Hokum (2026)

Show Opener

Kris 0:04

Officers, we have had a doozy of a day!

Movie Introduction

Kris 0:12

After caveat and oddity, Damien McCarthy has become a filmmaker closely associated with small spaces, strange objects, and scare construction that feels almost mechanical in its patience. Its follow-up moves into a larger release context with Neon distributing in the United States and Adam Scott stepping into a darker forward-lead role after years of playing characters who often weaponized charm, discomfort, or dry frustration. The story follows a bitter American novelist who travels to Ireland to scatter his parents' ashes. And once he arrives, his attention drifts towards a sealed honeymoon suite, rumors of a witchcraft inside the hotel, and a rabbit-shaped mythology that seems to pull the building's history into his own unraveling. That setup gives the movie a familiar haunted hotel shape, but the angle is very much McCarthy's. An abrasive protagonist, an isolated location, a room no one wants opened, and a mystery built around whether the danger comes from the past, the place, or the person staring too long into both. This week we're talking about Hoku.

Greetings & Salutations

Kris 1:18

Greetings and salutations, and welcome to Hacker Slash. If you're joining us again, welcome back. If this is your first time listening, welcome to the party. We are a horror movie review podcast dedicated to telling you whether a movie is a hack.

Sean 1:30

Total joke, a waste of time.

Kris 1:32

Or a slash. Totally killer. Pun intended. My name is Kris. I'm your friendly neighborhood slasher enthusiast. This week I'm joined by the classic horror connoisseur Sean.

Sean 1:40

Need something stronger than milk?

Kris 1:42

And the paranormal paramour, Binx.

Binx 1:44

I don't know if you've noticed, but there are some oddballs walking around this place.

Sean 1:48

Listen, you're tuning into Hokum, and if you are a patron or you support the show, you'll also get to hear our B side at the end of this episode where we get into the theme of drugs in horror movies.

Kris 2:00

Well, we're gonna say those drugs in just a little bit, but before we get there,

Spoiler-free Discussion

Kris 2:04

what were y'all expecting going into this one?

Sean 2:06

Okay, well, I had a lot of mixed feelings. Like, is this gonna be a folklore horror type movie? I'm watching the trailer as this is getting ready to come out because I feel like the trailer started, like the promotional aspect of this movie happened for a long time. You got little snippets, a teaser, a trailer. I it was like, is this gonna be a folklore type horror movie? Is this gonna be a haunted hotel thing? You know, in the trailer, you get this like creepy looking, what looks to be some kind of bunny or something. Like, what the hell is that? It kind of like reminded me of some kind of Japanese demon or something like that. So I'm like, what am I looking at here? I honestly just had a lot of mixed feelings of uh a lot of mixed feelings about this one going into it, and I'll tell you why. I wasn't really a hundred percent sure what we were going to get out of this one because there's this kind of mixed bag of this not only just being a Damian McCarthy film, but also Adam Scott in this one. And so for me, I initially think of Adam Scott and I think of like, you know, he's in a lot of comedies, like you know, he's in Parks and Rec, he's in Severance Stepbrothers. And then I realized, okay, well, maybe, I mean, he is in Krampus, he is in, you know, the monkey in a small role or something like that. So, like, there are pieces. So I was like, okay, maybe. But knowing that this is a Damien McCarthy film and knowing that he can create a really strong horror film, we've seen it in Oddity, we've seen it in caveat, both really good horror movies in their own right, I had a lot of hopes that this was going to be very well done. And so, what I also love about Damien McCarthy films, and what I was expecting, is for all of because all of his films, to an extent, and even some of his short films, have this kind of interconnected or they take place in the same universe, which we really get some fun Easter eggs. So I'm on the lookout for those as well. So there was a lot going on going into this one.

