374: Strange Darling (2024)

SPEAKER_03 0:04

Oh my god, they must smell so terrible.

SPEAKER_04 0:11

Greetings and salutations, and welcome to Hackerslash. If you're joining us again, welcome back. Are you a serial killer? If this is your first time listening, welcome to the party. We are a horror movie review podcast dedicated to telling you whether a movie is a hack.

SPEAKER_02 0:26

A total joke, a waste of time, or a slash. Totally killer, pun intended.

SPEAKER_04 0:31

We believe horror is for everyone, and as such, we're rateing these movies with the perspective we've gained from our varying walks of life and the flavors of fear we fancy most. My name is Chris, I'm your friendly neighborhood slash enthusiast. This week I'm joined by the Superfly Space Guy Mac.

SPEAKER_00 0:45

You couldn't do it after all that.

SPEAKER_04 0:48

The classic horror connoisseur Sean, Mr. Snuffilephagus, and the paranormal paramour, Biggs. You seem like a nice guy, but you never really know. The people who've spoken and our patrons have decided which movie we're covering this week.

SPEAKER_02 1:01

And for our patrons, you also get to hear our B-side at the end of this episode where we get into some ridiculous first date situations.

SPEAKER_04 1:09

Absolutely. Now this week's film comes to us after a fraught production that was shut down, endured harsh criticism from studio executives, and demands for its leading lady to be recast. It overcame those hurdles, though, to become what many considered to be one of the best horror films of 2024. And the film shows us that sometimes a single night can change everything, and a chance encounter, even a fleeting connection, can spark unparalleled chaos. This week, after winning 71% of the overall patron vote, we're talking about Strange Darling.

SPEAKER_06 1:42

This movie was nominated by our patron Tommy, who says, Strange Darling is not just a beautiful looking film, but it's one that ends up being oddly striking on paper as well. Amazing performances, great direction, and an amazing job of editing, which truly has a grasp on how the film plays out for the viewer.

SPEAKER_04 1:58

Well, we'll see if we agree, Tommy. Who's seen this one before?

SPEAKER_02 2:01

I will say that I remember this one coming out way back in August, right? I think it was like August of 2024, and I remember hearing some low rumblings about this movie when it did come out. And I know that initially the name just stood out to me, Strange Darling. It just something about the title was intriguing. And I ended up watching this one probably, I don't know, like a month before it showed up in the lineup. And so I was like, okay, well, I get to watch it a second time. But it's just one of those movies that like I heard a little bit about when it first came out. And I feel like as the year progressed, I kept hearing it circle back. And then by the end of the year, I heard it on a lot of people's top 10 list.

SPEAKER_06 2:48

Yes, like mine. So at the end of the year episode, I mentioned that this was like my honorable mention that we didn't get to in 2024. I've talked a bit about how I really thought this was going to be my favorite horror of the year until Nasferatu basically swooped in at the last minute. But when it came to the film's premiere, I had heard of it because, as we know, I love Kyle Gallner and he had promoted it on his Instagram. I don't really remember if I had seen a trailer, but I do remember that seeing it from his Instagram, I was like, I need to catch this in theaters. I thought I was gonna miss it because a lot of things had come up. Was able to catch it just in time. I went with one of my closest friends and his sister, and so glad that I got that theater experience.

SPEAKER_02 3:32

I did not get the theater experience.

SPEAKER_06 3:34

It was something else. But I did now the thing is though, we did show up a little bit late, like just a smidge. So I'm so glad that I was able to re-watch it again with Chris so that I could catch a particular moment at the beginning that I didn't actually know was there.

SPEAKER_04 3:49

Suddenly it all makes sense.

SPEAKER_00 3:52

I'm intrigued to find out what that was, but I don't think I was aware of this movie. When I heard the word darling, all I could think of was like, Don't worry, darling, but this did not ring a bell. I was completely out of the loop.

SPEAKER_04 4:04

Don't worry, darling. Is that the one with Florence Pugh and Harry Styles? Yes. Yeah. Ugh. Okay. I love Florence Pugh, but I do not like Harry Styles very much. I really wanted to see this when it was in theaters. I never got around to it. I remember this specifically seeing the trailer and having a immediate instinct about what this movie would end up being. One, I wanted to see it because Allie has this whole fucking joke that I'm a serial killer because of my handwriting, and ah, man, even though it's Kyle Gonner and I'm not a huge fan of him, I had a feeling that Binx would fucking eat the shit up. But this movie looked really interesting based on the trailer. It looked obvious, a little too obvious, which set a very particular expectation for me, which I will not share here in the spoiler-free section, where I have shared it already. Binx mentioned that we watched this movie together. She and I actually did watch along commentary for this movie for her millionth time watching this. Well, not millionth, but second. And then my first time watching this, she shared some behind-the-scenes facts, uh, etc. And thinking about like the producer and the cinematography for the film. So there was a lot there to unpack. I shared my expectation for this movie right at the beginning, right before we actually started watching it. And you'll find out later on in this episode how that impacted me. But I think the way this trailer was cut was really interesting. Obviously, the storytelling in this movie is what makes the entire experience of the movie, and I think the trailer did a good job of not completely revealing that. It all and almost I think try to subvert the expectations. But I'm curious for Mac, what were you expecting?

SPEAKER_00 5:41

I honestly didn't know what to expect until I started, and so I think it's like two minutes in. I'm thinking to myself, uh, this is not gonna be fun. I'm not gonna have a good time. This is just gonna be too gruesome or too violent or something like that. I thought it was gonna be more of like an exploitation kind of film, and I wasn't into that.

SPEAKER_02 5:59

I think it's interesting we're talking about expectations going into the movie. I would not recommend watching a trailer. I wouldn't recommend going into this one with any kind of clue. Like go into this movie completely blind because if you know nothing about this movie, I feel like you're gonna have the most enjoyable experience. I feel like the way this movie delivers its plot, the way the story unravels, I think you're in for a wild ride. And the entire time I was watching this movie, I went from feeling like I knew the direction this movie was going in, and then it would take a sharp turn and go in a direction I didn't see coming. So I feel like the less you know about the movie, the better it's gonna be for you.

SPEAKER_04 6:40

And to be clear, Sean, did you have those trailers and the expectations going into it?

SPEAKER_02 6:45

No, I heard about this movie when it came out. I remember hearing the title, I remember it coming into conversations, but I never watched the trailer. When we decided to watch this movie, not for the podcast. My wife was like, Oh, let's watch Strange Darling. And I'm like, Strange Darling, that sounds so familiar. Like, I keep hearing it. Yeah, let's do it. But at the time, and I think somebody recommended it too. But at the time, you had to either buy it or rent it for like $20 or buy it for $25, or it was something like that. And I'm like, Well, for a few more dollars, I'm just gonna buy it. It's highly rated. I'll probably want to watch it again. And that was a good instinct.

SPEAKER_04 7:22

So, what concerns me about this is that okay, if you've seen the trailer, I think that's one thing. What has concerned me about this movie and the approach it takes to its storytelling is almost saying go in blind, it's a crazy ride almost ruins the experience, I feel like.

SPEAKER_06 7:42

Why do you think that? That's interesting that you say that because a lot of the things that I've been told, so I saw it on Kyle's Instagram, but I saw a couple people review the film as well that got like early screenings, and they kept saying the same thing, go in blind, go in blind. So I say that I maybe saw the trailer because I go to the movies all the time, but I actually don't think I did because I was completely taken off course when I was watching the movie. But I think that that's good because if you have seen the trailer, I think that you're already gonna have a preconceived notion of what the movie's about. So you therefore are gonna have theories of what the movie's about.

SPEAKER_04 8:19

I'm not gonna say to not have those expectations or those preconceived notions. I'm not saying that. But what I am saying is to say and to almost build up the idea of like you have to not know anything going in. I feel like it almost over-promises an experience that doesn't quite get fulfilled.

SPEAKER_02 8:40

Yeah, I see what you're saying. I think it just depends on the kind of person you are, right? If you overanalyze things while you're watching it, and if you don't just like go if someone says go into it blind and you just go into it not reading or watching a trailer and you sit down to watch the movie and you just kind of let the movie take you through its course, then I think that's where it shines, right? But if you're someone that like, even if no one tells you to, just starts a movie and immediately starts to guess things just because you want to find out, or you're the kind of person that has to look up the ending before you get to the fucking ending, you know what I mean? Like, then this is not the movie for you.

