382: The Final Destination (2009)

SPEAKER_00 0:04

Wrecked them, damn near killed them.

SPEAKER_01 0:10

Greetings and salutations, and welcome to Hacker Slash. If you're joining us again, welcome back. That's a lot of tampons for one woman. If this is your first time listening, welcome to the party. We are a horror movie review podcast dedicated to telling you whether a movie is a hack.

SPEAKER_00 0:24

A total joke, a waste of time.

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Or slash. Totally killer, pun intended. We believe horror is for everyone, and as such, we're writing these movies with a perspective we've gained from our varying walks of life and the flavors of fear we fancy most. My name is Chris, I'm your friendly neighborhood slasher enthusiast. This week I'm joined by the Superfly Space Guy Mac.

SPEAKER_00 0:42

Ever played Donkey Punch?

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And the paranormal paramour. Binx. I've got my eye on you two. This week we're on a date with Destiny as we revisit a franchise focus on the inevitability of death.

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And if you support the show, you'll also get to hear our B side at the end of this episode, where we rant about escalator etiquette, moving walkway logistics, and the Final Destination kill possibilities for grocery stores.

SPEAKER_01 1:02

Nine years after Final Destination introduced audiences to elaborate death sequences, the franchise took a detour to the race track. With a production budget of $40 million, this entry was the first in the series to be filmed in 3D, aiming to pull audiences even closer to the chaos. Despite being the lowest-rated film in the franchise, it actually became the only installment to open at number one in the domestic box office, earning $27 million in its opening weekend. Its central disaster, a high-speed pile-up at McKinley Speedway, bears a striking resemblance to the real-life 1955 catastrophe, where a multi-car collision sent wreckage flying into the stands, killing dozens of spectators. In this film, we follow a young man who has a terrifying vision of impending doom at the track, allowing him and his friends to escape mere moments before disaster strikes. But, as always, their survival is only temporary. This week we're talking about the final destination. Who has seen this one before?

SPEAKER_00 2:02

I saw this in theaters. I saw this with a coworker. We went, we watched it, we walked outside, it's late at night, and then one of the street lamps in the parking lot went out. And it was like, come on, dude. Seriously, right now, this is how I'm gonna go out. Is the street lamp's gonna fail and fall on me? But yeah, it's been a couple years, something like 16 years later. I still remember the key scene at the end of this film vividly.

SPEAKER_02 2:22

Yeah, who doesn't? I can't recall if I've seen this one in theaters. I want to say maybe, but I've seen it several times. I mentioned for our Final Destination III episode, I did a marathon where I watched the entire franchise. I woke up very early in the morning with a good friend of mine. We watched all of them, finished by like 6 p.m. It was a ride. It was one hell of a ride.

SPEAKER_01 2:46

Yeah, I didn't watch this porn in theaters, but I did watch it a bunch when I was in the Navy. This is one of those that we just threw on the ship's TV all the time, and I really enjoyed the chaos of it. The chaos of brutality in this franchise is absolutely never lost on me. I haven't seen this movie in a while. I think the last time I watched it was either for the Final Destination III, because I ended up buying the entire collection of films on Apple TV. I've never deeply analyzed or ranked which Final Destination movie is the best Final Destination movie, but I settled in for this and I felt a lot of wow, is this the worst Final Destination movie?

SPEAKER_02 3:24

Yeah, unfortunately, this one for me does feel the weakest, but that is because I am a person who loves this franchise deeply. And so I do have this conversation of which one's the weakest, you know, do your rankings type thing. And it's when we get into the 3D of it all that I struggle a bit. And I do recognize that at the time that was like the trend. Everything was 3D. I feel like it suffered in exchange for the potential of the fun kills that you usually get. The effects that is so spectacular in this franchise takes a hit because it just feels a little bit too campy in a direction that I know that on this show historically I just don't really favor too much.

SPEAKER_00 4:06

It's funny that you mentioned campy because I had that distinct feeling when some of the kills happened that did they make it campy on purpose? Because that's surely what it felt like in some cases. This entire franchise doesn't require a lot of investment mentally or even emotionally for that matter. It's one of those things that you can get a big old thing of popcorn and make fun of while you watch it with your friends. This is the kind of thing that's really best served amongst people that you enjoy being around because it's going to inspire some conversation. I think while watching this, I watched this alone, but at the same time, it's like it's so ridiculous. I wish I could laugh at it with other people. And it's not one of those things that really matters and what the emotions they're trying to play at really matters. Like, who cares? This is a pulp movie. This is meant for hopefully coming out at a time when people are going to sit in a theater together, throw popcorn at each other into their mouths, not into the floor because that's rude. And just have a good time watching it. It's not meant for further intellectual involvement.