Binx 3:55

Definitely. And it's a good thing that you brought up the marketing that happened for this so early on, because I remember it, it might have started around keeper time. It just felt like it was inserted in there at the perfect timing because it was very ominous. So I remember the that teaser trailer. I remember being curious enough to follow when I had connected the dots that it was with Damien McCarthy and Oddity. I was like, hell yeah. Because the thing about Oddity that I loved was if you stare at something long enough, no matter if it's the simplest of things, it's fucking weird and it makes you feel a little unsettled. So I was hoping that we were gonna get that definitely here in this Hokum movie, right? Um, but I'm a huge fan of Adam Scott. So I already was like, fuck yeah, no matter what. I'm with you that it's a it's a little bit odd to see him in horror because it's not his most common thing. But knowing that it was potentially gonna be some dark subject matter, I know that he can nail that because in Big Little Lies or in Severance, he can get to that range of emotion. So I was like, all right, well, can he do that? Certainly. How is it gonna look with him being scared shitless? Guess we're gonna find out.

Kris 5:07

Yeah, man, I I like Adam Scott a lot. I mean, I'm a Adam Scott and Parks and Wreck and Krampus kind of fan, but I knew next to nothing going into this movie beyond Sean loving the experience that he had, uh hearing a lot of hype surrounding this movie, specifically from Sean. And this came out obviously earlier in May. We've had this, and then when we had obsession dominating the box office up until Backroom started dominating. And so it's been a pretty good month for horror. But maybe I just hadn't been to the to the theater enough this year because I missed out on this marketing, I missed out on these trailers going into this, knowing that okay, we're probably gonna get something emotional, we're probably gonna get something psychological. This guy goes to a hotel. Well, stop me if you heard this one before. But one of the things that really stood out to me in terms of like a first impression is damn, this setup is actually pretty enticing. Like, yeah, sure, it's a writer, it goes to a haunted location, there's folklore, and the protagonist, kind of obnoxious. It's almost sounds like the shining. But what I appreciated here is very early on, you get this sense that it's a story about whether someone who sees everything as doomed can imagine a different ending or a different experience. So even though this was stacked up, okay, expect it to be good. I don't know, seems like all the familiar ingredients. I was impressed that it started as strongly as it did.

Sean 6:37

Yeah, I think, well, it's interesting you say it started as strongly as it did, because I agree with you, but is it was it just me, or did something like did the opening scene kind of throw you off a bit? Because I can tell you when I sat down to watch this movie, I'm in the theater and the opening of this movie comes out and I'm or starts, and I'm sitting there like for a moment, I'm like, Am I am I in the wrong movie right now? It took me a minute. I had to see Adam Scott to be like, okay, okay, okay, we're good.

Kris 7:03

Yeah, when I was watching this movie, I thought, am I about how to get a refund? Like, what is happening in here?

Sean 7:09

Did my dumbass sit in the wrong theater? What happened?

Kris 7:12

Sean, genuinely, with my luck, we have had so many experiences. Well, not we, all of us, but me, I have had so many bad experiences in theaters where something's going on with the projection, something's going wrong with the sound. And I thought, man, is this gonna be is this gonna be the thing? Is this gonna be the thing? I just don't get to see this fucking movie.

Binx 7:32

Oh my gosh. What's so interesting about this, and especially its opening though, is even despite feeling like, wait a minute, did I get did I get the ticket for the right movie or not? When you start to settle in though, you're settled into a weird atmospheric, like non-stop ride of tension. It's like a very scary, haunted house type vibe with a mix of all kinds of other things, too. It's a weird genre blend. Let's say that. I I think that there's definitely lots of stills that are jarring, lots of tension and moments where I'm like holding on to myself, to my friend, like, oh shit, what's about to happen? But it's all because of different things that are going on, whether it be, again, this haunted house vibe, whether it be this folklore story, it's a few moments jumbled in that cause this kind of tension.

Kris 8:20

Yeah. And what I appreciate so much about it, especially with this opening, is it makes very, very clear that although he is a fiction writer, his fiction and his reality are blending in really interesting ways. And sure, we think about some of the other horror movies that have featured writers. We're gonna talk about that again later in the B side, but we have Secret Window, Misery, The Shining, etc. All of those to some extent have a little bit of that. But this does it in a different way that I think really sets us up nicely to see what his worldview is. And I think what I really appreciated about it, even just experiencing this movie, is the straight line that you can draw from that opening shot all the way to the unresolved grief that we are still contending with three acts later.

