEAKER_00 51:46

Because here's why, here's why. So, yes, horror movies kill dogs sometimes and cats and other animals, and I don't like that to happen at all. But if you're gonna do it, you don't have to show it to me. You've already inferred, I've already inferred. We got the idea. The dog went missing, the door was open, the girl could just admit to it. Oh my god, I left the door open, and I think the dog got out and probably froze to death. Like, you don't have to show me the popsicle. I don't need the corpse to prove that it happened, and that little bit just like really put a sour taste in my mouth.

SPEAKER_03 52:14

Okay, but I will say it's not like a a a bloody gory dog situation, like a P2 situation, which is one I really couldn't deal with. This is like unfortunate things happen in the world, unfortunately, but it wasn't as bad to see for me at the same time. I think the movie has to be really good to have an animal death in it, and this one it happens to work, unfortunately.

SPEAKER_02 52:36

See, for me it was worse to watch because I felt like I could feel that dog suffer way more. Like slowly freezing to death. Mm-hmm. That poor little babe.

SPEAKER_05 52:46

Is it just me in interpreting this as the daughter specifically recognized that Grace really cared about this dog and was impactful for her and specifically left it out to die?

SPEAKER_02 52:57

I don't think she actually intended for it to die.

SPEAKER_03 52:59

Yeah, I did some research.

SPEAKER_05 53:00

Well, just to let it go forever.

SPEAKER_03 53:02

I did some research and it is assumed to be just kind of like an accident, but she realizes that it was probably her that left the door open. But this wasn't a part of the chaos, supposedly a part of the pranking chaos.

SPEAKER_04 53:14

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 53:14

I know the dog dying for me is is certainly a worst part, but I'll give a run a runner-up worst part. And that's at the Thanksgiving dinner when they have all those fucking plastic turkeys hanging. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 53:26

What the fuck was that?

SPEAKER_05 53:27

That was weird.

SPEAKER_01 53:29

It w it was very strange. And mine goes along with decor too. I think the worst part for me is I got a taste of the Christmas decor going up, and as soon as it was put up, it was taken right back down by those kids. So I wish there was more Christmas slash holiday decor in this movie.

SPEAKER_03 53:45

Oh my god, this is a Christmas movie. Yeah, we're only a couple weeks late. Yeah, I think I don't know. I struggle with the with the worst part of this movie, honestly. Not that everything was perfect, but I guess the pupsicle would be one of the things. I also honestly, I'm really interested to know what this movie would be like if the dad doesn't ever come back and we just descend into chaos. Like, what does that version look like? And honestly, it probably looks real similar based on what was happening. But when he was like coming back into it, I was like, Oh yeah, I don't really need you here, but you know, you do deserve to die.

SPEAKER_02 54:17

So honestly, he does run away from all his fucking problems. So here we are. That's right. Work is always more important.

SPEAKER_05 54:23

Capricorn. With that, Ryan, I thought for a moment that she had come to her senses and was going to like fake shoot the dad, and then that was gonna be it. And she was gonna be like, see, this is kids, why you don't do what the fuck you did, and this is like a lesson to be learned. Uh in hindsight, that didn't really I don't think that would have been satisfying. Um, but I have two worst parts. One, I feel like the found footage moments of her childhood at the cult were not giving at all what they were supposed to be giving. It felt like kind of cheap addition to a movie that otherwise felt like very elevated. Um, and then this movie committed one of the uh worst sins a movie can commit for me, and it did so in the worst way I've ever experienced, and that was the volume disparities throughout this movie. I have never in my life had to set my TV to 100% volume, and I was still straining to hear some of these whispered dialogues, and I was like, what is happening and why? I was riding the volume button so hard that I was like visibly annoyed.

SPEAKER_03 55:21

Subtitles, honey.

SPEAKER_05 55:22

Yeah. I will die on this hill, I guess. Because my boyfriend said the same thing. He's like, babe, just put on subtitles. I was like, I can't because I will not stop looking at the bottom of the screen.

SPEAKER_03 55:30

But there wasn't even enough words to distract you. Like it literally, you have to watch this movie with subtitles, especially because you will die from getting your ears blown out by organs like two times.

SPEAKER_05 55:41

Oh, yeah, I forgot about that part. But yes.

SPEAKER_03 55:43

Those were the jump scares. That was the scary part of this movie were the organs.

SPEAKER_00 55:47

Rational argument. Can I say that the movie is definitely a like a really dry movie? It's really tense and it's such a slow burn. Um, I wouldn't be against watching it again. I just like would need a long time before I could watch it again.

