270: Piranha (1978)

SPEAKER_04 0:04

Hold me closer, tiny jaws.

SPEAKER_00 0:07

Baby Jost.

SPEAKER_01 0:14

Greetings and salutations, and welcome to Hacker Slash. If you're joining us again, welcome back. You're starting off at the wrong end. If this is your first time listening, welcome to the party. We are a horror movie review podcast dedicated to telling you whether a movie is a hack.

SPEAKER_04 0:29

A total joke, a waste of time, or slash. Totally killer, unintended.

SPEAKER_01 0:34

We believe horror is for everyone, and as such, we're rating these movies with the perspective we've gained from our varying walks of life and the flavors of fear we fancy most. My name is Chris, I'm your friendly neighborhood slash enthusiast, and this week I'm joined by the Superfly Space Guy Mac.

SPEAKER_03 0:48

So did you start drinking before or after your wife divorced you?

SPEAKER_01 0:51

And the classic horror connoisseur Sean.

SPEAKER_04 0:53

What do I look like, the creature from the Black Lagoon?

SPEAKER_01 0:56

This week we're kicking it back to 1978 as we assess a creature feature that pays homage to a shark we've come to know and love. Six years before Joan Dante gave us gremlins, he gave us an aquatic creature feature produced by Roger Corman. After deciding to capitalize on the success of 1975's Jaws, executive producer Roger Corman spent three years attempting to raise money for his own underwater terror. He managed to secure a budget of $660,000, 10,000 of which went to the score, and 50,000 of which went to special effects, brought to you in part by the efforts of Rob Botton, who was still a teenager at the time. The film explores what happens when a school of deadly flesh-eating fish are accidentally released into a summer resort, which sounds pretty scary. This week we're talking about Piranha. Who's seen this one before?

SPEAKER_04 1:42

So I love a good creature feature, but I have actually never seen this one before. I've heard of it, and I think I may have seen bits and pieces of films from this franchise over the years. If you can call it a franchise, I I suppose it is, but films that came after this one, anyways, I don't I just don't think I ever saw this original 1978 version.

SPEAKER_03 2:04

I have also not seen this. I have not seen any of the piranha movies, and I have been chatting with a friend of the show, Alan, about watching this, and he kept like the first time I told him he was like, which one? There's a big difference between the 1978 and the one that comes later. And I was like, Oh, it's the 1978 one. He was like, Oh, okay, good, good, good. You can watch that one. It's all right. Honestly, it's I'm not a huge creature feature kind of person. I love, you know, Jaws. I love crawl. That was a great bit of fun when we got to watch that, notably my first episode. But no, I mean, I just like haven't really been invested into creature movies, especially tiny little fish ones.

SPEAKER_01 2:38

I haven't watched any movie in this franchise in its completion, but I do realize in retrospect, I've seen clips from and I think I've stumbled upon it while it's been on TV. But I I've never been fully present or committed to understanding the story. Now, obviously, we have a few remakes of this movie and there's a franchise behind it. But I was really curious to see what was going to happen going into this from 1978, knowing it comes on the heels of Jaws. And I think Jaws 2 was actually out by the time this movie was even made. Something that I've always loved in knowing about this movie's existence was the actual style of the artwork for it, even like the wave and the curve of the title piranha. And I expected this to feel like a nice tongue-in-cheek spoof of Jaws while not going over the top of like slapstick humor. I thought this was going to be like a little bit of a smarter approach to a parody.

SPEAKER_04 3:35

I think we had similar expectations going into this one. I was expecting this movie to be just a little bit ridiculous, probably not the best acting in this one. Also expecting this one to feel a lot like Jaws, but just sub in some piranha.

SPEAKER_03 3:50

You know, I wasn't really expecting much. I think based on the synopsis and when the movie came out, I figured we'd just get we'd get boobs, cheesy special effects, and maybe some B-movie acting.

SPEAKER_01 3:59

Okay, but the boobs are an important point here because this is Roger Corman who makes exploitation films and who prominently features nudity. I think this is one of the few films where he actually requested for a moment in a scene of nudity to be removed because he felt like it took away from the horror, which is fucking wild to me considering some of the past stuff that we've covered on this show, which has been influenced by him in some way. But in looking at Piranha and the experience that you get watching it, I found myself pretty indifferent most of the way through. It wasn't that it was particularly offensive, but it just got to a point where I was like, okay, this is fine. And so I got to a certain point where I was like, yes, okay, I'm here. They're making moves, they're doing things, I'm into this. I almost wish I had gotten that sooner in the film, but I actually think I was pretty entertained given the the cuteness and the viciousness of the piranhas we get.

SPEAKER_04 4:55

Yeah, that's fair. I think having the expectation of this going to feel a lot like Jaws, like I definitely got some Jaws vibes. I could see where it was influenced by Jaws in many ways, but really I I feel like most of the feelings that I had, not really indifferent watching this movie. It was just feelings of absurdity, right? Like I feel like there was just so many moments that made me think of how ridiculous this whole situation really was, which I know we'll talk about more in the second half. But yeah, it was just, it just seemed very silly in a lot of moments. And and you know, there they're definitely some serious moments, but even sometimes in those moments, it made me chuckle a little bit. And you know, what I did feel though, I felt like the effects weren't too bad for 1978. I'll give it that.

SPEAKER_01 5:41

Again, that's Rob Botton, right? This is him at the beginning of his career. He did King Kong, he did a Star Wars movie, and then he did this. And then we get him later on seeing some of the stuff that we've gotten him for, which I I think is absolutely wild to consider. Man, what a nice early sneak peek this was.

SPEAKER_03 6:11

And so I started forecasting what ridiculous things would happen.