SPEAKER_06 9:17

I agree. Because the thing about this movie is that it's nonlinear storytelling. So when I first watched it, that to me was so exciting. But that told me, okay, I have one of two ways to go about this. Either I treat this like a puzzle, like a mystery, and I love mysteries and I love solving things, but then I'm probably going to ruin it for myself because then I'm going to be able to catch on to whatever's happening very, very quickly because I consume that stuff very often. Or let me just stop, let the let my brain shut down and just like feel what's happening, see what's happening, and let the movie tell me what's happening little by little. And I think that because I did that, I was really having a good time throughout. And I was shocked at certain points. It had me question my own theories, you know, because eventually that's gonna it's gonna evoke something out of you. It's gonna make you think, oh, is this what's happening? And that's fine. But if like instantly right off the bat I see a particular scene because it drops you right in the middle and you're like, okay, yeah, that's probably what's gonna happen or not, you're probably not gonna have as much of a good time if you just let yourself be.

SPEAKER_00 10:22

It's interesting that you mentioned that whole shtick because that whole playing with the sequence of events kind of bothered me at first. It was just kind of annoying. I was like, is this necessary? You know, famously I hate flashbacks, and when you tell a story out of order, I'm not always the biggest fan. You really have to nail it for it to work well. I think eventually you almost look forward to the next jump because you're like, hmm, okay, like I wonder what's gonna happen next time that you know we go back or forward in time.

SPEAKER_02 10:51

Yeah, and I think part of what made this movie feel unique were just the twists and turns that it takes throughout its entire runtime. I feel like if there's one thing this movie does, I feel like it's constantly allowing you to be met with surprises along the entire runtime of this film.

SPEAKER_04 11:12

This movie certainly structures itself to deliver what it expects to be a surprise for the audience. And it's fun for sure. Like I had a great time watching this with Binks. I think this movie is fucking stunning to look at. I think it's entertaining. I think a lot of parts and moments it's amusing. And I think there are other moments where it's like, ooh, okay, this feels very visceral. But there's a reason, a lot of reasons that I like this movie, but I don't think any of it has anything to do with its approach to nonlinear storytelling. Like it was good, it was effective. And I think if you didn't have that, I think I would still like the story. You know what I mean? I I know that it's supposed to elevate it and supposed to make you feel like you're on these twists and turns and make you feel like okay, this is something that you're not gonna see coming. But I think at the end of the day, when you look at the story that we got and the characters that we get, I think I still would have been invested if we even if we didn't have that. So I don't know, it it's interesting. This movie did not feel, I think, in a lot of ways surprising, but it's still well executed to just be entertaining.

SPEAKER_06 12:11

I think for me, what I found to be so surprising is its overall topic. It's a pretty polarizing topic that it addresses and the things that they get into and the characters that are in this film. So we can't really get into it because as we said, like we want to keep that, you know, spoiler-free. But I also want to preface that there is a potential like trigger warning here. It does involve what may be an attempt of assault, and I'll I'm phrasing that way in particular because it doesn't get there. But so just a heads up on that front. But I would say that in general, the topic is something that at the end of the movie, at least for me, when I first watched it with my friends, we were like outside of the theater talking about it for a bit, like, whoa, like there's a lot of conversation that can go on here, not just from the main characters, but the different characters that start coming up as the film goes on and the way that they treat the scenario. So I think it'll at the very least be good conversation if you watch with someone else.

SPEAKER_04 13:10

For sure, good conversation. And the other, here's the thing about that there is these there are these moments in life, and maybe you've all experienced this as well. Have you all watched a movie with your parents, and then there's a sex scene, and you're like, oh, I don't want to be here for that. Yep, yep, yeah. This has one of those moments. Binx and I were sitting on the couch, we're like, this is super uncomfy. And you know what? We watched some weird shit. All right. So this isn't about Binx and I, but this movie has a way of making you feel uncomfortable, which again, I say it's well executed and effective. The disappointment that I have though actually starts to fall in line with a little bit of what Binx is saying here, with some discussion of a greater message that it this movie appears to be giving or hinting at or giving a nod to. There's a moment in the third act of this film where I'm like, oh, we were doing a really good job here, and I feel like we just fumbled. Like you finished the race, but something just happened here in the execution where I feel like it almost distracted and maybe struggled right back around to saying something that I didn't even intend to say. And that is problematic for me.

SPEAKER_00 14:18

Yeah, I watched it and immediately thought they have a message or they have something deeper that they want to communicate here, but I don't think it needs it to still be enjoyable, to still be entertaining. And in some parts it's a little bit too heavy-handed, like a little bit too ridden into dialogue, I feel like, in in some small parts. But for the rest of it, thankfully, you don't really have to pay attention to that just to get the pure like entertainment value out of it if you don't want to, which is good for different layers of people who watch this. But I think like the technical execution is what surprised me the most. I mean, that was what a pleasant surprise. We start out, and especially the first thing we see on screen, moving into the next scene. I'm thinking this is gonna be just low budget, student, dodgy quality, right? But we got some like vivid colors that hit fairly early on. And I was like, uh, they're gonna do something here. This film is gonna be so nice to look at, and they did not fail us. I think the through the rest of the film, not only did they make great use of that, which was like, okay, you're keeping up with this, but then they make a shift tonally and in the color. And so I think that was one good job seeing what you had to work with and getting out of it. But it was like, it was nice because I didn't think that this film was gonna deliver something that good to look at.

SPEAKER_02 15:37

There's a lot of good in this movie, and there are some disappointments. Like, I do have a couple of things that stood out to me. I felt a little bit disappointed. This is gonna sound weird at first, but I felt a little bit disappointed in the characters in a way. Don't get me wrong, like the acting I feel like is great, but I think that the character development or lack thereof did not allow for me to truly be invested in either of the two main characters. Like I wasn't truly invested in in either two main characters one way or another throughout the film. So I think that was one thing that worked against it. And don't get me started with this old couple. We're gonna get into it. Don't even get me started with that shit.

SPEAKER_04 16:20

But Howard and Pearl.

SPEAKER_02 16:23

Yeah, yeah. But I think my biggest disappointment with this film is that there really was no scares in this movie. I feel like I don't think that there was one moment that was really scary. It felt more like one of those true crime thriller movies than a horror movie, you know, aside from the gore that we get, of course. But I just didn't get a lot of scare factor out of this thing.

SPEAKER_04 16:47

Okay. I'd like to see your lack of scares and raise you a scare. The scare of the effects of tobacco and cigarette smoke and lung cancer risks. I don't know how many fucking packs of cigarettes were consumed during the production of this film, but there should have been a counter. I was telling Binkstrom during the watch-along, this is what we should have been tracking all along. Had I known, we would have rewound and just gone back to the beginning and fucking take a shot every time someone lights a cigarette. But to your point, that isn't the only thing scary about this movie.

SPEAKER_02 17:19

There was a lot of cigarette smoking and in really bad timing. Like there was moments where we shouldn't be smoking.

SPEAKER_06 17:25

We know the one because we talked about that too. And I should have remembered because Paris loves this movie. And I remember in her review on Letterboxd, she was saying that Willa Fitzgerald specifically is like the new Jessica Lange like cigarette actress.

SPEAKER_02 17:43

Oh, nice. I like that actually. I like that take.

SPEAKER_00 17:47

So are they real cigarettes or are they pro like the prop cigarettes that I don't even know what they use for that, but ones that are not full of nicotine and tobacco and stuff.

SPEAKER_04 17:54

You know what? It's probably props, but in the world of the movie, in the movies universe, emphysema.

SPEAKER_00 18:02

I think two more packs will do it for them. You can feel the emphysema coming through the screen.

SPEAKER_06 18:06

Oh boy.

SPEAKER_00 18:07

But yeah, I think you're right. You know, I think of other serial killer movies like Taking Lives, and those were 100% thrillers, that were probably scarier than this, which is crazy because this is much grittier and much more gruesome than anything like that.

SPEAKER_02 18:22

Right.

SPEAKER_00 18:23

It it is odd. It's kind of like I get it, and there's parts of this that, like you said, are going to be very triggering, so choose carefully. But I think it's weird that it doesn't feel like a scary movie. It just feels like it, like you said, another serial killer film. It's like their own genre now. Boy, are we desensitized.

SPEAKER_02 18:41

No, I don't think it's a desensitization factor here. I think that this one, as graphic and violent as it may be, it wasn't really that frightening. You know what I mean? But I do think the premise of this movie, although sounding pretty familiar, the way it's delivered in its execution, is where I feel like it feels original because I feel like, Binks, you said it, the nonlinear timeline takes you down this path full of like little twists and turns. And so the way that it allows the story to unravel feels original, even though the overall premise it really isn't that original.