SPEAKER_01 5:04

Yeah, this is one of those movies that's designed for the ooh, ah, but it's not designed for the super deep thinking, which is why it was interesting to settle in for this one and enjoy it for at least in a way that I attempted to be more than just the passive engagement with it. I wanted to look more deeply at like, okay, how creative are its kills when you think about the premonition. How does the premonition hold up to past premonitions and the future premonitions we get in the next film? And it was one of those things where the entire time I watched this movie, I was surprised by how much of an absolute regurgitation it felt from the prior movies, from the characters to the deaths, to the attempts at deaths, to what you would find are actually just Easter eggs. But some of these things, listen, if you try to say it's a fucking Easter egg, but you have, I don't know, 15 dozen Easter eggs in here, listen, you're just fucking ripping off some of the other movies. And it was almost like self-service. It felt like a throwback. I mean, obviously, we have the same director here who directed Final Destination 2, but it felt like it was throwing back and paying reverence to its own work in a way that it didn't need to do the entire way throughout this movie.

SPEAKER_02 6:23

Well, the reason for that is because they thought this was gonna be the last film in the franchise. So they just felt like they had to do the recap and the homages, but it was just so forced a majority of the time. I think that's my biggest disappointment too, even if at the time this was supposed to be the final destination. It's just like that's how you're gonna pay respect. There are certain aspects that I like it. The intro, for example, you're gonna have a good time with that. I think that's uh I enjoy that part, but the rest of it feels so incredibly forced. All of their kills, it's like a regurgitation of everything else. You said it so well. And the other part to it, too, that I find really disappointing is again bringing back this 3D thing of it all. Man, when 3D films are being re-watched nowadays, we really thought that that stuff was cool, like the slow motion, like things coming out to the screen every other second is like, all right, buddy. I could literally fast forward 30 seconds and somehow the knife is still slowly approaching the camera. Like, let's get to it. Let's get to it. And so it's frustrating because I think as a society, a lot of us do not like this movie as much as we like the others. And yet it's the highest-grossing film. That just goes to show you that curiosity does kill the cat because a lot of people really bought into this being the last film. We're gonna hit the theaters, we're gonna have a good time, and everything else just felt like, oh, that's it.

SPEAKER_01 7:48

Congratulations, you played yourself. And here's a a couple things to your point, Bings. Yes, this was supposed to be the final destination. A lot of audacity to call each other the final destination. When in fact, final destination is the final destination. But the thing is, less is more. We can have homage, we can have references, we can have Easter eggs, but this movie is littered with it. And it felt more like Easter eggs, more so to part two than I even cared to have.

SPEAKER_00 8:18

I think the most disappointing thing here is these movies don't require a ton of effort to produce and to make and everything, right? But like when it comes to story, you just have to nail a couple things. You have to get the rules right. That's really what it's about. If you get the rules right, you can do whatever you want with the characters. They can be teenagers, they could be 25-year-olds. Who cares? Follow the rules of death in Final Destination films, and you're gonna have a good time. We don't need a backstory, we don't need any of that kind of stuff, just stick to it. What they did here was they were like, we have a template, let's exactly copy the template. And that's boring because when I think of Final Destination, what's gonna be bigger than an airplane? It's definitely not some of the stuff that we get in this film. So if you're going to copy the template down to like, oh my gosh, was that actor in one of the other movies? It seems kind of cookie-cutter-ish when it comes to this casting. You gotta at least go big on the kills, do something really crazy. This one was like, this is an attempt, kind of, but is not bigger than an airplane.

SPEAKER_01 9:14

I also dare to say there wasn't anything in this movie that made me afraid of something in real life. So obviously, in the first film, we have the plane crash, which is fucking terrifying. You're already afraid of flying before you see that movie, and then that just cements it. Part two, we have the log truck. Everybody's been traumatized by this. Part three, you have the roller coaster. There's so much in here that it's like, ooh, okay, final destination-y. And while the opening premonition is so fun, and I mean, listen, death is doing a lot in this fucking movie. It's putting in some overtime. It lacks the bite and the punch of just like, okay, where's the trauma branding for me?

SPEAKER_02 9:56

Yeah, I'd agree. There's maybe one kill that resonates with a lot of people that, you know, calls out to a fear that everyone has, like all the other ones that you mentioned. Everything else is so outlandish that it leans into that camp and it kind of takes away the essence of Final Destination. What makes this franchise so great is that it plays off of things that we are constantly afraid of that are possible. And this one is like, we're reaching death. We're really reaching.

SPEAKER_00 10:26

I'll agree. It's kind of a reach in most of these cases. And I think when it comes to fear, it doesn't take a lot to scare us about stuff. Actually, the more mundane you go, the more effective it is. We can look back at past films and see the crazy happenstances that led to kills, and that was cemented into our brains as things that we were now afraid of. I feel a bit uneasy about a few things, but while watching it, I'm not really bored.