SPEAKER_01 6:16

Yeah, I think this isn't something that's gonna particularly try to surprise you, right? Like there isn't a whole lot here that can really disrupt what you would I think it's come to expect given that it's a Jaws almost a parody. I think in in the tone of the movie, it it's more like an homage, so it's almost like it pays reverence to Jaws in some ways. But one of the things that I found really, really surprising was that despite how mild of an experience I had most of the way through, I was still impressed with the special effects, but I was also impressed with the piranhas. I actually, not that I'm particularly afraid of fish in general, but I actually found myself thinking, fuck, I wouldn't want to encounter these little bastards. That seems unpleasant. No thank you. And even the sounds of the piranhas that we achieved, I can't wait to talk about it in the spoiler zone, but I'm amazed that even in the 70s, for as much as we get of like this little school of fish, I was surprised by how effective I've found them to be.

SPEAKER_03 7:13

You know, the piranhas were my disappointment initially, where I was like, you know, we don't see a lot that's going on with the kills because everything's so obscured. But then also at the same time, I have to respect it because they had restraint. Had they spent a lot of the movie showing really cheesy looking fake piranhas, we would have hated it. And so it's both really good that they made that choice, but also I was kind of bummed out because a lot of stuff we just didn't see. We just got like, okay, there's blood in the water now.

SPEAKER_04 7:39

Yeah, and that's that's fair. I was a little disappointed myself with the kills in the movie. I I know we'll dive into it further, but look, I know it's 1978, and don't get me wrong, I love old horror films, but just something about the kills in this movie, to your point, Mac, like we don't see a lot for a long time, and it just feels a little lackluster, the kills in this movie. So there is that. I will tell you, I was surprised that we had shirts off in like the first two minutes of this movie. Literally.

SPEAKER_03 8:07

Was it not 30 seconds until boobs were present on screen?

SPEAKER_04 8:10

It felt very quick, like credits, boobs.

SPEAKER_01 8:13

Okay. I wasn't even really impacted by that moment. I didn't realize that I was signing up for the tit report here on Hackerslash. The proximity to boob was a little wild to me. I actually was surprised how little I noticed any boob action. In fact, I had to sit here and pause and think, oh yeah, that was a thing that happened in the very beginning of this movie, because then we get a little bit of boob in the water later on in a way that I thought semi-made sense. Surely if I saw flesh-eating fish attacking a great number of people, someone's bound to lose a bikini top, and not in a way that felt exploitative. But man, y'all just really don't miss a beat, do you?

SPEAKER_04 8:51

Listen, we're we're here to report everything here, all right? We're here to to give you all the ever all the details.

SPEAKER_03 8:58

I this is not a spoiler, so I don't mind saying it, but there is a scene in which a character is instructed to distract somebody, they get their attention in a ridiculous way that achieved the distraction, and then they flash them for absolutely no reason. That's true. This is true.

SPEAKER_01 9:13

That is completely lost on me. And in terms of all the shenanigans in this movie, that was one that did not really stick in my memory. I believe it a hundred percent. Not debating it, but what I am saying is some of this shit was wild in more ways than one. Apparently that washed right over me, literally and figuratively.

SPEAKER_04 9:34

That's hilarious. Uh all jokes aside, though, I was surprised. I know I said I really loved the editing. I know that I mentioned that I really loved the effects in the movie, but I also was really surprised by the editing in the film, which I thought was really good. And it actually made a whole lot of sense when I found out that the film won a Saturn Award for best editing. Uh I believe that would have been, because this is 1978, would have been 79 for the year for that award. But yeah, the editing in this film really took me, took me back.

SPEAKER_01 10:03

The editing was solid, some of the visual effects were completely solid. I was actually very surprised with the more we get into the third act of the film and and when things really start getting to pick up, I was surprised how many different techniques they took with even like the pacing of their cuts. I was actually really, really impressed with that. And I really wish that the experience we get in the latter half of this movie, maybe the last like 30 minutes or so, was sprinkled more throughout the remainder of the film, like the leading up to it. Because while I think it does work to build the suspense in a way that is similar to what we get in Jaws, I don't think it's as effective. Now, I mentioned earlier, I'm a little spoofed by these little fish. Fuck those little guys, they got sharp teeth. However, this movie just isn't a frightening creature feature. I think in part because it leans so far into the campy elements of this, where we can think of the vast amount of piranhas it would take to wreak this kind of havoc. I think some of the shots that we get show like a smaller number of like a school of fish. And I think that is intentional to show that as big of as a great white shark could be, or as little as this tiny school of piranhas, the waters just aren't safe no matter where you go. So scary concept, not a scary film, but I still say fuck the water to be safe.

SPEAKER_03 11:27

I respect the choice, you know, because there's stuff in it there you can't see and it can bother you or apparently maim you, but I I I've also agree that the movie itself is not really scary. I think if you were 13 and watching this, you probably wouldn't go swimming for a week or two. I think it would affect you if perhaps you were a little bit younger. I think to us, we just know how ridiculous this is. Now don't get me wrong, if I ever take a trip to the rainforest in like Brazil or something, I'm not like putting my bare feet in the water just to find out. It's not gonna happen. But I d I didn't find the movie scary.

SPEAKER_04 11:59

Oh, definitely not. Yeah. The scare is this film scary? No, but I can definitely see where this could affect, you know, a young kid from wanting to go in the water. And here's the thing where the fright factor comes into play is literally just swimming in lakes and rivers, right? Like they're just not places I want to swim. And I'm with I'm with Paul's daughter in this one. Like, I don't want to go anywhere near that water. I'm not jumping in there to swim around with a bunch of whatever the hell is underneath that water.