SPEAKER_06 19:20

Yeah, I agree. And I think what I appreciate is that it's not trying to be James Wan. It's not trying to do the overt flashback thing. It knows what it is, and it's kind of like our patron Tommy said, it's also just a great read. And JT Molner, he really thought of this film as if it was a screenplay, like thinking of it like as a screenplay type situation, like read this and how entertaining this would be in chapters that you'd want to read this screenplay, but then also watch it. And the little moments where every new scene, we can say, when it's unveiled, it's like, okay, I'm interested now. Now I'm invested. Now I'm trying to piece this puzzle. So it's still that, you know, for the thriller fans that love that mystery like I do, you want to piece the puzzle together. You can still get that, but just let yourself like follow the process. Don't jump the gun and try to get to the end before the movie reveals the end for you. And I think what's really cool about this too is that I agree the actual plot itself may not be so original, but he thought of this film just by thinking of the opening scene, the literal intro. He thought of that scene. I believe it was just like in a daydream or something like that. He's like, what would a movie look like if it started like this? Or what would the plot be if it was like this? And he just took it and ran. And I feel like that's so fun. Like, that's storytelling, that's cinema, right? Like thinking of just one particular moment and your imagination running wild and seeing what you kind of shenanigans you can come up with if it was just off of one scene.

SPEAKER_00 20:53

I love that. I think it it does feel original while you're watching. And I don't even know if it's about the time stuff. I mean, I know that's part of it because not every film does that. So if you set yourself apart, you get a little cred for that. But like, you know, we've been bombarded with serial killer media for decades at this point. And so any story you come up with was probably already in law and order at some point, so you gotta really spruce it up a bit to be interesting. But I think it's got its own original spin here. One in terms of the story, which it's not an M. Night Shyamalan movie. Don't go into this looking, trying to solve the twist. That's super boring, and you're not gonna find that kind of result here. But I think they were able to use a mechanism which I typically don't enjoy by moving around in in time back and forth and telling different scenes before and after each other, combined with a story that's going to be slightly off the beaten path for most serial killer movies. I think the combination there with the signing visuals is what makes this its own separate piece here.

SPEAKER_04 21:53

Listen, man, we've seen serial killer movies before. We've seen twists and turns before, we've seen nonlinear story. I mean, look, Quentin Tarantino's been out here doing the damn thing. A lot of what this movie employs, we have already seen, even how beautiful it is. We've already seen really pretty movies. That doesn't mean that this movie isn't good or that it isn't interesting or that it doesn't feel like a unique experience. But I don't know that you're gonna walk into this scene something you've literally never seen before. And that's okay. There's nothing wrong with it. Because what this movie then needs to be is just really well executed, which it was right up until its ending. And that is again the the biggest disappointment I have with this movie. Not with what we get at the very end of the movie to throw back to when we broke used to break down the endings and segments, maybe the pre-end, not the end end of the movie. But man, I cannot tell you what a bad taste I left in my mouth. And even just thinking about what the experience was like watching this with Binks, we're talking about it for a few minutes during and then after the movie, it's one of those where it's like, I feel like we built up a lot here just to really let the movie buckle under the weight of its own weak knees.

SPEAKER_02 23:04

Interesting.

SPEAKER_06 23:06

Yeah, I think that having watched it again with you and that discussion we had about the ending definitely got the wheels turning a bit more. There's two different ways to interpret that particular scene. So I'm so excited to get your guys' perspective as well on that. But the actual end-end, that final moment, is so uncomfortable and so fantastic. I think it's probably up there as far as one of my favorite scenes in the whole film because it's paired with the best song. Like it's just the artistry of it. I've been really into like these artsy, you know, kind of films lately and stuff like that, especially in horror. But like this, that's the money right there. That last final shot was so uncomfortable. You want it to end, but it's also so sad and it just evokes a lot of feelings. And that's where the cinematography also popped off.

SPEAKER_02 23:54

I agree with the final moments of the movie, but I gotta tell you, I'm interested to hear where this conversation goes in the spoiler zone because I think personally, as it stands right now, I loved the third act of the movie. I thought it was one of the best parts of the movie, honestly. And I thought the ending was really great, a nice way to cap it off. A lot of creative imagery that we got there at the very end. And man, I got nothing bad to say about it, to be honest with you.

SPEAKER_00 24:18

It did add on complications that the rest of the film didn't have. And so suddenly it now had to deliver on like 15 different tangents. Whereas earlier, it was fairly straightforward, and so that was a point of weakness. I don't know that they really strengthened it. And so when we start finishing up, it was kind of maddening the ending. That's how I feel about it. And maybe that's just like the story. It's not that they messed up, you know, the cinematography or something or did something super crazy. It's just the story itself, I felt like was not rapping in the right way. But they were like, okay, let me cook. Give me a second. I'm gonna deliver you a final shot that you're gonna enjoy. And I think you're right to mention that last shot. It bothered me. I did not enjoy looking at it at all. And so perhaps that was the point. I don't know. But in between, some the transition between the pre-end and the last shot that I enjoyed. It's a quick thing, it takes like literally 30 seconds. But I was like, that fit the rest of the film way better than the 10 minutes that preceded it.

SPEAKER_04 25:18

Well, I am excited to see how these clearly mixed signals are gonna shake out in our ratings. But before we get there, Sean, how would you describe the gore score?

SPEAKER_02 25:26

You know, this movie is fairly graphic. We've kind of mentioned it already. I think there are some intense scenes with smashing, stabbing, and shooting. And although we don't get to see everything, what we do see is intentional and lingers long enough to see some brutal moments. So for all the neck biting, ear splitting, and chest carving we get in this movie, it's gotta be a solid medium gore score.

SPEAKER_06 25:52

And what about the animal report? Well, luckily, this animal report is completely safe for Strange Darling.

SPEAKER_04 25:58

Well, let's go ahead and get into our ratings then. Strange Darling from 2024 as nominated and selected by our patrons. Was it a hack or a slash?

SPEAKER_00 26:06

I'll jump in here first because I have the least experience with this film, I believe. And I'm gonna say it starting out here, I thought I was gonna dislike this very much. The time jumps at first annoyed me, and I got used to them eventually. The sexual violence scenes were kind of burdensome feeling, and maybe that's just due to serial killer film burnout over all the decades, perhaps. But I think slowly the movie started checking some other boxes in the right direction, and I found myself appreciating it more. You know, it really nailed some technical details, like we've mentioned. It had some really gorgeous visuals. Uh, it stayed just interesting enough to keep me attentive. It was a bit slow in parts, and it did linger in places that were uncomfortable. And again, that might be deliberate, but sometimes it's a little bit much. I just think in the end, all of that was just not enough to make me a fan of the whole experience, even though I can respect some of the crazy good work that they did. It just still ended as a hack for me. But it was close. It was close in parts to winning me over.

SPEAKER_06 27:04

That's fair. Well, on the other pendulum swing of things, I very much shared this earlier in the episode. I shared this at the end of year. This was one of my favorite movies of 2024, not even of horror, but like of the whole damn year. And I watched, as you guys know, 400 films, 76, I think, or something ridiculous new releases. I love this film. So obviously my scoring is going to be a slash. But to summarize why, this film definitely sweeped me off my feet and into a roller coaster that I just did not anticipate. I did not whatsoever. And I'm so glad that I just let myself be and consume this film and let it take me on the ride. It had me second-guess my own thoughts. I was shocked by the narrative and the things that were going on. Performances were crazy. The production was vivid and just gorgeous, giving me that like 70s Texas Chainsaw Massacre vibe, those bright reds, like Giallo films. Like I just really, really loved the look of everything. It's also just a short and fast ride, too. Like it's a very short run time, guys. Like if you want to just watch a quick film, this is it. It's an hour and 30 and some change, maybe. So it surprises you and it gives you everything that you need in a short amount of time, especially if you love true crime and thriller films as well. So this is that genre-bending film that we tend to find ourselves in every now and then. Now, of course, Kyle Gallner, okay? I obviously love him. We don't we know this. I'm not even gonna talk about him much because we know I can go on for days. But who I do want to talk about really quick is Willa Fitzgerald. She was the star of Scream TV show. Haven't seen it, but I'm so glad that I've been introduced to her now because I really feel like this is what's gonna catapult her career. I think it was incredible, and I love seeing her on the big screen. I love seeing her again in the film. She was so incredible, like she had me entranced. So I think that even if you're not familiar with some of these actors, definitely Kyle by now. Some of the other cast members you recognize, but if you're not familiar with Scream and her show, this is the perfect film to introduce you to this actress because she was incredible. You'll be locked in, you're gonna be curious, and so hopefully you'll consider it a slash just as much as I did.