SPEAKER_01 10:46

Yeah, and I think it's because you were worried the first time you saw it in the other three movies. This movie, in what feels like almost all of its kills, just feels like it references itself. So it's hard to feel like any of these moments really do something different. Granted, there are a couple differences here, and I think it tries to go a couple layers deeper, and I don't mean in terms of like depth of like how clever and intelligent it this fucking plot is by any means. But I think there's almost like a little bit of final destination inception that happens towards the end of this movie. So I think it tries to do something different, and it tries to feel like it's this big massive send-off to the franchise, but ultimately it's just like Mama Bird is chewing up all this fucking food and throwing it back in her baby bird's mouths.

SPEAKER_00 11:34

Yeah, it's kind of like, what should we make this movie about? I don't know, make it final destination-ish. That's what it feels like. It doesn't truly feel like it stands apart. There's one big kill in my mind that does stand apart from the other films, and everything else doesn't really hit for me. I'm thinking of other movies right now in this franchise where, oh yeah, I remember that one. Yes, we all joke about the fear of tanning beds after a previous movie. But in this one, there's just one, for me at least, that sticks. It just feels too played out for sure.

SPEAKER_02 12:08

And I think it's no different in the ending, truthfully. I think that the ending is also just another regurgitation of things that we've seen in the previous films. Unfortunately, I think there's some parts that might catch you off guard, but I feel like the essence of this film lands in that ending, right? It's it's where it plants itself, it's where it leads you to feel like, oh shit, like what's gonna happen next? Death always has a way. But this time around, after the fourth installment, we've seen it all, unfortunately. And I feel like with New Line Cinema, it tends to do that again and again, right? In terms of thinking that it's gonna be the last film and then it isn't. It did it with Freddy's Dead, The Final Nightmare. It did it again with the final chapter, just tends to set the audience up for a nice bow in its conclusion for a franchise and all of a sudden decide, oh, nope, just kidding.

SPEAKER_00 12:57

There's more. These films do well when they are self-contained, but they're allowed to reference previous movies. So you can mention stories or characters from other films. That's fine. Don't dive too deep. But if you stand apart, if I can watch this film and enjoy it all on its own, that's really cool. The trouble here, I think, is the idea that we need to end the franchise. That's the trouble I have with this ending, is they know that it's ending.

SPEAKER_01 13:22

Yeah, to Binx's point, the ending is very familiar. The ending has other movies written all over it, but there's something about the ending that I actually don't mind. Even if it is a flashback to the first film, at least the introduction of our end credits feels like a great way to go and wrap this movie up. So I'm not complaining there. But it does make me so happy that this is not the last we saw for this franchise. If this was actually the franchise's final destination, damn, it would have gone out with a whimper. But I'm excited to see how all of this shakes out in its ratings. But before we get there, Mac, how would you describe the gore score?

SPEAKER_00 14:03

Yeah, it's pretty high. There's definitely a good amount of gore in pretty much all the kills in this film.

SPEAKER_01 14:08

And what about the animal report?

SPEAKER_02 14:10

We are actually all good in this final destination.

SPEAKER_01 14:13

Well, we'll go ahead and get into our ratings then. The final destination from 2009, allegedly the last in its line. Was it a hack or a slash? I'll actually just kick it off real quick. This movie is fine, it's not great. I mentioned earlier already, it's a pretty big regurgitation of the previous movies. It also lacks the music of the previous movies, it also lacks a lot of Tony Todd's influence. Even though he's such a small component of this movie, you need Bloodworth or his voice. This honestly is all filler, and it doesn't feel like it offers much in the way of true value added to the franchise. But hey, to his point, it's fun to still sit back and pick apart all the Easter eggs and the clues, which is all this movie really needs to be. So while it's the shittiest of a great franchise, it still earns a slash for still being kind of fun.

SPEAKER_00 15:07

You know I love analogies. If we look at the previous films, let's talk about popcorn. When you go to a movie theater and you get popcorn and you get that butter on there, that special movie theater butter, you know it's trash. You know it's horrible for you, but you have a good time eating it. This movie is the movie theater butter popcorn that you pop at home. It's kind of there, but I'm still having a good time with it. It's not perfect, but you're having a good time. It doesn't require a lot of investment. You can get into the kills. Some of them are pretty bombastic. You can enjoy it for what it is and not hate it for what it's not. And so I have to agree, Chris, I think it's a slash.