SPEAKER_01 12:28

Yeah, really, I was looking at these piranhas this entire time, thinking of old Greg, the mighty boo Shing, what you're doing in my wildest. And and really I thought, no, sir, I don't want to be in your waters. Let me not trespass. I don't want to disturb you, really. I don't want to move it on your turf. I don't want you on my land. You don't want me in your water. We're good. I think I can maintain a healthy respect and fear for the water. But in looking at how this movie lands for me personally, I think even examining it as almost a parody or a spin-off in in some way of like the success of Jaws, I still find this to be way more entertaining than I have found some other Jaws competitors. I think in some ways it's more entertaining than a lot of the Jaws movies that we get too. I love Jaws 3D, that's just me. The harder Jaws goes into camp, the more I love that shit. I feel like this would have been a funnier sequel to Jaws. Literally, just the Jaws.

SPEAKER_03 13:28

They definitely have that Jaws 3D feeling going on with the story, that's for sure. But I think when watching this, I just imagined this movie being titled Tiny Jaws. You know, like hold me closer, tiny Jaws. Hold me closer, tiny Jaws.

SPEAKER_00 13:43

Baby Jaws do too.

SPEAKER_04 13:46

I don't know how much there is to actually say about how original this film can be, just because it's literally a variation of Jaws, and its intent was to ride on the coattails of the success from Jaws 1975, but it does create its own backstory and scenario, and for that I'll give it credit where credit's due. But overall, this film isn't scoring too high on the originality factor.

SPEAKER_01 14:10

I tell you what, though, what felt different about the movie in respect to the rest of what it did, it gave me an ending that felt way more satisfying than some of what we get from Jaws. Not necessarily in legitimately the conclusion of it, but in the tiny amounts of cliffhanger we get, the tiny amounts of sinister energy we get, and then just looking at the widespread body of havoc that we got in terms of like the damage. I, as silly as it is, really enjoyed it.

SPEAKER_03 14:40

Look, they didn't have to go as hard as they did in the end. They went hard in the paint and they took it to this like really grim level and then just dropped the mic. And I was so caught off guard by that because I thought there was gonna be one of those like 1970s happy endings or something. But no, they were literally just like, yo, we're gonna mess with you and then roll credits.

SPEAKER_04 15:02

Yeah, true. The ending, I I'm not mad at it. It was entertaining, it was it was predictable, I think, in some ways, but definitely went like balls to the wall in other ways. I think just how everything unfolded, finding a way to leave the door cracked open. I just think it it was definitely a a good ending, an ending that I wasn't expecting. Like you said, Mac, going into it, having you know watched the entirety of the film. I was also expecting a much happier ending, but yeah, I don't know. It I'm not mad at it from looking at the ending. I think it was successful.

SPEAKER_01 15:32

Well, not mad at it can go a couple different ways. It can give mediocre, so it's a hack. It can give okay, it was serviceable, so it's a slash. I think it's time for us to consider what we're gonna rate this and move towards those scores. But before we do, Sean, how would you describe the gore score?

SPEAKER_04 15:49

Here's the thing the gore was surprisingly pretty good in this one, especially for 1978. There was a fair amount of blood, and the blood looked pretty damn good in the movie. You definitely see some gruesome scenes, some serious flesh wounds, people getting eaten alive, body limbs. This one I would say might just break into the high territory for the gore score.

SPEAKER_01 16:09

That's a bold statement, Sean. What about the animal report?

SPEAKER_03 16:12

It was fishy. We can say that. There so obviously there's fish involved, and you know, so I assume some of them didn't make it, but there is reference to a to a skeleton perhaps belonging to a four-legged friend. And we don't see anything that happens to that, but if you're triggered by that, obviously just know that that reference is in there.

SPEAKER_01 16:31

Listen, folks, when we originally gave the fishy category for the animal report, I really thought it was only going to be for Jaws. I love that we're getting more use out of it.

SPEAKER_03 16:41

I mean, this is literally a movie about tiny, tiny jaws. We got a bunch of little fish, so it makes sense.

SPEAKER_01 16:47

Let's go ahead and get into our ratings then. Piranha, 1978. Was it a hacker slash?

SPEAKER_03 16:51

All right, so I'm torn on how to rank this. This movie was a joke, and it was also difficult at times to tell if it if I was laughing with the movie or at it. There's a good amount of gore, quality or otherwise, a familiar storyline, a short runtime, these are all great ingredients, but there's wooden acting. There's piss poor dialogue and a general sense of cheesiness. I think ultimately when I compare it against other horror films released in this time period, it's a 51% kind of hack for me. It's it's a total joke, pretty much on purpose, but it does give me some strong waste of time feelings. So thus it's a hack.

SPEAKER_04 17:26

Yeah, I mean, look, this movie has its moments. There are definitely things that I can appreciate about the film. I like the practical effects. I think the gore was pretty decent in this film. I I think the effects, I think they're fun. I already mentioned that I really enjoyed the way the film was edited, but it's just not really my kind of movie. I was just never a huge fan of Jaws. I don't really enjoy movies like Lake Placid or Anaconda. They're just not my type of thing. And there's nothing wrong with liking those films. They are just not me. And I found myself just thinking about how ridiculous and absurd this plot really was, and finding myself kind of bored throughout a lot of the parts of the movie. And for that, I think I gotta hack this film.