Sean 9:06

Yeah, for sure. It did once you get past that, and the story kind of sets in, and you are starting to be in the we'll call it, you know, we're probably going to be a theme throughout this movie of the atmosphere of this movie because it is genuinely spooky. I it feels like you're sitting in this old folk story that you might be told as a kid to scare you, but then it's told in real time in a modern setting. So you've got like this really mix of of things going on. And I think the this movie just is built, it just built one of the best spooky atmospheres that I can honestly remember in recent years. It was an oppressive atmosphere. It doesn't like to your point, Binx, like once it gets going, it doesn't kind of let up for a long time. It can feel like a slow burn at times, but it really just grabs you. Everything about this movie, the visuals, the the way that it's filmed, the shots, the cinematography, and the sound all mixed together to really create this world that you're just really at at like this tension and unease and this sense of like lurking dread that happens. And it doesn't let you escape that feeling that something is lurking behind you all the time. No matter what happens, you're just forced to kind of react to things in this movie, which we'll talk about later. Things that you wouldn't normally react to. And I think the audience reaction for this movie was great. And you see it in theaters with a whole bunch of people, people were jumping, yelling, getting scared at silly things. It was uh it was a time for sure.

Binx 10:36

Yeah, a time indeed. And even though I'm with you on just the ambiance of everything, and the folk story in a modern setting definitely has a lot to do with that. I will say that it's something that you're feeling, you're spooked out, but halfway through the movie, I almost forgot what was the folk story that even got us here to begin with. I it was one of those moments where I'm like, wait a second, what was that thing that we were told at the very beginning? Should I have maybe remembered it? I'm not too sure. But fuck it. It set the tone of I'm terrified, so I guess it did its job subconsciously, maybe.

Kris 11:15

Yeah, there's a lot of blurred lines in this movie, and there's so many layers to what's happening. You have the writer, his story, the family experience, the creepiness of the hotel, the weird people in the hotel, then the folklore behind that, then the drugs of it all. There's a lot happening. There's a lot happening in this movie, and I think one of the things that is really significant to me in just like walking away from it, it is a movie with great atmosphere. Sean, you mentioned it. 100% agreed. I was engaged because Adam Scott I found to be compelling, although infuriating, and the chemistry between the characters works really well. But as much as I was drawn into the mood, as much as I was drawn into that friction and the dry humor and the hotel, I wasn't really compelled by the mythology, the folklore, any of that. That was a big old swing and a miss, and it felt like it almost overcomplicated something that didn't need to be that complex.

Binx 12:14

Yeah, I'm with you a thousand percent. I don't know if we needed a whole laundry list of things to be added into this story, but I'm with you on the Adam Scott part. I think that him being an asshole is prime stuff. Because again, although he does a lot of comedy and drama, in a lot of those things, he plays an asshole kind of character, not Parks and Rec. The opposite, actually. But Step Brothers, iconic role, complete dick. So when he does it, he does a very good job at doing it. So yeah, you don't really like him much, but he's compelling enough to keep following through to the very end for sure.

Sean 12:53

Yeah, he definitely plays into the asshole bit quite a bit. Like he does it really well, which is perfect for the character that he has in this movie, and and it fits really well into the, you know, when you're really thinking about it up front, you're not really in we'll dive into characters and spoilers and really dive into the backstory of Ohm, the character and the the main character in this movie, but it's definitely something where like it it progresses and you kind of go on this journey as the story unfolds, which I think was actually really, really well done. But also what's really well done is the scares in this movie are so well done that it doesn't even really matter if you are expecting them or not expecting them because they come from all different angles. It's not all the same cookie-cutter jump scare nonsense. There are moments where they're telling stories in the movie, almost like sharing a ghost story where you know you're gonna see something spooky, but you're still you still get reactions from it, and there's gonna be moments where you're just not ready for something and it happens and you still get spooked, and then there are the moments that just linger for so long that you know you know that you shouldn't, you just don't want to be in that space anymore, but you're still there, and it just there's a lot of different ways that this movie builds the fear, and I think it was really, really well done.