SPEAKER_02 29:17

This movie does have a lot going for it. I think at first it looks simple, but as the story unfolds, it becomes something much more than that. I think that the nonlinear storyline is one of the stronger assets of the film. I think it helps to pull you into the story and really keeps you on the edge of your seat as you watch the pieces slowly fit together. But again, I also understand that that may not be the feeling that everyone gets from this movie. It's certainly the feeling that I got from this movie. I think the cinematography is stunning in this movie. When I look at the cinematography and stuff, I actually think of Halloween and not just Halloween, but John Carpenter in general, because with some of these shots really utilizing high tension and the landscape and the overall atmosphere to keep you like in invested in the scenes and on edge almost, I think it's just a almost a really great callback to the craft that is John Carpenter. And it's a gory and violent film, but it's not over the top. It's not too much, it's tasteful, some might say. And most notably, the film really stands out and shines in its ability to turn classic horror tropes completely upside down. Just when you think you know which direction this movie is going in, I feel like it goes in another direction, almost breathing new life into the lungs of familiar setups, right? It's something that I think is a little bit unique from what we've been seeing lately. And I and so this movie, for me, isn't a hack, but it does hack all of those familiar tropes into pieces, and it's a slash because it really does slash the cliches and it does slash through your expectations. And I had an unexpectedly good time with this one, so there it stands, a slash.

SPEAKER_04 31:02

You know, I almost wonder if by getting this far into an episode, if you haven't seen this movie, you've already done too much. Because I think you really have to be at a like a net zero, regardless of whether you've watched the trailer or just listening to what people have had to say about this movie. This is one that I think really quickly telegraphs what it's all about in the very beginning of the movie. And sure, you can go along for the ride and say, okay, well, it's okay that you know what's gonna happen and it's probably gonna have a great payoff at the end. I don't know that it does, it has a really good ending, but this movie fumbles pretty badly in the third act, and that's what really concerns me about this because it almost outweighs all the good from this movie and the positive things I felt about it during the runtime. This movie is exceptionally well performed, like Willow Fitzgerald. We have Kyle Gallner, even though I'm not a huge fan of him, he did an incredible job in this. And even the supporting characters that we get in this film do a hell of a job. I thought about Twilight more than I thought about Halloween, though. Sean, so that's gonna be really interesting when I go for a rewatch and see what we're talking about here. This movie is a slash because it's just a good movie, it's well executed. I don't have a lot of complaints about it, but this is certainly one where I think if I had listened to a lot of hype last year and I went in thinking this is gonna be the best fucking movie of the year, I would have been severely disappointed. So I'm glad we're watching it now, and I'm glad it's got the time and space. But for now, Strange Darling from 2024, as chosen by our patrons, has earned three slashes and one hack. Now, you can find this movie available online. If you haven't seen it yet, and you are a patron and you want to enjoy the experience, you should hit play along with Binks and I and listen to our watch-along commentary while you experience the film. And when we return, we're gonna dive deeper into the spoiler zone, we're gonna unpack that third act, and we're gonna get down into just how essential that non-linear storytelling was. We'll see you in a bit.

SPEAKER_06 33:09

This episode of Hacker Slash is brought to you by Frederick and Genevieve's Psychedelic Mountain Retreat, the grooviest bed and breakfast nestles in the heart of the woods. Whether you're a wandering soul or a strange darling just looking to get off the beaten path, Frederick and Genevieve will make sure you're fed, rested, and spiritually, well, unhinged. At Psychedelic Mountain Retreat, breakfast is always a trip. Imagine starting your day with a signature dish, maple murder pancakes, layered with gooey syrup, aged gourie, and a drizzle of balsamic production. And talk to the fried egg, sunny-side up, because everything looks better in daylight, right? Or for the bolder palettes, dig into savory sweetheart skewers, honey-dipped bacon wrapped around jalapeno stuffed strawberries, all grilled over an open flame while Frederick and Genevieve stare awkwardly at you from across the table giggling, need something lighter? Try Genevieve's very bloody yogurt bowl, infused with organic chia seeds, foraged berries, and a splash of bourbon. Because every love story needs a little edge. So come on down, pitch your sanity at the door, and embrace the chaos at Frederick and Genevieve's psychedelic mountain retreat, where breakfast is an adventure, and checking out, well, that's optional. Tell them hackerslash sent you, and they'll throw in a complimentary knife-shaped croissant. Because why not?

SPEAKER_04 34:32

Welcome back, folks. You are now entering the spoiler zone for Strange Darling, which has earned one hack and three slashes. Now we have a lot to unpack here, but before we get into the specifics of our ratings, let's go through those kills.

SPEAKER_02 34:44

Yeah, this is one of those movies where you don't get a high kill count or death toll because it's what we got like six kills total. So it's not the highest kill count, but damned if every kill didn't feel impactful in some way. And I can't wait to talk about them because we get some abrupt moments mixed with some brutal moments where I feel like the movie gives you just enough, but not over the top and every bit as effective. So let's bite into them. Which one of these kills electrified you?

SPEAKER_00 35:16

I love the shot from the backseat of the cop car. Ooh. And this was the kill that, like, I feel like sent us a little bit more to the right direction. This is one of them here that was just like, yeah, that that speed with which it was delivered, like that lack of emotion with which it was delivered, and just bam, it's over for this poor woman. And I think that one like just matched up to the earlier stuff a little bit better than that kind of like weird cop goofiness that that led us there.

SPEAKER_06 35:44

Yeah, that that was deaf and disarming. You feel so bad for her, but it's the most realistic thing, although fun fact, a little bit of a goof is that the cops obviously helped her get in the car, they patted her down, they comforted her, and they did not feel a pistol in her jacket.

SPEAKER_02 36:03

They didn't. But were they patting her down? I don't know. I mean, they may have just been trying the whole thing that this movie does is it plays on this idea that the girl is playing the victim.

SPEAKER_06 36:14

Right.

SPEAKER_02 36:14

And people are easily just manipulated in that way.

SPEAKER_06 36:19

Right, and like disarmed, right? Quite literally, disarmed.

SPEAKER_02 36:22

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 36:23

Yeah, for sure. Well, and speaking of, I guess, in my case, the favorite kill is the electric lady, our main gal. Because that final scene where you have to literally just sit there and watch her be basically dying.

SPEAKER_02 36:38

Slowly die. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 36:40

Not pleasant.

SPEAKER_02 36:41

It's great. No, it's great, but it's really an impactful death because you do get to watch it in its entirety, and you're kind of almost left thinking, like, man, what is she feeling? What is she thinking? You know what I mean? And it's also just I don't know, yeah, it's just the way that it kind of transitioned towards the end of the movie, too. And as she as like her life left, it slowly transitioned from color to black and white, which I thought was awesome. Pretty clever.

SPEAKER_04 37:10

I bet she still had a pulse.

SPEAKER_02 37:13

Maybe.

SPEAKER_06 37:13

The reason that I think it's also extremely clever is because this is a part of the film that you can easily overlook. The idea that she says that she doesn't see humans, she sees devils. And so the song lyrics saying the devil it's the devil you know versus the devil you don't. And her realizing that, also like her wanting to live a little bit, it looks like her being impressed by the fact that she got caught a little bit, so she does get that moment of glory to some extent. It's a lot, it's a lot of mixed feelings that Willa was able to capture in that moment. It was so uncomfortable. I loved it.

SPEAKER_04 37:46

Yeah. Well, let's also just address the fact that this was the ending that maybe Innoviolent Nature thought it was gonna be.

SPEAKER_02 37:54

Oh, that's another movie. I thought that this movie and In a Violent Nature could probably be in the same universe, to be honest with you. I was feeling this that's another scenery vibe that I felt like was very similar. I was talking about like the cinematography or the capturing of the landscape and the effectiveness that it adds to the film and tying back to like John Carpenter and Halloween, but you know, you were talking about the uh Pacific Northwest of it all tying back to Twilight, and then I'm now talking about how that also could tie us right back into the woods of innoviolent nature.

SPEAKER_04 38:26

I mean, listen, it can also take us into the Blair Witch Project. What's your point?

SPEAKER_06 38:30

It's all the woods universe.

SPEAKER_02 38:32

Yes, yeah, true.

SPEAKER_04 38:34

If we're gonna go the electric lady, then I'm gonna go the demon. If not, because who the fuck bites out of jugular?

SPEAKER_02 38:41

Dude.

SPEAKER_04 38:42

What? That's pretty vicious.

SPEAKER_02 38:44

Rick Crimes. It was super vicious.

SPEAKER_06 38:46

Why does he always die in every frickin' film?

SPEAKER_04 38:51

You maybe think he had it coming.

SPEAKER_06 38:53

Oh, yeah. No, I know.

SPEAKER_04 38:55

He did it all for the nookie.