SPEAKER_01 18:09

Well, this has taken a turn that I don't know if I was entirely expecting. Listen, one man's trash is another man's treasure. And in this case, I can't align with you all on some of the other shit we be slashing around here. But this one, I'm here for it. I mentioned earlier that the campier Jaws gets, the more I'm into it. And that's where I am with creature features. Unless it's Crawl, which honestly was a little bit of camp as often as I said Apex Predator, it was giving Evil Dyes Tonight, the more I like it. If you give me a serious creature feature, thinking about like open water, it's real, it's terrifying, it's spooky. That seems frightening, it's a good movie. But then give me Deep Blue C on the other side of that. How absurd. That's where piranha falls for me. I will agree with you, Mac, that for a while there it just becomes kind of like okay. It's getting indifferent most of the way through. But what this movie does in its third act and the last 30 minutes of the movie is more than enough to propel it into slash territory for me. Because yeah, it is absurd, it is a total joke and not a waste of time, and I found more entertainment value in Piranha than I did with Army of Darkness, which makes me a little sad. I know it's it feels sacrilegious, but because I think some of the efforts they go to with these little piranhas in this little body of water, I'm here for it. Now, with that, piranha from 1978 has earned two hacks and one slash. You can find this movie streaming online. Check the link in our show notes to where you can find it right now. So check it out and then join us in the second half so we can dive into these waters together. We'll see you in a bit.

SPEAKER_03 20:02

Hey there, adrenaline junkies. Are you ready for a fishing experience like no other? Then head on down to Razortooth Creek, where the fishing is extreme, the danger's real. We're talking piranhas, folks. These little guys may be small, but they've got more bite than a great watchdog. If you're brave enough to take on these homicidal critters, we've got just adventure for you. Our extreme fishing experiences will have you on the edge of your seat, reeling in those razor-tooth monsters like a crow. But beware, these piranhas aren't your average fish. They're meaner than a wolverine with a toothpick. So if you want to catch one of these bad boys, you better be prepared to fight tooth and nail. And remember, folks, danger is real. That's why we make everyone who visits Razortooth Creek sign away, just in case they become pirata job. But don't worry, we've got all the safety gear you need to make sure you come out of this adventure in one piece. So come on down to Razortooth Creek. The fish are big, the adventure's bigger, and the memories will last a lifetime.

SPEAKER_01 21:05

Welcome back, folks. You are now entering the spoiler zone for piranha, which has earned two hacks and one slash.

SPEAKER_04 21:17

Yeah, so this one was another one where it was pretty difficult to track all of the kills happening, specifically in the scenes where the piranha are attacking the camp kids and then the people at the aquarena. I do have a total of 32 kills that I can verify. That being said, there was a shot of all those like bodies laying on the shore of the lake with sheets covering them, or paramedics like carrying bodies across the screen. So it's hard to tell if those were already accounted for or not. But what were your favorite kills?

SPEAKER_03 21:49

I gotta say, the canoe dude got tore up. That was just like a big blood puddle, and I'm and I'm here for it.

SPEAKER_04 21:55

Yeah, that was the kid's father. They were fishing.

SPEAKER_03 21:57

Yep, and he got something, something was snagged. Yeah, it wasn't snag, dude. It was piranhas waiting to eat you up. They were hungry.

SPEAKER_04 22:04

Dude, those piranhas were pretty strong.

SPEAKER_03 22:07

We kind of forget, I think halfway into the film, that these aren't just, oops, some piranhas got loose. Like these are genetically modified piranhas. We legit saw a walking piranha in one of the first scenes of the movie, and yet we never see it again. But the other piranhas have we've got accelerated evolution effectively. These dudes are strong, they're fast, and they make babies like nobody's business. And so yeah, it makes sense that they are able to take down a dude in a canoe.

SPEAKER_04 22:33

Yeah, a little dino piranha.

SPEAKER_01 22:35

I think one of the things that stood out to me, A, I'm gonna give you my like real deal favorite kill is really a school of kills. It is all the kids. I'm sorry, that sounds absolutely terrible, but I cannot believe they went to the lengths of killing kids. And I'm not actually excited about that, don't get me wrong. I find the innocence of those kids heartbreaking. I don't think they deserved it. And even then, I find that technically some kids die, but it seemed more like they were just screaming and getting barely nibbled on because they definitely did not get it as bad as the adults got it. The kids were in the water, like flailing around, and everything was chill. One adult goes in the water, they're dragged down to the depths. It was giving dragged me to hell, except in the water. But my favorite not in death was the dog because I was so fucking nervous that that dog was gonna try to jump in after the piranhas. So when we just see that his owner got his legs nibbled, I was very satisfied.

SPEAKER_04 23:31

Listen, I I was expecting the piranha to be like jumping out of the water, nibbling on the dog. That's what I was expecting.

SPEAKER_03 23:38

You know what's funny about that is we we get to that scene later where the where the colonel goes into the water, right? Yeah. And and when he when he's standing there, I was like, oh, dude, a piranha's totally gonna jump out of that water and bite him. That would be so ridiculous. And this movie was like, yes, it would. Let's do it.

SPEAKER_04 23:54

I was waiting for that moment, the whole movie. I was waiting for the piranha to start jumping. And we got to see it in that moment. You know, Chris, talking about like to see the kids die, you're starting to sound a lot like me, you know, crossing the line.

SPEAKER_01 24:07

I don't think I'm actually starting to sound like you. I think the reality is that I just like when the stakes are raised a little bit, which now in retrospect, yes, I see how that makes me sound like you.

SPEAKER_04 24:18

I gotta say, the you know, Jack's kill, we can talk about Jack's kill. I think Jack's kill was pretty good. He's he got his feet eaten off, like to the bare bones, and they found his body as he like crawled up on shore after the dog scene. And man, that was I mean, look just seeing that, that was a really good effect of just seeing the bare bones' feet all nod off right to the bone, and you just he just, I don't know, I guess he bled to death afterwards or something, but that was a pretty that was a pretty gory kill for sure.

SPEAKER_03 24:47

I feel like it wouldn't even have to be bleeding to death. Like a a horde of piranhas ripping the flesh from your legs, it would just be shock. That's all that you would need to go out.