Kris 14:12

You know, I respect that, Sean, but I don't think I feel the damn near lick of fear. I was a lot of other things, right? And I think going back to what you said about Omen General, he is someone that is stuck in doom, his book feels stuck, his life feels stuck, his grief feels stuck, and I think by the end of the movie it manages to find a way to make his creative struggle feel tied to actual emotional progress and movement. But I just found that the scares, while great looking, I want to be clear, great looking, they just didn't hit for me. But again, like supernatural doesn't really do anything for me. I thought it looked beautiful, it looks so good, but it just wasn't effective, and it didn't make me jump or even feel like okay, yeah, sure, it's a little tense and a little mystery who done it, but I didn't feel particularly scared by this thing.

Sean 15:05

That's wild.

Binx 15:06

You're impenetrable. That's crazy. I man, I was terrified for sure. And and it's interesting that you say that because I I would have thought that maybe, and we we'll definitely get into this later, but I thought that maybe you would think that the circumstances, if not the generic and the structured scares, right, you'd find terrifying because I think it's both in a sense. But I think that's a little nuanced because at the same time we've already disclosed Ohm is a bit of an asshole. So it's kind of hard to feel the emotional range of things for a guy that's quite a dick at the beginning. So interesting. That's really interesting.

Kris 15:49

Now, because I feel the emotional range of things for him, just not fear, just not anything that makes him a horror movie. I'm like, Okay, okay.

Binx 15:58

No, I I get you, I get you. I I don't know. Yeah, I I thought that this movie was if at anything at all, was definitely a classic scary movie for me. I was definitely terrified of some corners and some hallways, and I felt congested at times, and there was a severe lack of safety for a good majority of this movie. I was like, visually, this is the stuff that I love and what really will keep me up at night. Yeah. So maybe that's also why this movie has stuck with me for so long. I I feel like I just watched it yesterday type thing. But on the other side of the coin, I will say that, you know, since we've started to talk a little bit about characters as a whole, at least Ohm, there's other characters in this movie that along with the themes that have been added into here, characters that I don't know if they were fully necessary or they were just existing to say one small piece of the 20 things that this movie is about. So it's a little out of left field. It feels a little disjointed, sometimes strangely explained. You forget who some people are. So it's it's weird when it comes to the actual like people that are facilitating the 20 stories going on in this movie.

Kris 17:11

And again, those 20 stories in short, writer's block, family grief, haunted hotel, local fucking legends, suspicious people in the hotel, a strange guy in the woods, a creepy children's show, a locked room that nobody gets into. Like you just you just got so much. You just got so much.

Sean 17:29

I think it all worked really well together. I don't think it was too much. It didn't throw me off at all. I really feel like, you know, the characters maybe, I don't know, but I feel like may, and maybe it's also, well, Binks, you said you watched it more than once. I don't know. Maybe it's me watching it again and getting like a another whole like take it all in and really pay attention to the little things as it's unfolding, a story that I already know is unfolding and looking for different things. But I wasn't thrown off by the plethora of different like subplots that were going on in this movie. I think it was really good. But once you even if you even if that some of that throws you off, I think this movie is so effective just in the way that it builds the the atmosphere that has you literally on edge, because no matter what part of the story you're in, or what area they're telling, or what kind of backstory, or what have you, I think it's just really well done, especially when we get to you know, a certain particular part in the movie without giving any spoilers away. You get up into you know this specific room and it's just a significant section of the movie. And when you're up there, it's a wild, wild ride of tension and unease. There's an entire scene in this section that I feel like carried on for a while that I was genuinely effective for me. I think it's full of dread, the sound it all builds, and it doesn't let up until literally the morning comes. And I think which it's it's just a really solid chunk. It's very oppressive. I think it's I don't know. The what didn't work for me, and I'm I'm listening to everything that you all said, like, you know, maybe maybe too many like characters that didn't need to be there, or too many side stories that added to layers of this overall story that maybe didn't need to be there. What didn't work for me that I I kind of go back and forth on is there is just like there is a specific other type of antagonist character that felt like it could have just been thrown in there for fun. So we'll have to dive into that. Like it was creepy, but like, did it need to be in there? So I guess we'll see.