SPEAKER_02 38:56

I know. This is what happens when you do it all for the nookie in real life.

SPEAKER_04 39:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 39:01

All right.

SPEAKER_04 39:02

Okay, and I say again, if he had just stayed loyal to his wife, we wouldn't have had this happen.

SPEAKER_06 39:08

So I fact-checked that. I fact-checked that. So during our watch along, Chris pointed out he's got a wedding ring, and I was like, Well, it's kind of insinuated though that he's going through something. It's not that he's actually married, so I fact-checked it. And he is going through a divorce, he's just wearing his ring still. The wife is never mentioned. No wife, not married, nothing, but that he is going through a divorce is what is being insinuated and talked about during that scene in the truck.

SPEAKER_04 39:36

Okay, and that's coming from him. He's the reliable source here.

SPEAKER_06 39:39

The director. I found three different articles, Queen.

SPEAKER_02 39:43

Yeah, I don't know if there's a direct dialogue mentioning the wife specifically, but there's a brief moment when they're talking and he mentions some kind of bullshit, and then she's like, I don't need to know your business or something like that.

SPEAKER_04 39:56

Yeah, your business is not my business.

SPEAKER_02 39:58

But you know, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 39:58

But I say again, even as this movie reads, you wear your fucking ring, and you can either be boo-hoo. Like, listen, man, if you're going through a divorce and you're out here to fucking hook it up in a motel, maybe take your ring off. Because as it is, regardless of what the director is trying to project, whatever the director is trying to say, this is how it reads. It reads as one of those men who is married, and it will say whatever he has to say to have sex with somebody else.

SPEAKER_06 40:24

But then when things get strange, wouldn't he just leave because he would be risking things with his wife?

SPEAKER_04 40:31

Who knows what men do?

SPEAKER_02 40:33

Yeah, you just never know.

SPEAKER_06 40:34

You're right.

SPEAKER_04 40:35

But the other point of this is that he fucking got all the way through this crazy bullshit and then didn't even call everybody in for help. He calls one one cop. He call he he makes one phone call to say, Hey, I'm in a situation here. I'm in a bit of some trouble. And it's like, yeah, it's either the cocaine or also listen to how I fucking got here.

SPEAKER_02 40:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 40:56

Hooking up with somebody. It's fucking sketch as hell. Either way, his death pretty fucking vicious.

SPEAKER_06 41:01

I but hold on, hold on. Last thing I'll say. Last thing I'll say. When he's calling the one cop who's his friend, it's also because he trusts the guy, not even so much for the cocaine, but for the fact that this whole movie is about how things may seem. Yes. It looks like that he is the killer from the beginning. It looks like even to anybody that were to walk into that situation, that he would be the killer. Therefore, he's reaching out to his friend cop who would trust that he would not do something like that. That's literally the whole point of the film.

SPEAKER_02 41:32

Yeah, it's it's all part it's all part of the theme of the movie, I think. Yeah. I agree.

SPEAKER_06 41:37

Because if he were to call a SWAT team, like his whole crew of police officers, they that maybe don't know him, we don't know the context of all that. He probably would be fucked because at the very beginning of the film, we think that he's the killer.

SPEAKER_02 41:50

It all looks bad for him. He's got the shoddy, he's chasing people down, there's multiple people dead, he's got drugs on him, he's taking drugs, he's got multiple drugs in his system. He checked into a motel. It's all looking bad for the dude in this scenario. So I do agree, like he had to find his way out. But all that being said, the kill itself, it's one thing to abruptly take a chunk out of somebody's neck, right? And bite a chunk out of that, right? We've seen some moments like that in real life. We've seen fucking Mike Tyson bite an ear off of somebody on pay-per-view, but we've also seen Patrick Swayze rip somebody's neck out in Roadhouse, you know what I mean? So we've seen some gnarly stuff. But this one, you take the bite out of the neck, and then you see it in her mouth, and then she just kind of like slowly lets it drop out of her mouth, and it's the shot of it falling to the floor, but also the sound of it hitting the floor, and it's just like all of it was just a really impactful kill scene.

SPEAKER_06 42:51

Definitely disgusting, definitely not well.

SPEAKER_02 42:53

It's something for sure. I also will throw in there, and these are all the best kills, we've already covered them, but I will throw in Frederick, the old hippie, because I did like the fact that shit starts to hit the fan in this moment, right? And we just see Frederick with the side of his head or face kind of bashed in. Then you notice that the lady is holding the phone, so you know that she bashed his head in with the phone, and then he's stabbed in the stomach, right? And he bleeds out, falls, and dies, or whatever. And man, that was like a moment where I was like, okay, this is a pivotal moment. Let's do this. That's crazy.

SPEAKER_06 43:32

It's so sad.

SPEAKER_02 43:33

It is.

SPEAKER_00 43:34

It was definitely a sad moment, and I think they gave us just a glimpse into two characters that you could actually just enjoy because they were silly and zany and living a good life and having a good time. And then it was like, nah, juxtaposition, dude. We gotta show you some gnarly gross stuff. At least with one of them. The other one you get to wait till later for, but his caught me by surprise. But at the same time, you completely expect it in a movie like this. I feel like you can't have somebody playing a good guy and have him survive, you know? That's just That's not gonna work out here. And I think that that reveal was kind of it was kind of cool because the first time we see him just laying face down, you don't know what's going on. And you kind of question, at least I did, I questioned, did this dude shoot him or did something else happen to him? We don't have enough information, something else is going on here.

SPEAKER_04 44:18

I don't know. I mean, it seems super apparent that he didn't shoot him because it looked like he was just seeing the body for the first time. Like his real like walking into the room and then looking down at the body, it was giving, well, fuck.

SPEAKER_00 44:29

True. And I think you know, the film was successful in like setting things up in a certain way that pointed to this guy. And so I think by that point it was pretty obvious, like, oh, they're gonna do one of those kind of things here, where they try to subvert our expectations. And so I was like, maybe they won't, maybe it's just you know, my own brain always expecting this kind of twist. Yeah, something has to be off from what you expect. And then it was like, nah, nah, dude, they went there, they did it.

SPEAKER_04 44:55

Yeah, let me tell you the movie we should have gotten. We should have gotten, let's say, a good 30 to 40 years before this movie started. We should have gotten those hippies meeting on campus, and then they we absolutely should have gotten their whole fucking love story up until the moment that this bitch shows up on their doorstep.

SPEAKER_02 45:12

Oh my god. Part one, a love story. Part two, a psychotic fucking slash.

SPEAKER_06 45:20

That's our kind of rom-com. That's the rom-coms we're writing.

SPEAKER_04 45:23

Your happy ending is your life's ending. What the fuck is that? Like, that's terrible. I mean listen, you we already they already try to give it to us, right? We had they had the mountain people having their fucking hippie dippy breakfast with their weird fucking plates of crazy ass breakfast foods.

SPEAKER_02 45:41

No one does that, by the way. What is that? Who eats like that?

SPEAKER_04 45:44

With their fucking jigsaw puzzle.

SPEAKER_02 45:46

Whole sticks of butter.

SPEAKER_04 45:48

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_02 45:49

Whole sticks of butter.

SPEAKER_06 45:50

Mm-hmm. What is that even it reminded me of the substance, like kind of disgusting nature type the substance type shit.

SPEAKER_02 45:59

Yeah, but how also how did they make it to this age eating like that? There's no fucking way that they one of them didn't have a heart attack or a stroke or something. There's no fucking way. Bullshit.

SPEAKER_06 46:10

That cholesterol's through the roof.

SPEAKER_02 46:11

Whole sticks of butter, my ass.

SPEAKER_06 46:13

It was all that acid.

SPEAKER_02 46:15

It's all that acid, yeah. Maybe.

SPEAKER_06 46:17

But here's what I will say. Despite the disgusting food, the visuals of it being cooked, plated, all that felt like art. Maybe nasty art, but it was fantastic. Overall, cinematography. You mentioned a little bit earlier, incredible.

SPEAKER_05 46:35

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 46:35

And I have a fun fact for everyone. Giovanni Rabisi. He is, I mean, hello. Great actor. Avatar, lost in translation. I was telling Chris in the watch-along, you know, about him. She hasn't seen some of these films, but she's at least seen Avatar.

SPEAKER_02 46:52

You have to have seen him in something. For some reason, no matter how big a movie he does, I always will remember him from the brother in Gone in 60 Seconds. Like that's what I go to every time for some reason. I don't know why. That's my image of him always.

SPEAKER_06 47:06

I think he also was like in a few episodes in Entourage, maybe, or like he's like in a ton of shit. Okay. You've seen this guy's face. That is without.