SPEAKER_04 24:56

There's also that kid, like I don't I don't know, obviously, we don't know a lot of the names of a lot of the kids or people that died, but there was that kid in the that died in the lake, and you see like his body float up and you can just see all the chunks missing from his face and his eyes are wide open. Like that was a pretty, pretty wild kill.

SPEAKER_01 25:14

That was absolutely disgusting. There was a point where it felt like there was like a mannequin head that was floating around that we got that those effects on, and I found myself really, really impressed with the equality of effects. But the other thing that I really enjoyed was even our main guy when he's like down there trying to do this whole bit to prevent the piranhas from escaping, and he's like holding his breath. As we get him being bitten more and more, and we get a little bit more and more of the red water, and we see what his wounds are starting to look like. I absolutely love that progression, but then all of a sudden those wounds are gone when he's like revealed at the ambulance by the end. I'm like, okay, guy, thanks. Whoops.

SPEAKER_03 25:56

Guess you found your flesh. He was down there for three minutes and came back to save us, you know.

SPEAKER_04 26:01

Yeah, dude. How how one super impressive that he could just even be down there holding his breath for three minutes or however long it was, doing nothing, let alone being down there wasting energy, turning the thing, and then being attacked by a school of piranha and being able to hold his breath without swallowing or intaking water or anything and drowning. Like, man, super impressive dude right there.

SPEAKER_03 26:24

Yeah, that's a minute 40 that he that he allotted. He said, Hey, count to 100, depending on how fast you count. We'll we'll just average it as as one per second, and we'll say that he, yeah, he was on there for a minute 40 seconds before he got ripped through the water.

SPEAKER_01 26:39

It was originally gonna be 300, not 100.

SPEAKER_03 26:42

Really?

SPEAKER_01 26:43

Mm-hmm. They felt it was too unrealistic.

SPEAKER_03 26:45

I would get bored of counting. I feel like if somebody said we count to 300, I'd be like, nah, dude, that's not gonna happen. Just I'll I'll estimate how long I need to count for.

SPEAKER_04 26:53

I would have lost count at some point.

SPEAKER_01 26:55

So we've been talking about some of the hostility here, some of these piranha attacks. One of my other favorite piranha attacks actually leads me straight into one of my favorite visuals in the movie, and it is when we get the water skier attacked by the piranhas. He's being pulled down, and then I realize holy shit, we have Jaws 1, we have Jaws 2, but I felt like Jaws 3 in retrospect took a page out of this book because that motherfucker went down. I mean, granted, you don't have it to the full scale in theatrics of Jaws 3D, that can't be beat. But when we have the water skier being attacked, then we get to see how that continues to escalate with a fucking boat explosion in the middle of the water. That shit was hilarious. I don't care. See, that is the kind of shit that pushed this in like further into slash territory because not only do we get the stakes being raised, but then we get a fucking boat explosion. This film knew what it was doing.

SPEAKER_03 27:48

This film was like, yo, we want a Universal Studios ride, make a boat explode. We already made a Jeep topple over, take it up to the next notch. It was it was kind of epic, and they had that whole setup where you can see things are going badly. First of all, those boats were way too close to each other in that tiny little river. And I am bothered by the the poor maritime practices that they have in this film, but it was epic and completely batshit, just unexpected.

SPEAKER_04 28:13

Also, no one's scuba diving around all that boat activity and stuff going on in the water. No, no one's dropping down and scuba diving with all that going on. So it serves those three scuba divers right for getting eaten by the piranha. Screw those guys.

SPEAKER_01 28:27

Wow, why are you victim shaming the scuba divers? They're just out here trying to have a good time, trying to get down in the water, and you're like, fuck those guys. That's why those piranhas ate them. That's right. Stand by it. Fuck your scuba privilege. You can afford that? Hmm. Feast on the 1%.

SPEAKER_03 28:42

It's a weird one, but I actually really enjoyed the claymation mutant fish, the one that was walking around the room. Uh it's it was freaking hilarious. It was fun. And there's like the mutant props, and they're moving and they're gurgling, and I just did not expect that whatsoever. I thought we were just gonna hear, yeah, we did genetically uh, you know, modify some fish and it didn't go super well or whatever. I didn't think we were gonna see like vials of like fish babies like with weird heads and stuff, and like you said, a dinosaur fish walking around. That was so next level and unexpected and kind of outrageous and kind of uncalled for that I absolutely loved it.

SPEAKER_04 29:16

That thing was awesome. I wish that thing attacked one of them. Like that would have been great. Just to get a little sequence of a fight scene between that mutated dino fish attacking one of those.

SPEAKER_01 29:26

You know, though, the plan was for that to be more present throughout the rest of the film, and I just I feel robbed that we didn't get it.

SPEAKER_03 29:32

Yeah. It gives me like tremor two vibes for sure.

SPEAKER_04 29:35

Yeah, visual elements. Like I mentioned earlier in the first half that I really love the editing throughout the film. I thought it was really well done. I just wish we got to see a little bit more of the kills and not just some nibbling. Like I would have liked to see, and I know like it's an older film, so they probably couldn't make it happen. Maybe they could, I don't know, but even to and maybe some of the newer ones did this, but just like to see the school of fish of the piranha swarming you and just slowly just tearing your skin and flesh off until you get to the bone underwater, that would have been really cool. That being said, I did also really enjoy, to your point, Max, some of the practical effects in the movie and the things that they did. I loved that one shot also in the beginning where David and Barbara jump into the pool and you see the one eye of the piranha open in the water, like silly, but pretty cool. Like that one a lot. And and some of the aftermath that you see that of what this what these piranha did to some of these people, those shots looked pretty good. Like you see the feet bare bone, you see the dude floating up, you know, with his face mutilated, you see that one kid or whatever being carried out of the water with like all the flesh eaten off of his back. Like there's some pretty good, gruesome scenes throughout the film that I thought they did really well with those practical effects and the and the things that they did. So I did really enjoy that.