SPEAKER_02 15:39

Oh boy. Well, I'll also keep this one short and sweet because for me, the drop in quality from Final Destination III to four is just as fast as the roller coaster ride in Final Destination III. It's pretty fast and very steep. That being said, I'd like to think that I'm pretty vindicated in that statement because apparently I'm not the only one that thinks that this is the worst movie in the franchise. It's pretty well known to be that. So I feel right in saying that. And you guys feel the same. Maybe still a slash for you guys, but not necessarily your cup of tea out of the whole franchise, sure. But I think the reason that I feel this drop off so fiercely is because I love this franchise and I feel it so much in the characters. Granted, this is not a franchise where you're supposed to be in love with the characters and remember them forever and ever. Not everyone's gonna have a clear. That I get that. But it's also the effects because I think the franchise has such an incredible effects team. Practical effects are incredible and they put in so much effort, but this film in particular, they leaned too much into the CGI and 3D of it all that it waters that part of it down. It almost feels like you wouldn't even realize how much work the effects team puts into a franchise unless you watched those behind the scenes. So because of that, this film in general tends to get forgotten. I barely remember a lot of key plot points when this film unless I rewatched it. I barely remember a lot of the kills, maybe with the exception of one or two. And I've seen this movie several times. So I can't quite make heads or tails of certain things, but ultimately there is a lot of creativity to this movie, right? There is a lot of fun to be had, get with friends, have a laugh, don't take it too seriously. But I'm in an era where I want to be a little harsher about some things. And I feel passionately about this franchise. So I'm going to hack this one. I'd still recommend it. If you're going to do a marathon binge, don't skip it. But if there was one that you had to skip because you're running out of time and you really have other things you want to do, maybe this one would be the one.

SPEAKER_01 17:46

Well, with that, folks, the final destination from 2009 has earned one hack and two slashes. But there's still a lot more for us to discuss when we get back from our break. When we return from our break, we'll dive deep into the spoilers on territory and break down what it borrows from its predecessors. We'll see you in a bit.

SPEAKER_00 18:16

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SPEAKER_01 19:40

Can we all align that it's fucking Carter?

SPEAKER_00 19:42

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 19:43

Is that the racist? The racist son of a bitch being towed down the street because Death said, Hey, I'm gonna take your ass out, but I'm also gonna be a little petty and I'm gonna be specifically anti-racist.

SPEAKER_00 19:58

I love that we got to have war playing while that scene was happening. That made me so happy to hear that was really fantastic.

SPEAKER_02 20:05

Yeah, the war reference was great. That kill was great. It does feel good. Hunt's kill is just so ridiculous, but so great because to get your intestines suctioned out of your asshole is it's a fear that I don't think anyone has really considered before. You know, like as a kid, you swim in the pool and get a little afraid of that little suction hole at the bottom, or at least I did, especially with hair, like having as much hair as I did. Never thought that I would physically get sucked into that drain, like a vacuum, and then have my entire intestines come out of my asshole. That hits different.

SPEAKER_01 20:44

I agree with you. Well, as someone who didn't really fuck with pools that much anyway, I can't say I had the same level of relatability, but like I get it. What a missed opportunity though. Because he was A, talking about getting laid. Last thing he really does before dying is having sex. What a time for him to not have had his crotch getting sucked in by the drain hole. And then we just see right out the other side. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 21:09

Yeah, that would have also been great. But I think also a lot of things coming out of your ass is just great because he's an asshole, you know, and so he dies from things coming out of his asshole. If there was a way to have both somehow, that would have been great.

SPEAKER_00 21:23

We do have to comment on the way that this is written in our notes because it says that he gets his inside sucked out through his rectum by the pull drain, so rectum, damn near killed him.

SPEAKER_01 21:32

A little blessing to us from Sean.

SPEAKER_02 21:35

What that was great. But can I be a little particular? Not necessarily that it's a favorite, but just a particularity now that we're talking about Hunt and his death. Technically, Jonathan, that cowboy, was supposed to die before Hunt, and they did it opposite later on.

SPEAKER_01 21:51

Yes. But who knows what was happening with that guy? Maybe he was a little touch and go, maybe he technically died. He was like on death's door, clinging on.

SPEAKER_02 22:00

All right. So maybe it was happening before but after, but we see it in different order.

SPEAKER_01 22:05

I want to be clear. I was giving it a lot of grace that it doesn't deserve. You're right. It fucked up.

SPEAKER_00 22:11

Well, we've mentioned two, I think, of probably the absolute best kills in this film. I mean, being dragged down the street, but I want to give you an alternate take here. I think the worst kill of this film. And that is George getting hit by an ambulance. Over in an instant, this is the campiest kill in this entire film. It almost seemed like a punchline. It was so ridiculous. Especially for a character that I hope, like me, that you both liked.

SPEAKER_01 22:37

Yeah. George is great. Terrible that George killed his wife and daughter by drunk driving. But it looks like he was on his path to redemption. For him to go the same way that Terry went in Final Destination, like the first Final Destination film.

SPEAKER_00 22:51

If it were a bus, then it would have been giving me Grey's Anatomy. So, you know, they could have done something kind of fun. I don't know if Gray's Anatomy was even out then, but I feel like it's been out since forever.