SPEAKER_04 47:13

He's in Ted and Ted too. You miss that. Really buried the lead on that shit. Okay. You see.

SPEAKER_02 47:19

Was he in Friends?

SPEAKER_04 47:20

He was in Friends.

SPEAKER_02 47:21

Yeah, he was in Friends. Phoebe's brother or something.

SPEAKER_06 47:24

He's incredible.

SPEAKER_04 47:25

My name is Earl, Seminole Lake Classic. My name is Earl.

SPEAKER_06 47:29

I'm sorry. I honestly could have gone the whole watch along, would have been me going off his filmography. The guy might as well compete with Willem Defoe. All right. Oh my goodness. It was it's so much. But, anyways, this is his debut as a cinematographer.

SPEAKER_04 47:43

That thing you do.

SPEAKER_01 47:44

Wow. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 47:46

He's incredible. He's the also a producer for the film, but he also was the cinematographer. He nailed it. I feel like everything was so vibrant. We've talked a bit about it. I don't know what my favorite production element would be, the whole frickin' movie, essentially, because the set was great too. But one thing I wanted to highlight that I feel like a lot of people on the internet have been commenting on. And I was telling Chris, I'm like, this is something that kind of, I don't know, it just bothers me a bit. A lot of people had some opinions about the fact that it starts by it saying, shot in 35 millimeter. And people were like, oh, that's a little bit pretentious, whatever. First of all, the guy has probably made like one other movie, maybe a couple. Like this is his big debut. Fuck off a little bit. Let the guy, you know, be a bit bolder. But more so the way I read it and interpreted it as like 50s and 70s films that displayed that they filmed in VistaVision or Induivision and things like that, that's how I interpret it. I didn't even think much of it. And so because it generally has a vibe of the film being like Texas Chainsaw Masquerot being set in the 70s and all that, it kind of reminded me of the Love Witch 2016. But if you watch that movie, it looks like if it was definitely in the 70s, or we talked about The House of the Devil with Ty West. That's 2009. Definitely looks like an old film. Like it gives that vibe a bit. So if it says that it's like 35 millimeter, I just think, like, okay, yeah, it's trying to be like a film in the 70s because it looks like it's a film from the 70s or 80s. But somehow that reads is pretentious. I don't know. I'm like, okay, I guess.

SPEAKER_04 49:24

Listen, a lot of things read pretentious to a lot of people. It is what it is. It's interesting.

SPEAKER_06 49:29

But I I mean, I thought at the very least, if not that, the fact that Giovanni Rubisi, famed actor, now cinematographer. Look at that.

SPEAKER_00 49:37

That's awesome. That's good to know. I mean, he's just good at what he does. I still think of saving Private Ryan, I believe, when I see his face. Yep, that's another one.

SPEAKER_06 49:44

Chris hasn't seen Saving Private Ryan. Nope.

SPEAKER_00 49:47

Well, as someone who was a teenager through the early 2000s, well, and an adult in the early 2000s, it was just like part of my formation. I think that and band of brothers were essential to me developing for whatever reason in life.

SPEAKER_04 50:00

I remember when those movies came out and I thought, hmm, nah, I'm not about that. My dad was so into war movies that I hated war movies.

SPEAKER_00 50:08

Ah, I see. But I that's I think of his face in war movies for whatever reason, and that's really cool that he was able to be a cinematographer here. I think, you know, aside from the cinematography, the color grading, the saturation in this film is just next level. And there's moments where you don't even realize what you're looking at until the red boots kick you in the eyeballs. And it was just so effective for me that we have that in many scenes, just like really crazy pops of color. The green is super green, and the red is like blood red, and it was just it made up for oh my gosh, it just made up for so much, I think. You could have just had still shots, which they did effectively by how long they lingered, and it's just nice to look at because of it.

SPEAKER_04 50:51

Yeah, 100%. This movie is gorgeous. I'm even thinking about the split diopter shots when she's about to give him what he thinks is cocaine, and she ends up giving him ketamine, which how was you know where however old I was yesterday when Binks shared with me exactly what ketamine really is. I don't know shit about drugs. I only know that people see ketamine in hospitals.

SPEAKER_06 51:12

And to be clear, I only know about them because I watch a lot of movies.

SPEAKER_04 51:15

That's which is fair and valid. I just don't watch a lot of movies where ketamine is brought up. I just specifically don't. But this movie is stunning to look at. Obviously, we've really ran that into the ground. I think even the music in this movie is something to behold. I would buy a vinyl of this movie.

SPEAKER_02 51:32

It's a great call-out. I think we've all touched on great points, the set design and the overall cinematography, because I think we got a wide range of these really interesting shots. Like we got these almost claustrophobic close-up shots. We got these really interesting, eerie landscape shots. We also like the visuals we get really help to set the mood of this movie. It helps narrate the story in a way. But then, you know, music, yes, the soundtrack for this movie, but I also want to highlight even just the score in this movie is super menacing and disturbing. I feel like we're getting like a lot of this type of score recently in some of these movies. So it's not even just that it's unique to this movie, although this has a unique score. I feel like we're just getting these intense and uncomfortable scores behind these movies, this almost ominous, lurking, ambient sound that follows you throughout the whole film and hits you in this really uncomfortable, like rumbling right in your like center sometimes. And it's really effective in some ways. It could be overused in some ways, but I do want to notate that it works really well in this movie.

SPEAKER_00 52:42

Speaking of music, I want to take a step back for a second, Sean, because you mentioned the old stoners.

SPEAKER_02 52:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 52:48

And I and I want to bring them up because I actually enjoyed them. And there, that whole scene of them just like hanging out at home, aside from the really strange breakfast thing, right up to the point where the electric lady knocks on their door, that whole setup I think was brilliant. I really enjoyed it. Favorite scene of the movie, and it's just because of how well it completely clashes with every with everything else and takes you out of it and makes you think about something's about to happen.

SPEAKER_04 53:15

Meanwhile, my favorite scene is the knock on the door to the chicken in the backyard. That whole segment right there.

SPEAKER_02 53:22

Because that whole thing.

SPEAKER_04 53:23

Shit's fucked. And that is where I found this movie to be really interesting. It was when the chaos collides with the ordinary and the mundane. I mentioned it earlier, these people are living out their golden years. These are the folks who have lived a lot of fucking life, and they're here on their little farm with their chickens and their fucking house and their weird art that seems to be of each other.

SPEAKER_02 53:47

It is.

SPEAKER_04 53:47

They were just living the rest of their days in a way that felt really wholesome and natural for them. And unfortunately, those days were numbered, and that's the real tragedy of the movie.

SPEAKER_02 53:57

Can I tell you what didn't feel natural though? It was the awkward way that they were sitting there giggling at each other from across the table.

SPEAKER_04 54:06

Staring at each other. Well, they're high as fuck.

SPEAKER_02 54:09

I mean, shit. I've been high as fuck. I don't know if I'm doing that at the other side of the table, but you know, maybe that Panama Red is really uh hitting. Man, I want to talk about one of my favorite scenes in the movie, and it's chapter two, like to party, right? Because now we get this really awesome scene, and it's nothing that's like super mind-blowing, but it's just this is where the demon starts to feel a little bit weird after getting drugged by the lady, and it's also where the story starts to fully kind of reveal itself, and the true antagonist starts to come to light, and the lady emerges as the electric lady, you know what I mean? And it's really well acted. A lot of these moments are really well acted, despite how much investment you have in these characters, which was one of my disappointments, because I really could give a fuck who lived and who died in this movie, to be quite honest. I do think that it was well acted. And even the moments in the beginning, like when they're talking in the car, like Willa Fitzgerald, amazing job. Like the acting that you're getting in this movie is phenomenal. And this scene between the two of them, I felt every bit of how awkward that scene was, and it was a really great slow reveal.

SPEAKER_04 55:23

Yeah, their performances really were immaculate, and even Willa Fitzgerald, because I know you've talked about her in Scream and you haven't seen it yet. Scream was a good show, but it was a step below what I think Pretty Little Liars would be. I had fun with it, it was a good one, but I don't think that show even comes close to showing what her acting chops are like. And so I was surprised to see how fucking incredible she was, to the point where being mentioned that that was the same her from Scream, I'm like, no fucking way. Unrecognizable in this movie.

SPEAKER_06 55:56

Yeah, it's incredible. I I mean to me it's almost like, wait a minute, that's that can't be, she can't be in some MTV show or wherever Scream is broadcast. I don't even know. But it's just like I would think that she's been in like major films by now. So I can't wait. I really do hope that this like catapults her in some degree. I'm interested to see what she does next. I think that now that we're talking about her, my favorite scene is them in that car. It's that David Lynch blue velvet lighting type deal. It's so creamy. This look, this very sultry vibe that they have going on, you know, they're smoking a cigarette, she's got her vape, it's just like a vibe that's happening. They're banter back and forth, talking about how you don't get phone numbers, you get Instagrams. But then as later on, not to go fast forward, but she reveals she doesn't have social media, all that, it's like, okay, girl, how do we connect? How the hell did you even find her? You know?