SPEAKER_03 30:52

The fact that they were able to show us those piranha attacks with such like choppy editing, a lot of going back and forth, a lot of movement, it really gave it a feeling of being frantic, and it was super effective. That sound that they coupled with that, when those attacks happened, I think that was more effective than the sound that we get when Jaws is about to attack.

SPEAKER_01 31:15

Okay. We have a great score when Jaws is about to attack, but the actual sound design on this, they took dental drills and just like put them underwater and then used microphones to capture that sound. And I love the fucking sound of the piranhas so much. Just like in the Army of Darkness episode, when I talked about how much I loved the skeletons talking or the skeletes, if you will. I absolutely loved these sound effects too, because it added to the comedy, even though it wasn't inherently like a funny thing. Damn, man, I can't believe this. I think I might like these little piranhas more than I like the shark from Jaws.

SPEAKER_04 31:53

Ooh, dang. And I think they also used like sticks on like the fake fish to make the piranha look like they were moving in the water, which is kind of cool to think about.

SPEAKER_01 32:03

It's giving the Muppets, and I think that's why I love it. I'm not saying it's like quality-wise better than Bruce, the animatronic shark, who is honestly really problematic and created such a nightmare for production. I'm not saying that, but I am saying they're cuter.

SPEAKER_03 32:16

Sean, now you make me want to see a Muppet version of this movie.

SPEAKER_04 32:21

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_03 32:22

I want all of the piranhas to be Muppets and maybe a couple characters, and I would be so down to watch that.

SPEAKER_04 32:28

Oh, that would be great. That would be great.

SPEAKER_01 32:30

Oh, someone get Kerman on the phone.

SPEAKER_04 32:33

The Muppets visit Lost Lake.

SPEAKER_02 32:35

So apparently we've got some lost teenagers here, and we're trying to find them, but there's these deadly fish everywhere.

SPEAKER_04 32:40

Oh, you're fucking mwah! Ridiculous. There were some good like little references or Easter eggs, if you will, in the movie too. They're not a ton of them, but and this one is not a visual reference, but the the mention of the creature from the Black Lagoon. They also had like the Jaws arcade console that I think Maggie was playing, and then someone I think is also reading Moby Dick at some point, which I think was super fitting.

SPEAKER_03 33:03

That's amazing. That's some you've got some solid references, Brow. That's the vibe I'm getting in that because I didn't I didn't really catch a lot of that stuff, and it makes it seem so much more deliberate now. Yeah. Really intentional.

SPEAKER_04 33:15

This is one of those movies where if you look away for like even a moment, or you look down at your phone and you look back up, odds are you probably missed something really quick.

SPEAKER_01 33:25

For sure. The Moby Dick moment and then the Jaws video game at the beginning of the movie were two that I found a lot of satisfaction in. But then also, obviously, not an Easter egg, but the fact that you know we get the gentleman who's in this movie who's also in Gremlins. Like there are some fun connections in here that ex that kind of give way to bigger world building, not literally in the piranha franchise, but just knowing what an origin point this is for so many people, like Joe Dante, like Rob Botton. Then knowing now, like what the fuck James Cameron did Piranha 2, the spawning? Are you fucking kidding me? Honestly, Piranha walked so Titanic could run, and that's amazing. I love that.

SPEAKER_03 34:09

I I could just imagine him filming Piranha 2, and he's like, there's something I just I'm feeling a draw to the water. I need more time there.

SPEAKER_01 34:17

Well, maybe he looked at those piranhas and thought he was king of the world. But look, we talked about some of the visuals in here. I think another one of those for me that that was pretty stellar was the red blood in the water and like how we get that coloring. In terms of like how that translates to a scene for me, there are some moments that I loved with anything that that involved that blood in the water. So again, we have this moment where kind of shit hits the fan and these piranhas are attacking the kids, and we get people more and more attacked, and we get that viciousness. But I think outside of that immediate gore, for me, my favorite scenes are A, that, but then B, the beginning and end of this movie when we have these bodies of water just slowly fading into red. Because I think it it shows A the potential, right? It is the potential of how brutal and how devastating this kind of menace could be.

SPEAKER_03 35:15

Yeah, we haven't even touched on the fact that if this were to happen in real life to the scale, like this is an incredibly invasive species. So yeah, they're dangerous for us, but for other marine life, it would be a massive issue. And I'm I'm I don't know if they explore that at all in future in future films, but yeah, that's that's frightening enough where it's like, hey, we can't go fishing anymore because the piranha ate everything.

SPEAKER_04 35:38

That's true. At least they do travel in schools, so maybe well, they're breeding probably too, but maybe there's a chance to bait them and I don't know, try to net them in some way, but maybe they'll just chew through the net.

SPEAKER_03 35:52

In the end, orcas will end up destroying them anyway, because orcas are badasses. But to to take things back, the blood in the water brings me to my favorite scene, and that is the canoe rescue scene where they get the kid off the canoe after his dad's, of course, piranha food. That blood in that water is absolutely epic. We also get the doctor's death, and he gets he gets pretty beat up as well. But the the part that cracked us up was like as he's dying, he's like he tilts his head over, his eyes are open, they close, and then by the time his head turns all the way to the side, they're open again. It was such bad acting that it was hilarious. We literally had to laugh at it.

SPEAKER_04 36:30

Yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_01 36:31

It was genuinely awful, but I think that also added to that campy moment for me. I somehow didn't mind it at all.