Kris 19:37

I'm curious to see what direction you're going with that because anything representing an antagonist, I actually didn't mind at all. There are just other things happening in this movie. I was like, okay. And I want to be clear, Damian McCarthy's a great filmmaker. There's nothing bad in this movie, it was just it was just a lot. This movie had a lot to say. Did it all need to be said? I don't know. But what I can appreciate about this movie is that when you go into this and you're and you're going through the experience of this movie, if you are someone who's looking for a slow burn, I think this is good. And it doesn't burn too slowly. There are a lot of things that happen in this, and you know, again, I'm just considering I'm just considering the experience and and how I think other people respond to this. It is a fun time. And it's not, it doesn't crawl to the point where it's boring. But if you're like if you're someone who does like a slow burn and you like again that atmosphere, if you like films that rely on a lot of like legend and supernatural elements, I think this is a really interesting one to go for. But what I think is super interesting, and I'm just reflecting on this, Sean, as you were saying that, I feel like this movie would have made a great true crime podcast from Adam Scott's character's perspective. And I feel like maybe that's what it is. It just feels so much of that to me that I'm like no longer counting it as a horror movie, even though there's a lot of great shit in it.

Sean 21:06

It's fair. It's got a lot for, I mean, you can say like if you're into slow burn horror, you can get into this one. If you're into true crime, who done it, whatever, you can get into this one, mystery thriller, you can get into this one. It's also just a solid, spooky ghost story. Like, there is that aspect of it. There, I feel like there is something for everyone. So for me, like I don't really know why anyone would want to skip this movie. I think if you're into a movie that immerses you in creepiness and surroundings, and like that you just enjoy a good ghost story, you're probably gonna like this one. I think that you know it could throw some people off if you're if there's not really a clear protagonist in the film or something like that. If you need someone to believe in, someone to buy into, maybe this one will throw you off. But overall, I think there is something that everyone could like in this. Horror movie.

Binx 22:00

Yeah, I'm with you. And to be honest, it's funny the timing of things, because even that being said, with Ohm not necessarily being the brightest and you know, lighthearted, sweet protagonist that we tend to get. We just saw in Obsession that bears are basically our protagonists. And, you know, well, if you've seen Obsession, you know where I'm going with that. So I just feel like we we have seen now in horror where there are protagonists that maybe are people you don't want to follow, and yet they're compelling and you're invested enough. And again, there's something for everyone. And maybe that's a lot of things on the table that typically don't get organized in the best way in a horror film. In this case, they make do. I personally am a huge fan, obviously, of the paranormal and supernatural. So check. I love murder mystery stuff. Check. Like there's a lot of things that work for me. I think if you are going into this though, not prepared for the array of themes, you might get a little lost and forget some stuff. But don't worry, at least for me, I can promise that you're gonna get fucking scared if you're a scaredy cat. That there is no doubt in my mind about.

Kris 23:17

Wow, you really have sold this as the triple dipper of Damien McCarthy's filmography.

Binx 23:22

Listen, I feel God in this chilies tonight, and it's Hokum.

Sean 23:25

I mean I mean, look, I feel like if you look at this movie, and then if you've watched if you've watched caveat and you've watched Oddity, I think you take both of those movies, you put everything that worked in those movies, you build this movie and amplify it, that's what you get in this movie.

Kris 23:42

Listen, maybe refer back to the Oddity episode, but I think I feel very differently about this movie than I did about Oddity. I haven't seen caveat, but there are a lot of things that I loved in Oddity that I think are very distinct and stand on their own. And this I still enjoy, but it just feels a little bit different. But we have to start making our way towards our ratings before we actually score this movie and reveal our answers.

The Gore Score

Kris 24:04

Sean, how would you describe the gore score?

Sean 24:06

The gore is pretty tame in this movie. It's not like over the top. It's there. There is a small amount of gore, if you will, some blood here and there. But this is a movie that is far more effective without the need of any blood, really. So it's not like it's it's there. It adds a little bit of color, if you will, to the film, but it's not in need. You don't need the gore, you won't miss the gore. So this one is earning a

The Animal Report

Sean 24:30

low gore score.