SPEAKER_02 56:52

But those she was all over the place.

SPEAKER_06 56:54

But those are semantics, right? I just feel like it was very sultry and very disarming. And it gets to a point where even if we were to think of the second time that they go back in that car with that blue lighting when it's very evident what she's into, I started to think later on in the film, I was like, wait a minute, is it that they maybe are playing some kind of weird, sick, like BDSM type deal? Is that what's happening? And maybe it's gone wrong? I don't know. My mind was all over the place. I don't even know what to expect at that point. But I just thought it was really interesting. And also because ultimately the first time, she's talking about the concerns that women have and dating and trusting men, but the irony that she's the one that can't be trusted. And I think now diving into her a little bit, what I find so fascinating about the lady, the electric lady, is it almost seems like she is trying to be some kind of like morality police to an extent. Because going back to what I said earlier, this premise of her saying, doesn't I don't see humans, I see devils. And she just when she sees the devil, all of a sudden it's just like, okay, I've really gotta get things in gear. We don't get a lot of context about her and what's gotten her to that point, maybe what traumas or things that she's gone through that leads her to feel like, okay, I need to just wreak havoc. There are some people that are just like caught in the crossfires that are in her way. There are others that it's obviously intentional, like a serial killer to some extent, right? But to go and have this whole dialogue of how, you know, you have to be careful. Women, you know, we are just trying to make sure that we don't get murdered when we go out. And then you're the actual one that's murdering people is just so interesting. It's like very hypocritical to an extent.

SPEAKER_05 58:41

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 58:41

And ultimately, we just don't see a lot of female serial killer POVs and like films about them either. So I think that that's also what was very interesting and intriguing about her as a character, too.

SPEAKER_04 58:53

Yeah, when we got into the watch along yesterday, we're not talking about my expectations of Binks. I was talking about the trailer, and I was remember thinking, okay, well, she asked the question, Are you a serial killer? And then he is shown very obviously with a gun. And it's like, okay, well, this is a lot to reveal. And so clearly this must not be the case. And so pretty immediately, I was like, All right, this is gonna be another Eileen Warno situation. It's gonna be a female serial killer, and then when we get the opening title crawl, and it talks about one of the most unique and whatever blah blah blah serial killers in the United States, it's like, all right, great, unique, so it's not a straight white man. Fantastic. Here we go. That's it's fucking here. So her character is interesting for sure. That's why I think I I I could have taken it at face value. I don't feel like I needed to be fooled into liking this movie with its non-linear storytelling. I think I would have bought it hook, line, and sinker just seeing this play out from date to their fucking showdown in the mountain people's house and her biting out as fucking jug jugular. I think that would have been interesting on its own. But her as a character and what we get into, I can appreciate the dynamic of it. I I can appreciate what message it's sending, and I I can appreciate the commentary on it. What I don't appreciate, and this is where we get into the shit that really bothered me at the end. We have the two cops at the end, and we have a younger female cop who is her instinct is to go protect, and like, okay, it's very obvious what happened here. She has created the situation and her intent is to fool, right? And her intent is nefarious. And we have this older guy who's like, Well, that's not the protocol. We need to figure out if she's the victim or what's going on. The problem with this is the way that whole moment was constructed and felt, it didn't read to me as the simple, well, the whole point is that she's a serial female serial killer and you know can't always believe all women. Well, fucking yeah, but also women already aren't believed all the fucking time anyway. So I don't know that that point had to be made in this movie. You know what I mean? This movie was fucking rock solid without the whole thing. And when you get into this dynamic of the two cops and then going back and forth with each other, back and forth with each other, and then it becomes to be like, okay, well, now a a woman in this line of work who has compassion and empathy, her instincts cannot be trusted. That's the message that this also sends. So I just fucking I really don't like it. I really don't fucking like it.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:26

Interesting. So I actually didn't take the movie that way at all, and I can see to the point, like it's definitely there when you talk about it, looking back on it, but I got less of it intentionally trying to say that you can't trust the judgment of this woman or we're doing that. Like I got more of we just want to take a play on what you are used to seeing in a horror movie and just kind of flipping it on you. And we want to take all the cliches and we just want to just kind of twist it around and turn it upside down and just kind of have a fun take on a familiar tale. And I took it more so that way and less about a direct jab at like women.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:08

Yeah, because here's the thing obviously, I don't believe that the director's ja intent is to jab women. That's not the obvious intent, right? But it is a I think an inherent lack of perspective to not be able to consider that when making this, and that is the real problem from the writing of it to the filming of it, to the editing of it, to the screenings of it. There is a gap here in perspective, and that is just what fucking kills me about this. Again, it's just this this may not have been the intention, but this is how it comes across, and women are already not believed.

SPEAKER_06 1:02:45

So that's the part that what we were mentioning that I didn't add the watch along, that that's what I kind of thought more about. Because yes, at the first watch, that's what one of the things that my friends and I we were talking about, but it was more along the lines of the several different times throughout the film that we as viewers, but also the characters see the lady and assume that something is wrong with her, like some she is the victim. And that's like the biggest premise of the film. But I feel like ultimately you have to tread delicately with how that's written, because at the same time, what's really resonated now on the second watch is that police in general, whether the cop was female or not, police in general just don't tend to believe women, anyways. So it's interesting that we see the opposite of what's pretty common. Typically, whether it's a female cop, she would probably most likely is going to follow protocol versus being empathetic. And that's just facts. Those there's stats to back that. So I think that that's where it's interesting because we see the opposite. Now, I almost wish though, and this is what Chris and I were talking about, if they had written that female cop to be a little bit more serious, where you are towing that line, where she's gonna be a cop that's going to want to follow protocol, but is probably questioning things, then maybe you would have read more differently. Because if the intention, which I do believe, was that all of these different characters that believe the lady to be the victim are representatives of us as viewers that are going into this thinking that she's the victim, then you need to make sure that like the writing of these characters is taken seriously. Because the dialogue between the police officers sometimes it kind of felt silly to some extent.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:29

Yeah, that's true.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:30

It was big, silly goose energy. It was big, I'm an older man, you're the little girl, you don't know what you're doing. This is why you don't belong in my force. I fucking hated that. Fucking hated it.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:41

That one for sure was pretty prevalent.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:43

The experiences of women are not a cliche that need to be sub or a trope that need to be subverted. That's just like leave that shit at the door. Everything else you got going on in this movie, fantastic. This is not a fucking arena that needed to be contended with.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:57

I have to agree. And the back and forth that you mentioned, the goofiness of it all, that really kind of takes you out. That's part of the ending that I think is bothersome because it's like we didn't really need these two characters. If you're gonna use them, you're adding this complexity. You have to deliver. And I don't think they gave enough context. Yeah, we can figure out that this dude is either a cop or friends with cops without you having to tell us. But I think had they made it a bit clearer that, oh, perhaps he doesn't believe that she's the victim because his friend just called them and said he got himself into something and that and now he's dead. Maybe that's why he's not buying into it because he just heard from this dude, you know? And and so I think instead what we get is that weird tone-deaf message. And it's strange because they could have fixed it, I feel like, with a little bit of twisting and and how they delivered the dialogue or some other form of the writing here. I think it would have been just spruced up just enough to patch that hole. And I think that that happens anytime we get outside of our main characters, is we get just a little bit, a little bit rocky with whether it's dialogue or the interaction between. these these side characters and our main characters. The main two we're pretty much spot on for for most of the film. But it's these these extras along the sidelines that are like, well, he didn't quite nail that.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:12

Yeah, I feel you there. I will say though, we do want to give it up for Kyle Gallner though, because I think, man, underrated actor. We haven't talked about him a whole lot in this episode yet. And I think, man, I like overall the work that he's done in the past, but also the work that he did in this movie, I think also it has to be noted, right?