SPEAKER_04 36:39

I see the camp throughout the movie, but then there was moments like you just mentioned with and I don't I don't see that as like good camp for me. Like that just seemed like a oops, we didn't pay attention to detail moment. There is good stuff that I thought was funny that I thought maybe was meant to be campy, but also absurd, like the scene where they're somehow figuring out how to unravel the Tom Sawyer like log raft, but then they can't figure out how to chew through a fucking plastic rubber raft.

SPEAKER_03 37:11

Yeah, that is that is kind of funny. They took that raft apart. I forget what they called it, but you know, they went they went after that thing. They were like going after it methodically as well, so they're way too smart.

SPEAKER_01 37:20

Okay, but my impression was that they only started nomining on that because of the blood seeping through onto the rope. So I it sounded to me and looked to me as though they weren't necessarily intentionally trying to dismantle the raft, but rather they were feeding on the bloody bits of the rope that was fastening it together.

SPEAKER_03 37:40

The doctor hopped into the water way too soon. They were like going to meet the kid on the canoe, and he could just go scoot-scoot right onto their little raft, but instead he was like, I gotta save him and swim for seven minutes while these piranhas destroy me. That was not a smart move. I mean, this guy is is responsible for these things. So not only did he doom them all with these doom piranhas, but then his blood ended up destroying their raft anyway.

SPEAKER_01 38:08

Yeah, he didn't really think that through, let's be honest. And I think it's also bizarre that he is suddenly so overcome with emotion after seeing the emotional devastation and the physical devastation of these piranhas that he thought, we'll never make it in time. I simply must swim over there to be a bridge for the when you do finally make it in time. Like, what the fuck?

SPEAKER_03 38:28

Damn these piranha.

SPEAKER_01 38:30

Okay, look, we've spoken a great deal about some of the absurd moments in this movie, some of the absurdity that we get from some of its characters and its scores, and even the piranhas themselves. I just want to kick off by acknowledging one of our first pieces of dialogue in the movie. Let's get wet. Barbara, good for you. You really started this movie strong. You uh helped make this like a likable entry for me. When we had these two kind of lurking about, figuring out how they were gonna skinny dip, etc. Whatever. I was like, okay, I I was expecting like a they're coming for you, Barbara moment with the piranhas. Sadly, we didn't get that on the nose dialogue. But I found myself with the level of performances we got finding, okay, this is exactly what I expected it to be.

SPEAKER_04 39:20

I mean, let's just be real. All of the characters in this film are just pretty cheesy. So there's nothing, there's nothing spectacular happening here. There's some good moments that make you laugh. There's some good moments of camp, but I think the major thing for me is that we just didn't get very much real, like any real character development to invest in any of these characters, even when you look at Paul. Like, I guess we it hints at like his backstory, but you really don't get very much as to like why he's in that situation. You just get Paul thrown in your face, and he's just apparently a drunk guy that decided to move to the woods, like for no just because he he got dumped by his wife. Like, I don't know. It's just a strange scenario, and so it didn't it didn't keep me invested.

SPEAKER_01 40:07

Here's the thing he arguably has one of the only two character arcs in this whole fucking movie. One, he's a drunk who doesn't want to help anyone who almost dies by helping everyone, but then two, his daughter doesn't want to go in the water, then builds up the nerve and the courage to go in the water. So really the Grogan family is keeping the whole fucking thing together and trying to do some shit.

SPEAKER_04 40:29

Yeah, I mean they're doing stuff. I'm just talking about character development here. I'm talking about like getting enough of their story to invest. Like I get they overcame whatever the fuck and they went out there and did the thing, but uh that's just cookie cutter shit. Like, guy doesn't want to be involved and gets involved and bees the and becomes the hero. Cool.

SPEAKER_01 40:48

Let us not forget that he's an alcoholic because his wife left him.

SPEAKER_04 40:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 40:51

And let us not forget that this young girl was faking an injury, she was malingering. That honestly is indicative of a future of crime for her. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 40:59

I don't know. I think we need to talk about Maggie, though. Because Maggie just like walks into this dude's house and then calls him out left and right.

SPEAKER_04 41:07

Yeah, dude. Who does that? Who just like, okay, I'm going to this dude's cabin, willy-nilly, I'm walking in and I'm like, you're gonna take me up the mountain. Who the fuck are you? If that's in any real life situation with a guy with a Texas belt buckle, you're getting a shotgun to the fucking dome.

SPEAKER_03 41:25

Not only does she do that, but she's in his house giving him crap, walks out of the house and is like, hey, are there any more shacks around here? He's like, first of all, it's a cabin, you know? Thank you very much. Yeah. Yeah, get that right.

SPEAKER_01 41:36

Their whole bit, honestly, I I wasn't really buying them as a tandem. Like, I get that they worked together well. I get that they lasted throughout the whole movie and their companionship, but I was a little over them.

SPEAKER_03 41:47

It seems strange like they're trying to pair them up on per uh on purpose, right? And but there's like no romantic thing going on. There's no chemistry for that. That would be just weird.

SPEAKER_01 41:57

Which is great. I I can at least acknowledge that. But even then, I still felt like there's no way you two would be working this well together.

SPEAKER_03 42:03

Yeah, I mean, maybe maybe his grumpiness is all just a facade and he's just seeking companionship in any form.

SPEAKER_04 42:09

Could be. I don't even know where he got all the energy, not drinking literally any water and just booze in that canteen.

SPEAKER_03 42:15

Yeah, that is true. He's completely dehydrated at this point. And at one point he drank salt water. So yeah, his his poor liver, you know?