SPEAKER_01 23:00

It's been out since the dawn of time, so absolutely it was. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 23:04

But we cannot forget the escalator kill, because that is the most memorable, I think, or at least one of them. Maybe the tire hitting, decapitating the head of Andy's girlfriend will be the other. But the escalator kill seemed very memorable to me because when people talk to me about this movie, that is what they identify it with. They asked me, oh, the one with the escalator? And I'm like, yeah, that's four. Not three. Three is the roller coaster. There's always one kill that will distinguish the film. We've got the woodlogs, we've got the tanning bed, slash roller coaster. You know, everyone's got their one. And maybe the escalator is four's monumentus kill? Or what do we think?

SPEAKER_01 23:46

I'm gonna be honest with you, I completely forgot that it even fucking existed. I remember the chaos at the racetrack. I don't remember every single death of the racetrack. I then also remember the tow truck and Carter Daniels getting killed. Interesting. How about the movie theater? No. No, not that one either. Again, I've watched this movie so many times, but none of it stands out as super memorable except for the fucking tow truck, because also the petty energy.

SPEAKER_00 24:13

See, that's weird to me because I think, like Binks mentioned, I think the Escalator Kill is the most memorable. I don't necessarily think it's the best kill of the film. It just is the one that stood out when I was thinking back to Final Destination, even through all of them, because this is the most recent one that I've watched, you know, 16 years ago. This is the one that kind of stuck with me as the most like cringe worthy because we take escalators fairly often, and it was big and crazy and wild, and it failed absolutely in a ridiculous way, and then she gets sucked down and it doesn't make any sense, but it's like huge. The rest of the kills, there's some good ones. We've mentioned some of the best ones. The racetrack does not to me seem as memorable as the escalator, though.

SPEAKER_02 24:53

Even though that's really the main kit and caboodle of the film, I agree. But thinking of how the movie ends and that final kill, the bus or whatever the hell, coming straight through the coffee shop, just ramming into them. I was thinking about the reshoots that were done for that ending because the initial ending that was supposed to happen, people hated it, so they redid it, and then they didn't like that ending, so they redid it again. It's so obvious to maybe us, or at least me, because I've gone to Universal Studios so many fucking times, I can tell exactly where the hell they're seated. It is so obvious to anyone that's from Florida, specifically Orlando, that's gone to Universal Studios multiple times, if you're like an amusement park junkie, I guess, that they are at Universal Studios in the San Francisco, you know, coffee shop section where you're gonna turn, you're gonna start going to the Jaws ride. It's so clear as day. I find it hilarious. But I think about also now that we're talking about these kills as I was prepping for the episode, the kills that could have happened, which would have been interesting, like the girls getting smashed by another block, which would have been an homage to I think three with the kid after the dentist. It was going to be our main boy, Nick, who was going to get obliterated by the escalator, I believe. So it's like the different combinations of things that could have happened, but ultimately they all just got hit with a bus going into a coffee shop this time. They just love flying cars.

SPEAKER_01 26:22

I really did, though, enjoy the sudden cut from the impact to the X-ray vision to get into the closing credits. I really enjoyed that. But that ending, man, it really is just the same fucking thing as the first Final Destination film. Down to clear talking about what if this is where we were meant to be the entire time, and then our boy doing the same fucking thing.

SPEAKER_00 26:47

Gosh, I hope that in the next Final Destination movie that comes out, they learn from a particular TV show that I know you love, Invincible. That's a way to do a cut with a kill. That's how you escalate things, I think, by cutting at just the right time. Big, bold, beautiful splash on the screen. The x-ray thing is cool, but I think they could definitely step it up a notch. If you were going to make the last one ever made, you gotta go bigger, you gotta go bolder than this. It is a fun graphic, though, because we've seen all of the splashes of body parts throughout all of these films. We don't necessarily need more of that. And so I like that they had that cool kind of transition into it.

SPEAKER_01 27:25

Yeah, and you know, Binx, you talked about the deaths that could have been, and it just makes me think of fame tampon momantha lane because death had so many fucking contingency plans for this woman. And imagine going out by way of your son's bullshit. If those little pricks just hadn't fucking thrown a pebble, who knows what would have happened.

SPEAKER_02 27:45

But I will say that's another one that I feel like in the day-to-day I'd be a little questionable about. Granted, I don't live in an area where people would be mowing their lawns out in their front yard because I live in an apartment complex, but if I did, and I saw that, I would steer a little bit further away now. Because you just never know. What if it hits a rock? What if it goes flying?

SPEAKER_01 28:09

Let me tell you though, with some of these deaths, when we think about just the visions that took place, one of the things that I found to be the worst part of this movie, and we'll get there again later, is the CGI predictions, premonitions that he had beyond the premonition video, beyond the actual premonition scene that we see in the beginning of the movie. Because very specifically the flashes of something, the CGI 3D moments we see, and the vague sounds that we hear. I absolutely hated every one of those little things.