Kris 24:30

And what about the animal report?

Binx 24:32

Well, unfortunately, we're not clean here. We're not entirely safe. Goats are hunted down for being a nuisance, which seems a bit extreme to me, but that's that.

Kris 24:42

As a Capricorn, I take personal offense and umbrage,

Scoring

Kris 24:45

but it's time to make our way towards our ratings. Hokum. Was it a hack or a slash? And just to delay the inevitable even a little bit more, before we dive into our scores, I actually want to share a couple of takes from our listeners. So we have Ryan who says it was McCarthy's best movie. I think it's his tightest script while still being super twisty and unconventional structurally. I think the locked room conceit really grounded the movie and kept it focused. Always love how his movies combine all these witches, ghosts, and murderers. It's there's no scare as good as the Oddity 10 scene or the balcony scene, but a couple scenes come close. Loved it. Also, just a really sweet ending.

Sean 25:25

I can respect it. I I agree. It was solid.

Kris 25:28

And then from Drew, we have I really enjoyed this movie overall. It had a nice creepy vibe, but holy hell, did I just want to punch Adam Scott in the face throughout the whole movie? It didn't do anything really new but what it did and did well. It's a great one-off movie that doesn't need any sort of sequel. And that I can respect and agree with Drew.

Sean 25:49

For sure, for sure. I mean, hey, listen, some would say that if you know the characters are making you want to react in that way, then they did it there. They did their job. That's all I'm saying.

Kris 25:59

They absolutely did. Now, folks, if you want to share your take on these movies, please, in the episode description, you can click fan mail, and then you can actually send us a text or send us a voicemail with your opinions. But Sean, Binks, time for y'all to love on this movie. Sean, take it away.

Sean 26:13

Okay, all right. Listen, I I did go into Hokum with mixed expectations. I do want to start with that. I did go in. I said at the beginning of this podcast, I went in. I just couldn't fully picture Adam Scott leading a horror film. Uh, even though Damian McCarthy has already built an incredible track record with films like Oddity and Caveat. I just I went in with mixed expectations. But let me tell you, this ended up being, for me, one of the best horror movies I've seen in quite a long time. Before I watched Obsession, this was probably my number one movie of the year by far. And honestly, after a second viewing, it still might be up there. It's it's a brutal toss-up between the two for me, like Obsession and Hokum. We had solid horror movies that came out in May. It's been a great month for horror. And so, what for me makes Hokum work so well is that at its core, it's an incredibly well-told ghost story. The set design, the sound design come together to create this atmosphere that is just feels genuinely unnerving. The film, it almost gives you a like two-for-one haunting, not just through the setting itself, but through our main character, Ohm, whose presence and backstory add another layer of dread to the entire experience. And it does start kind of in that slower burn territory, but once it reaches a certain turning point, it never really lets go for the rest of the film. The tension just keeps tightening. I especially love the depth woven into Ohm's story and how it enriches kind of the haunting at the center of the film instead of just serving as this background lore for me. And I think it kind of plays on like, what is like what's the true haunting here? What are we actually experiencing? And at this point, for me, Damien McCarthy has completely sold me. Everything he's touched so far has been absolute gold for me. And just like he slashed right through my expectations, Hokum earns itself a ghastly slash. I'm I'm I love this movie. This is a great movie. I want to own this movie.