SPEAKER_01 42:23

Yeah. Honestly, he was barely clinging to life at the end. I think he's gonna go. Piranha too, the spawning is gonna be like his respawn point because he fucking died.

SPEAKER_03 42:31

Can we talk about Dick Miller for a minute? Because this guy is great, okay? We've Buck Gardner is is hilarious as a character because he knows what's going on, but at the same time, it's all about the business. And it's such a character of all these other characters in these Jaws-like movies. It's hilarious. It's Jurassic Park right there. I love it.

SPEAKER_04 42:53

Yeah, that's true. That's true. And this and this motherfucker lives too. He doesn't, I mean, he's just all about he's probably opening this place up tomorrow.

SPEAKER_03 43:02

Right. He's like, well, we gotta gotta make our money back.

SPEAKER_01 43:05

So okay, as great as Dick Miller was in this movie, I think we get him at his best in that third act when we see the culmination of this entire event, and then we see what he's like at the end of this movie, kind of pushing people around. But I think that's what kind of creates the contrast that makes way for what is for me the worst part of this movie, which is literally the first hour of the movie, the first 50-something minutes of the movie outside of that opening scene. We have what is really just a ton of mediocrity, and the only cool thing are Seven of the Deaths, that dog, the piranha noise, and that's it. A lot of what we get with Paul, well a lot of what we get with Maggie and the doctor, it was there and moved things along, but I just wasn't crazy about it.

SPEAKER_03 43:53

I'm glad that you covered that because that's obviously something I felt as somebody who who gave it a fifty one percent hack. But I get to steal your. Best part of the movie, and talk about the fact that they really went there in the in the last third of this film. They took things up, like they were at a four, and they were like, okay, forget this, go to an 11. They really amped things up, a ton of piranha attacks at the end. The boat explosion, like you mentioned, it was just so much just adrenaline going for a good like 20 minutes. And nobody wants harm to come to children, but this film was like, nobody is safe. And I think if anyone else made a movie like this, they would go, oh, they swoop in at the last possible second and they tell them and they believe them and they get everybody out of the water. And it's almost like, no, they don't believe them. That's the point. And everyone is is getting attacked. And you think it's gonna be over in like a minute, and people are gonna be swimming out of the water, and they like linger for like five, six minutes, showing this group of people at this resort get chewed up and chomped on, even at the camp with the kids. They just let you watch it left and right, kids getting chewed on. You can't tell like who's who, who's gonna make it. You know, we get to see Growth's daughter like go out in the water and be brave and everything, finally, and and and save one person. That's how not scared they were of going there because okay, there's two girls, she's got a big enough boat, but one of them doesn't get to make it. This film was like, at this point, we're crossing lines and we don't care. And nobody else, I think, would would do that. This is the point where now we get to be safe and we get to save people and we'll look at what we avoided. And I think it's pretty stellar that they said no, turn it up to 11 and leave it there until the very end.

SPEAKER_04 45:31

I agree with what you're both saying for sure. I mean, there's so many absurd things about this film, right? And and I know I'm I'm talking about best part because I hack this film, but before I jump into that, I just gotta say the plot of this film was absolutely ridiculous. The reason why these fish were even made in the first place was absolutely absurd. Um, but if I had to pick a part that really what you're all saying is true. Like the best part of this film is really what they did in just the last half or the last third of the movie with just the piranha attacks and the editing of those scenes where the piranha are attacking and the practical effects of the kills in the aftermath. Like that that's the best part of the film for me, and it's just a shame that it wasn't enough to make it a slash for me.

SPEAKER_01 46:25

Okay, it didn't make it a slash for you, but did it leave you interested enough to be open to re-watching this?

SPEAKER_04 46:30

Well, I'll tell you right now, this is a one and done for me. I have no real desire to watch this one again. It's just not my type of movie.

SPEAKER_03 46:37

Yeah, I think I've seen enough, but I I am intrigued by the other entries in the piranha world. I am very curious about the remake. I'm also very curious about piranhas in 3D. Because fish and 2D are interesting. Fish in 3D, that's you've you've got my attention now.

SPEAKER_01 46:54

And I bet your attention is really gotten by Piranha 3 Double D.

SPEAKER_03 46:59

I think that's just meant to get anyone's attention.

SPEAKER_01 47:02

Not mine. However, when we're wrapped up tonight, I will be searching for the next piranha movie I can find. I don't care if it's even in sequential order. I kind of just want to watch a fucked up creature feature with piranhas now. So I'd be open to exploring this again, maybe if I watch like one and two back to back. You know, if I if I see this experience versus what the James Cameron Piranha experience is. But I don't think it's one that I'll ever like frequently re-watch when I'm in the mood for a creature feature every summer.

SPEAKER_03 47:32

That's left for Anaconda.

SPEAKER_01 47:34

And Lake Placid. You can't go wrong with either. And Crawl. Honestly, they're so good. I think I'm gonna make a full extensive list of all my favorite creature features. But until then, there you have it, folks. Piranha from 1978 has earned two hacks and a one slash. Look at me defending its honor. While we've certainly had a robust discussion here, the conversation doesn't end here by any means.

SPEAKER_04 47:55

Yeah, we want to know what you think. Is Piranha just a watered down jaws? Did it pack enough of a bite to stand on its own? Let us know. You can join in on the conversation by hanging out with us for free in our Discord. Click the link in our show notes to sign up.

SPEAKER_03 48:08

And if you've enjoyed listening to this fishiness, consider becoming one of our patrons. Visit patreon.com/slash hackerslash to enjoy more of the show with early access, extended episodes, bonus content, and live shows.

SPEAKER_01 48:19

We'll see you next time, folks. And remember, people eat fish. Fish don't eat people.

SPEAKER_04 48:24

Sometimes you have to destroy in order to save.