SPEAKER_00 28:45

Oh, so agree. And I think there's a much better way to do that than flashing to made-up CGI crap, and that is integrate whatever they're seeing in their vision into their actual vision. If you're gonna show somebody a snake, that snake needs to look like it's in the room with them. Throw those items into their actual vision, make them freaked out, and then pull them away. I think that would be more interesting than all right, cut to him staring off into space and then show these weird things that don't mean anything to anyone.

SPEAKER_01 29:12

Okay, so one moment of this that almost kind of worked. He's in his home, he looks down, he sees the reflection of the fan in the mirror. There was some hair supplies there, so it looks like it could have been the salon. They have a little small pile of stones, and the pebbles would end them taking out Samantha. A moment like that, okay, cool, he's transfixed on that. But like the dreams that he has, the red door, the tow truck CGI, it's just fucking infuriating.

SPEAKER_02 29:40

Just don't understand it. Every single moment that we had one of those very blatantly obvious 3D effects. I wanted to scream. I can't even believe that my younger self maybe could have ever thought that that was cool. Not to be harsh on myself like I usually am, but goddamn, it's terrible. It really is. And I'm having a hard time thinking of whatever my favorite production element is because a lot of it is tough, aside from the incredible effects that again, I want to reiterate, you can catch if you Google YouTube, do what you need to do for the behind-the-scenes stuff. Because the fact that they put in so much work to even create those indentations when that guy gets slammed into the fence and gets cut up like this is Resident Evil, that work was incredible. And then they CGI'd it to oblivion. Why? It was so great when you watch these behind the scenes videos. I just don't understand, and it's such a shame. Other than that, it's pretty tough. It's funny, before we started recording, Mackie were playing some butt rock, and I think maybe it would be the music. It is so obvious that this composer worked on seven of the Fast and Furious films. When you've got Shinedown in the mix, it's a rap. We know what we're walking into. I would have wanted more Shinedown, and I would have probably maybe slashed this movie. Who knows?

SPEAKER_00 30:58

So Bing Shi, you stole it right out of my mouth because I think my favorite part here is how they were able to create some of those atmospheres with the combination of music, whether good or bad music, and the events on screen. We've already mentioned why can't we be friends happening? You know, that's playing when the race is getting taken out by his own tow truck. Perfect combination. But to hear Devour by Shinedown at the very start of the film at a racetrack, I don't know what it is about race cars. To me, that seems very dated as a form of entertainment. With that song, though, it takes me back to 2009. I'm relocated into the past and it really sets the tone. It's like you should not take this too seriously. You're not in it for the thought, you're in it for the good time.

SPEAKER_01 31:41

Yeah, man. I think about the things that looked good in this movie, and the only CGI thing that I think even shined a little bit were the opening and closing credits because the X-ray vision and breakdown of all these iconic kills throughout the entire franchise, I absolutely loved that. And I think actually my favorite scene is what leads us into that first bit of opening credits, and that's the fucking racetrack. How can you watch a Final Destination movie and your favorite scene not be the opening premonition?

SPEAKER_00 32:12

It is so good because they establish our characters, they make us hate certain people right from the get-go, and we've got high speed and explosions, and people's heads getting taken off by tires, and there's just so much back-to-back. It really hits you with the adrenaline up front.

SPEAKER_01 32:29

Yeah, and here's the interesting thing. We always see Death's hand at work. In the first movie, Death, you know, covers its own tracks by retracting the liquid that Todd slipped on that ended up killing him in the bathtub. But in this movie, it was doing a lot. A lot of the time, I think we have these moments where death does a little something something and it looks like a gust of wind that knocks something over. This movie featured death unscrewing two bolts at the same time in perfect sync. Not because of things passing by and it just naturally coming loose, but Death was like, Oh, I'm running a little behind on this. Let me just break out my wrench.

SPEAKER_02 33:09

Death basically said, I'm over this shit. Let's cut to the chase. I don't have time for this. I have an appointment. I gotta make it, let's go. It wasted no time. It didn't really even want to bother with a gust of wind. It said, I have a wrench, I guess I'm gonna pick it up and I'm gonna use both hands to undo said screws. I respect it. And I think that my favorite scene also, of course, is that opening scene. And if it isn't that, I'm gonna cheat and say that it is the x-ray stuff, but mostly because I loved the experience of watching all of these movies back to back, and then seeing that intro was just a fun way to be like, here's what you missed. A little bit of a recap of all of the kills that have happened, and what a way to do the kill count. Because goddamn, it's a lot of crazy kills. It's so 2000s, a bit of the x-ray, a bit of the grit and the grunginess of it all. I wish that maybe there was like a metal song or something going on during it somehow. Maybe it would have been a bit too much, but I just feel like it's so grunge and I respect it. It's a great way to just memorialize all of the films that happen in this franchise. Had this been the actual final movie in the franchise, but alas, as we know, it isn't.