Binx 28:16

That's awesome. That's awesome, especially that it's so high up there already in in May. I mean, I'm with you on that. That's that's pretty fair. I look, I watched this movie a long time ago as a part of the Miami Film Festival. And so typically by now, I would say that this film would be very hazy in my mind. Even when I, you know, was approached to re-watch it again. I thought, okay, typically by now I wouldn't remember a thing. But this movie, however, is still as vivid as if I had finished watching this movie right before recording it. And I think a big reason for that is its atmosphere, the themes that I mentioned that I'm very much about, right? That it's a haunted house, it's a ghost story, it's terrifyingly captured in this like low light or using just a single light source. There are more than a handful of scenes where your eyes will get a little bit wider and you're completely shocked by what's on display. So all of these things I think is what kept my memory of this movie so sharp and alive. Now, that being said, as I've already expressed, there are definitely some pitfalls here to its actual story. Okay, some character connections that feel a little random and disjointed. Some decisions that I have a little bit of questions about. And obviously, this underlying folklore tale felt like it was easily forgotten. If there was one thing that I did forget, it was the details of that, albeit short-lived in its tale itself. But I kind of forgot the details, I'll be honest. But it's fine because ultimately it didn't take away from how entertaining this movie was. I think it's a standard haunted horror film. And it's got a central character that, again, you're enticed to follow no matter how much of a dick he is. And there's other characters here that, yeah, they may be a little bit random, but some have some charm, and some you're kind of wondering what their motives are. And it's just enough to keep you going. And so all that said, I, you know, thinking of Adam Scott specifically, I had the opportunity to meet him after watching this, and he asked me what I thought of Hokum. And I was hyperventilating because holy shit. Um, and I definitely was thinking, okay, well, there's some things that, you know, okay, like, do I tell them? That would be crazy. But my response was simple. I told him, I really did. I told him it was a slash. I don't know if he understood what I meant when I said that to him. That's fine. But I still stand by that today. It was definitely a slash.

Kris 30:50

You know, one can only hope that you gave him the vocabulary to understand what the slash meant. But hey, this movie works on a lot of different levels. And I know why I said there are multiple levels to this movie and maybe some layers that didn't need to be there. But what I can appreciate is it gives me enough horror atmosphere to stay engaged moment to moment. There isn't really anything that's boring in this movie. It does also give me enough emotional shape to feel like it actually wants to go somewhere and say something. Again, on that horror side, there's a lot of stuff that the movie sets up that I would want from this kind of story, right? Yeah, that weird hotel. It feels like there's something going on among the staff. You have a protagonist who's walking into something that he is in no earthly realm prepared for. There's mythology that creates a sense of like history while also being a threat. There's creepy fucking rooms. The place looks, you know, anything as far from generic as you possibly can. I appreciate even just down to the set design in this movie. And then there's weird shit like a fucking rabbit in this movie that really makes it stand out. And it's like, okay, is this the shining or Donnie Darko? I don't know. This movie also balances a tone so well because while you have this character who is abrasive and who is a little bit much, he also has some moments of humor in there that really deflect, and maybe that's why I didn't feel any real like fear in this movie, because you're just kind of viewing everything from his perspective. But what I love most about this, and why I think this is such a strong slash for me is its emotional arc. There are horror movies where a writer checks into the wrong place, but this is a horror movie where a check a this is a horror movie where a writer has checked into the wrong place literally and figuratively, more so emotionally. And I think Adam Scott delivers a performance that highlights that really, really well. He is stuck creatively again because he is stuck emotionally, and it gives all that atmosphere a sense of purpose. It's less about the hotel and its inner workings. Like, yes, okay, that's fun, it's entertaining, and it gets a little dramatic. But what I found myself most invested in is his journey. And this isn't a clean slash for me, it's still a little messy. It's also, I don't know that I can explain every detail of this movie, but I liked being inside it. And that is enough for me. With that, Helcum from 2026 has earned a universal slash. Now we're about to unseal that honeymoon suite and we're gonna break down what's really going on in that hotel by crossing into the spoiler zone. We'll see you in a bit.

A Word From Our Sponsor

Sean 33:59

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Welcome to the Spoiler Zone

Kris 35:33

Welcome back, folks. You're not entering the spoiler zone for Hokum, which has earned a universal slash.

The Slay by Slay

Sean 35:41

Well, this is an interesting one. This film is it's not really a film that is giving you a lot of kills. In fact, it doesn't even show you most of the kills, but the kills in this movie are very emotional. They hit really hard in this one, even if you don't see them and you're just hearing about them. And there's surprisingly six kills that we can kind of break down into the in this movie. So let's kind of get into them now. I think we'll start with uh what happens prior to the movie's events, and we'll just kick it off with the big bang, no pun intended, Ohm's mom. That was genuinely heartbreaking.