SPEAKER_06 1:06:31

Sean, you know, I really was looking at my notes and I was like, damn, are we about to end this episode and we didn't talk enough about Kyle Gallner because I really just didn't want to be that person. But you opened the floodgate. So here I am, number one fan.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 1:06:44

Once again, another film that he's made that I absolutely love. I would say of all the films that he's done, and I'm probably missing just a few more, like Red State is probably my least favorite. And even that one's like pretty decent. Kevin Smith director, hilarious guy. So like you know, there's that. But quite the film. I just feel like watching his growth in acting is just incredible. He this he's something else here. And it's interesting because in the last couple films he continues to play this character that's troubled to some extent. You are questioning his motives a little bit or you think like this guy not really that great but has some decent intentions because there's like several moments early on where he feels uncomfortable even doing the things that she's asking him and she's challenging him and practically calling him like a little bitch when he doesn't do it. Right. And he feels uncomfortable in that those scenarios. And it's interesting to see a man in that kind of situation until sure there's a particular moment where he gets aggressive. There's a couple moments there where he's clearly frustrated sure. And that's that's calm. I mean that's what we expect in men in particular or I would imagine hey I would even imagine anyone in that scenario right where you're like okay are we going to do this or we're not you know but he's pretty respectful when it comes to consent and making sure that things are fine and all that. I don't know. I just thought he did a really good job of depicting that and his aggression as well when he just loses it he's unhinged. He can go from zero to a hundred real fast. So I love their chemistry and I loved how they matched each other's energy.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:14

Yeah it's interesting the dynamic between the two because I've mentioned how didn't really get invested in either character of like who you know the acting is really good. So those two usually don't pair up very well. However there's like these little glimpses these little moments where it kind of teeters between these two characters or these two actors right because there's like moments where you're kind of feeling a little bit of sympathy or empathy or whatever you want to call it for for Kyle Goldner's character, the demon, right? And then there's moments even when you know that the lady or the electric lady is the electric lady and the killer and the antagonist in this story there's still moments that shine through where you feel like you're rooting for her in some moment right like you feel a little bit of sympathy for her in some moments. So I think there's like kind of like this teetering between the two characters and what you feel for each one in a way and there's glimpses of that shining through. I wish we got a little bit more of that, but what we did get I I think was pretty good. I will say they did some weird shit in this movie though, the two of them right like I think you gotta give it up for the demon just I mean the amount of blow he did to counteract the ketamine I mean props to that dude because I mean you got to get your heart going some way and that's one way to fucking do it. But I'm surprised he didn't have a fucking cardiac arrest that's a lot a lot of uppers and downers happening at the same time there. And the fact that we already mentioned it earlier and you guys said that you talked about it in the watch along but why did we light a cigarette in the woods trying to escape? Was there like some unknown decoy ploy that I'm not aware of and the film decided not to show or was she just like hold on I need a smoke break let's do this honestly a stressful moment for her the second she lit that up I'm like okay like he's not gonna smell it or like he's not gonna see the smoke.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:13

That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying.

SPEAKER_04 1:10:15

It was such an odd decision to make it a terrible decision to make and honestly I think for all the things we couldn't got we could have gotten more of in this movie we could have gotten less of the cigarette smoking. Listen y'all do you whatever I'm just saying it was a lot it was almost it was honestly it was borderline campy how many fucking cigarettes got pulled out in this movie.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:36

And none of them finished I don't think none of them none of them there was ashtrays full of like full cigarettes it felt like at this point just go back to your fucking vape she abandoned that vape.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:48

Yeah what happened to that vape?

SPEAKER_00 1:10:49

Stayed in the hotel room I guess what the fuck it is a great bit though I can imagine that like in a comedy movie where they just continually light and smoke new cigarettes like every time they cut shots between characters. At one point he was like I want to pass her the cigarette and I was like wait wasn't she already smoking a cigarette like I'm so confused about how many cigarettes are in play in this situation.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:18

Oh my god they must smell so terrible also kissing someone after they smoked ooh gross gross is that your worst part all cigarettes no no the worst part is absolutely the cop scene and I will not be silly goose about this fuck that scene fuck the message it sends even if it's unintentional second runner up there would be the the cigarettes yeah okay that's fair I actually will say that I'll match you and the worst part is the cop for sure especially after this rewatch I'm like yeah could have done a little better well before Mac tells us what the best part of this movie is I am going to share that I actually think reflecting on it watching it twice we've talked a little bit about it Chris you mentioned it early on I think the worst part of this movie is that once you've seen it or figured it out it starts to become less special in my opinion like it's a great film. There's a lot to admire in the making of the film but to me I do think the execution and the story unraveling and that first impression is probably what I think is going to be the most impactful thing about this film. And I said it at the beginning of the episode and I'll say it here I I think you just need to go into this one blind and so you also have to I mean it's just one of those unfortunate things where once you've been on that ride if you let the movie take you on that ride initially but once you go on that ride I just don't think it's going to be as fun the more times that you watch it. Now I've watched it twice and I think that it was great both times but I don't know what that means for a third, fourth fifth sixth watch you know like the more I watch this movie I think the less great it will be just my opinion.

SPEAKER_04 1:13:01

You know I want to watch this movie again but I don't want to watch it exactly the same way. I want to rearrange the movie to be in chronological order.

SPEAKER_01 1:13:10

Chris just really wants it not to go out nonlinear order like no listen the nonlinear is fine.

SPEAKER_04 1:13:16

You sound like Miramax hold on a second to be clear the nonlinear story was well executed but I also remain convinced that I also would have appreciated it just as much linear.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:30

I think it would be a little bit boring.

SPEAKER_01 1:13:32

But because I find her interesting I think it would be the same same old same old it would be so boring.

SPEAKER_04 1:13:38

I don't agree I don't need I think the gimmick of nonlinear storytelling to be invested in what they had going on because I think you could watch this from the beginning it seems like okay they're just fucking around he's about to find out and then I think you can just appreciate the escalation of it that's something that I want to try to do there's nothing wrong with that.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:58

I would watch it if it existed I would watch it just to see how I felt about it but I honestly think it might be a little bit more boring. That's just my opinion I don't know but I respect your opinion too I just don't know I don't know what to think about it.

SPEAKER_00 1:14:12

I see I'm understanding Chris this whole time because it's kind of like when Kendrick Lamar released Damn and then came out with the collector's edition where it was completely reversed and everyone's like oh my god we were listening to it wrong the whole time and now it's so much better with the tracks reversed. And it doesn't really matter right you're gonna enjoy the songs either way I only now listen to it in the collector's edition whatever they call it like format. So I don't even remember what it was like to hear it the other way. I think if I were to watch this in chronological order, I wouldn't care about the actual OG cut of the film. I think I would still get the picture. And I actually think it would make more sense if you're trying to convince people that one character is one way and one is the other because chronologically that's how it starts. So why would you need to jump around to have that same effect? I think it would actually work extremely well to tell it chronologically and I would be down for it. I just I'm never a big fan of time jumps unless you're going back to like the 1990s and you're from the year 2000 whatever because you're on Star Trek in that case cool go through time. It's a lot of fun but in this kind of a case here it's just unnecessary complexity. Now they I think they nailed it. I think they landed it right I think that's why we're not harping on it too much because it actually was executed well but I also still find it unnecessary. It's not the worst part of this movie necessarily but it's also not the best part. I think the best part is the visuals. I think if you don't care about the whole time jumpy thing, you're not super worried about mixing up the acts if you're not really even into serial killers, you can look at this film and get a lot out of it. And I think that even goes all the way down to the wardrobe and the set a lot of that's the play with colors which works extremely well but there's just something about it here that like this is supposed to be gritty and disgusting those moments they pop as well but just the background stuff just the lovely little cottage that these old stoners like live in there's just something about a lot of these moments that feel heavy because of the way that they're set up.

SPEAKER_06 1:16:07

I think the visuals is exactly why I would continue to watch this movie and I will continue to do it. I also watched it at one point to go to sleep but we're not gonna count that in my watch count but I see it in my near future my brother hasn't seen this movie yet so I really want to see it with him. I think it's fun to watch with someone who hasn't seen it. I've experienced that now I love it. But then again there is a heavy bias considering Kyle's in it. But I think it's entertaining although I will admit Sean that like yeah of course what's so great about this film is watching it for the first time and nothing's gonna feel like that first time watch like that that invigoration how I felt when I was out of the theater when I was like holy shit this took me for a ride. No, I didn't get that same feeling but I still really enjoy it and I think it's really fun to to kind of revisit especially because it's a quick watch as well.

SPEAKER_04 1:16:58

Well I suppose we'll find out if this was just as fun for our listeners but for now there you have folks. Strange Darling from 2024 as nominated and selected by our patrons has earned three slashes and one hack.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:12

Now we've certainly had a robust discussion here but the conversation and debate about this movie doesn't end here by any means.com slash hackerslash and enjoy even more of the show including bonus content with early access, extended episodes with our B sides, movie nominations and live shows.

SPEAKER_06 1:17:39

And if you're just as much of a strange darling as I am leave us a five star review wherever you get your podcasts. This helps us continue to deliver great content for all you horror fiends out there.