SPEAKER_01 34:26

Here's a problem though: the credits don't just show us the most iconic kills from the franchise, it shows us most of the fucking kills that are gonna happen in this movie, or some semblance of violence, like even the fucking nail gun that we see later on. What I also love about this opening scene is how many Easter eggs there are all throughout it. Little shots of 180, the car that causes the accident, you being able to see 666 around it, it kind of gives like the devil's flight from the roller coaster in the movie before. And we have Heist Pale Ale, I believe is the beer, that we see in the first couple movies as well. There are a few things baked into this, and once we get Final Destination bloodlines in, we're gonna have to really look back retrospectively and break down all the Easter eggs that exist in all these movies. It's far too much to just discuss in one episode.

SPEAKER_00 35:18

Well, I'm gonna take things a different direction for my favorite scene, and I'm gonna go for camp. This movie has a lot of camp spread throughout, and that's when Nick is doing this balancing act in the movie theater trying to save everybody, and it just read as comedy to me. I wish there were like a slapstick kind of song playing in the background because it seemed that ridiculous when he's like leaning and stretching and like trying to do the thing, and then maybe I'll save everyone, and it's just so silly. But in that moment, it's like this is hilarious. I don't know why it's funny to me, but it's ridiculous, and I loved that. I almost hope he failed. If he did all this and then that this is the end of the movie, that would have been kind of almost more satisfying.

SPEAKER_01 35:56

Yeah, all of his effort actually made this feel, especially this last bit of the movie, feel like more of an action movie than a Final Destination movie.

SPEAKER_00 36:06

There is that fast and furious effect on a lot of movies from probably this point into like 2020. It doesn't matter what genre you're in, but we're gonna make it action-y, as long as you don't go to space, because that is jumping the shark right there when it comes to these movies.

SPEAKER_01 36:21

Final Destination in space.

SPEAKER_00 36:23

It's called 2001 a space odyssey. Open the pod bay doortal. Let's talk about Nick because I feel like this entire film, he's trying hard, but he's not trying well. He's a work harder than smarter kind of fellow.

SPEAKER_02 36:35

That's like a majority of these characters, though. Our lead is just not pulling the weight like the previous leads have. And again, that's where I go back to as the movies go on. They don't even give a fuck about g making characters likable or substantial enough to defeat death or make you think that they even stand a chance because they know that we're all here in the theater or sitting on the couch watching this movie to see the kills. And it's a little sad because I like the characters. I think that it's fun to root for your main character defeating death. That's what has the charm for the first one, right? That's why everyone loves the first Final Destination movie. When you have Clear Rivers, a badass bitch. I just feel like in general, that whole ensemble is great. So you want to root for the ensemble. But this one, man, it's just weak all around.

SPEAKER_01 37:26

Okay, because this movie is overshadowed by the ensemble via Easter egg. We had Alex Browning the dog. We had Clear Rivers Water, we had Carter from the first film being Carter Daniels. There are so many things that just like echo those original characters, and it completely overshadows any opportunity this cast had to shine. It's a shame because I like the actor who plays our main character, Nick. I really enjoy him. It's not even that I have anything against Nick, it's that this movie's characters are bland, except for Hunt. Hunt is an asshole, Hunt has some personality, and then Carter, you just root for him to die, and his death ends up feeling the most satisfying because of how viciously you hate him. And so I think between those two things, it's all the characters in this movie really have going for it, which is why I think my favorite character in this movie is death.

SPEAKER_02 38:22

Because again, death really doesn't give a fuck now more than ever. Clocking in that OT. Clocking in that OT is the pettiest she's ever been, and she's just not wasting any goddamn time. She's quite literally going through the book. 131, is that what we said? That's a crazy amount of kills, folks. She's tired. And then they said, do another movie. Girl, please.

SPEAKER_00 38:48

It's weird because looking at the cast, I think you're right, Chris. It's like the cast they have is not the problem. It's the characters that they wrote for this cast. I mean, Chantel Van Senten as Lori. Absolutely love her. She's great on screen, but they wrote her way too shallow for her acting chops. And, you know, Bobby Campo as Nick is fine. They could have given him a little bit more for us to like him. Maybe it's because he's not Allie Larder that we'll never have that level of attachment. Not everybody can be Mary Elizabeth Winstead. That's just the truth of the matter. But I think they could have given them just a little bit more to work with to really let them shine and let us attach ourselves to them. At the end of this film, when they're all taken out, none of us really care. If they had taken out Allie Larder right away, we'd have been upset. I think, like you said, you honestly hope, at least at the start of these films, they got to figure it out. They got to win. By this point, we don't care. We know they're not going to win. It doesn't really matter in the end. It would be nice, though, if every now and then you shake it up, you give us someone that deserves to win and beat death. And then I don't think you have that here. I don't think they wrote the characters in a way that you're rooting for them.