SPEAKER_03 56:01

Gotta tell you, watching it a second time, really good. But also, I you know that I basically have amnesia. Like, I didn't even remember the whole gist of the movie. I forgot what even went on. I just know some people in a house with some snow. So I think it is worth re-watching. I it'll probably be a long time before I watch it again.

SPEAKER_01 56:18

Yeah, I totally need a vibe for this. So snowstorm, cold, winter, and definitely watching this again. Gas heater, a little bit of Zoloft, drugs in my teeth, canned beans with crackers on top.

SPEAKER_05 56:33

I would probably re-watch this movie. Like y'all are saying, probably not anytime soon. But while I picked up on most of the major plot points, I would like to see what things I would pick up on a second watch.

SPEAKER_02 56:44

Hmm. Look, I I watched it once, hated it, watched it twice, liked it enough to slash it. I'm never watching this shit again. It's way too depressing for that. But let's see what else we can dig up in my feelings from Max Factor Fiction.

SPEAKER_00 56:58

Number one, Grace's father, the head of the cult, is played by Riley Keogh's real father.

SPEAKER_01 57:03

This seems low budget besides the set, so. Fact? Well, girl, this movie doesn't seem low budget at all.

SPEAKER_03 57:09

Just because it has five people in it. That's where I was going with it. Uh, I'm I'm gonna go fiction. I bet it was someone else's father.

SPEAKER_00 57:17

I'm gonna say fact because I'm tired. This is indeed a fact, and her father is an actor. Also in another movie you may have heard of, uh, called Cabin by the Lake from the year 2000. Number two, the lodge, featured in the lodge, is a real hunting lodge located outside of Montreal, Canada.

SPEAKER_03 57:37

Fact, this felt like Canada. Fiction.

SPEAKER_00 57:39

I'm gonna say fact, yeah, Canada.

SPEAKER_03 57:41

I was gonna say Canadia, by the way.

SPEAKER_00 57:43

Missed opportunity. This is a fiction. While it is indeed located near Montreal, uh, it's not a hunting lodge. It was actually located on a golf course that had been closed for the winter.

SPEAKER_03 57:52

Oh, interesting. Oh, that actually makes a lot of sense.

SPEAKER_00 57:55

Number three, the film was shot in reverse order so that the actors could give the ending all the energy they possibly could.

SPEAKER_03 58:03

Feels like a fiction. Feels like we were low energy exhaustion at the end.

SPEAKER_01 58:07

Yeah, I feel like to get that into madness feeling, you actually have to have been acting and not wait for this to be in the beginning of a movie, so it's definitely at the end, so fiction.

SPEAKER_00 58:17

I agree, this sounds fictional. Fiction. Indeed, it was shot chronologically. I got a quote from the director. Riley was worried that the journey her character takes was a very difficult one because she has to hit every mark in a way that is still plausible. And in order to help her walking down the path, we shot the whole film in sequence. Not only to help her, but to help us. In order to really make this journey and watch every step we take. So hardcore as always. And number four. The film was almost delayed because the lodge used for shooting wasn't chosen until nearly two weeks before shooting was scheduled to begin.

SPEAKER_01 58:50

I feel like that doesn't sound like a legit reason. People are more organized than that when they're filming stuff, so fiction. Exact opposite thoughts for me. Fact.

SPEAKER_05 58:59

I say fiction because I bet they saw this lodge and that's what inspired this movie.

SPEAKER_00 59:04

This is, in fact, a fact. Um, yes, they almost had to not shoot because they just could not find the lodge to use for the lodge, but they did. Thanks, Canada. And that's been Factor Fiction.

SPEAKER_02 59:15

Well, there you have it, folks. The lodge has earned a universal slash, and that's a lot to thank Canada for indeed. Now, while we certainly had a robust discussion here, it doesn't end here by any means. We want to know what you thought of this wintry tale of terror. Keep in mind there are a number of ways you can reach out to us, starting with our website, hackerslash.live, or on our social media accounts on Facebook, Instagram, and Twitter.

SPEAKER_03 59:36

And if you're cold, you can reach out to our Hackerslash Hotline. You can leave us a voicemail at 757-606-0128 or visit hackerslash.com.

SPEAKER_05 59:50

I'm cold. Become one of our patrons and warm me up. You can visit patreon.com slash hacker slash to earn cool perks for as low as $1 a month.

SPEAKER_02 59:58

We'll see you next time, folks, and remember you and you alone hold the key, and you know how to open the door. Bye.