SPEAKER_02 39:54

Well, and even when it comes to the romance side of it, right? Like, not that that's a focal point, but let's just say that's another element that maybe people kind of look forward to, right? A little bit of the rom-com of it all. I don't see a lot of chemistry between Nick and Lori either. And when you know that these actors have that ability, because of even previous work that they've done in romance dramas and such, it's like, what are we missing here? Like there's not even that for me to latch on to.

SPEAKER_01 40:22

Were we missing personality?

SPEAKER_02 40:23

God, in all of them. And that's really why this is the worst part of the movie. Not even the CGI. I think I've settled on the fact that the characters and how bland and vanilla they are supersedes the CGI disaster. I have very little investment and curiosity as to what happens to them or how they're gonna die, and that's why most of this movie just goes into the oblivion and this black hole of memory that I have out of the many films, and now we're gonna have another one. So at this point we're running on six movies for Final Destination, and four is just gonna be forgotten. Except for the Escal. That's probably gonna be stuck right here in the noggin.

SPEAKER_01 41:00

We aren't even done recording this episode, and I've already forgotten it. I wish it was more memorable, but I think the problem is that this fucking CGI makes it look terrible. So it's like my mind wants to purposely block it because it detracts from how cool it could have looked. There's something about that escalator kill and her getting crushed in it and her being wrapped around the gears. It ends up just looking like a piece of pasta that you're trying to make and press at home, but it also just doesn't look good. That should conjure a very visceral, violent image, but in this, the CGI detracts from it so much that I can't buy into it. That's why the kills in this movie are largely forgettable, and that's why it continues to be the worst part of this movie.

SPEAKER_00 41:42

They had CGI figured out back in the early 90s with Jurassic Park in 1993, they can have better-looking CGI. What is your excuse? I think the reason here is you need CGI to look like practical effects. They're trying to make CGI look like real life, but for some reason, for most of CGI in the last 25 years, they're falling short of it. Don't make it look like real life because you guys are failing at that. Make it look like practical effects. Practical effects have that visceral sense to them, and that's really what we should be aiming for in pretty much every case. It needs to feel gritty and real and tangible. But I'm not going to say that that's the worst part of this movie. There's something wrong with the pacing because this hour 20-minute film feels like an hour and 20-minute film. There's a lot contained within here, but it feels like they're just running right through it. It really feels like we barely get to know enough about people. When they get into the lore of this entire universe, it's like they've already read the book and they don't have to tell us. And I get it, we're, you know, four movies in. That's fine, but it's like they're skipping stuff. And maybe that's from cuts, maybe that's from edits, and maybe that's from realizing, hey, we gotta squeeze it in less than a certain amount of time, but I can feel how heavily this has been edited down.

SPEAKER_01 42:55

Well, despite being able to feel that so heavily, I will admit that's while I don't look forward to watching this as a standalone, I at least will continue to watch it in a franchise binge because, like I mentioned earlier, it's still fun in some parts and it's just good filler.

SPEAKER_02 43:10

Yeah, I'd say that I would only re-watch this film if encouraged once again to do a total binge. But like I said in my rating, I might just delete this one from the marathon simply because it doesn't really add too much to it when you know that the franchise just keeps going afterwards. If this really was the final destination, then sure I would re-watch it. But it isn't, and so I feel like there's no real need sometimes. Maybe I would do like a quick snapshot of the film. I'll watch a couple of the kills for fun, but I wouldn't watch the whole thing in its totality.

SPEAKER_00 43:47

I remember going to see this in the theater in 2009 or whatever it was, and joking with my coworker that how can they continue to call them the final destination movies when if it's final, there can only be one. It doesn't make any sense, and they're like Shut up, just watch the movie. And I think that's the mantra to live by is just shut up and watch the movie and enjoy it. If I'm going to watch these movies again, I'll shut up and just sit through it.

SPEAKER_01 44:09

I've got it. Destination wedding, final destination. Cruise ship final destination.

SPEAKER_00 44:14

I'm here for it. Let's make it happen.

SPEAKER_01 44:16

That's the movie I want to see. But for now, there you have it, folks. The final destination, allegedly, has earned one hack and two slashes. We've certainly had a robust discussion here, but it doesn't end here by any means.

SPEAKER_00 44:28

If you want to find out how you can go further than this episode, consider supporting the show by visiting patreon.com/slash hackerslash, where you can enjoy even more of the show, including bonus content with early access, extended episodes with our B-sides, movie nominations, and live shows.

SPEAKER_02 44:42

And if you enjoyed listening to us cheat death by reviewing this movie, leave us a five star review wherever you get your podcasts. This helps us continue to deliver great content for all you horror fiends out there.

SPEAKER_01 44:56

We just lost a really hot MILF.