Kris 36:20

Yeah, that was really, really rough. And obviously, when you start the movie and you see what ends up being her ghost and her her figure, her specter just kind of looming in the background, you have to wonder, okay, what the fuck is up with her now? We have the ashes that he's spreading of her and his dad. But the more that you learn moment by moment through this movie of even like how he describes who killed his mother and that they were too young to be tried or really punished, it was just super fucked up. So when we finally get to that scene and he's playing with a gun, and what ends up being her groceries just dropped on the floor and the blood slowly emerging, her coming from behind him. Oh my god.

Sean 37:04

Yeah. It's crazy. There's something about the way they told the how this death happened, as it like it, because it kind of like we go into it in two different sections, but when we when we get into those scenes, it's almost like we're getting insight into Ohm's like suppressed memory of what's happening, something that he remembers because there's some weird stuff. It's a very empty dark space. It's very empty. There's just this TV on the ground with this children's show that's happening, which we all like, which we all think is like. I honestly thought it was a bunny for a long time. I guess it's Jack the Jackass, the donkey, or whatever, but it looks like a bunny to me. It it is just a very, very interesting way that they told this story, but so effective and just heartbreaking the way that it the gun pops off, and her instinct initially is to just go and hug Ohm, and like almost like it's okay, you know what I mean, right away. But you know, the fact that that all happened was insane.

Kris 38:04

And how fucked up is it that he how he how does he still have the gun? Why are they keeping that gun in the family?

Sean 38:10

It's just one of those things, you know. It's just like it's like, I guess, one of those things where he's like, I have to remember this. This is just something that that that is he's latched on to for so long, he's carrying the weight of this guilt.

Kris 38:22

Yeah, I hit a man with my car, so I thought I would just keep the fucking steering wheel the rest of my life. God damn, no, you don't need to do that. Get rid of it.

Sean 38:30

I hear you.

Binx 38:31

Talk about masochism and a lack of therapist.

Sean 38:33

Yeah, it's a lot, it's a lot, which is also heartbreaking as this story unfolds is that like because of what happened, his dad basically hates him, right? And then becomes this alcoholic that drinks himself to death. And so, like, he not only loses his mom by accidentally shooting her, playing with his dad's gun, he now loses his dad, who probably treated him like crap all the way up until his death. So God only knows what Ohm has dealt with as a child, you know, growing up with this guilt and then with it getting thrown probably in his face. Who knows how that worked out? But it just is very, very dark and very heartbreaking.

Binx 39:12

My answer to that is not to be a dick to the father in particular. But some nuance there, I would imagine, or I would hope, is that the father probably feels guilty for letting the gun be easily accessible to begin with.

Kris 39:26

But I don't know. Based on how Ohm's acting, it's giving how did you how dare you do it? It's giving Bear blaming Sandy for getting into his fucking meds that he looks accessible. That's what it's giving. Oh God. Ohm's dad is definitely like, you son of a bitch. Mother rest in peace.

Sean 39:44

Yeah, it's an interesting thing. I mean, this this is actually a topic that you know has probably come up tons of times, sadly, right? Like, there's this always this thing of like, if you're gonna own a gun, are you gonna keep it safe? Are you gonna keep it loaded or unloaded in a locked box, in a gun safe? Like, where do you keep it? Because we know that things have actually happened in real life where kids find the gun and they want to play with it, they think it's cool, and the next thing you know, they either shoot themselves or shoot their friend, or something happens, and it's very sad. So, like, I get what they're playing with there for sure. On a lighter note, before we dive further into the kills, on a lighter note, maybe, maybe this is funny, I don't know, but there was a moment. There was a moment in the very beginning when we see the the the first kind of scare of what we now know is Ohm's mother behind him in his apartment. There was a very brief moment where I was like, is this Marty Feldman from Young Frankenstein? Is that Igor? Oh shit. It was a brief moment. I got over it pretty quick, but the first like first thought I was like, oh my god, this is so strange. It's either that or the like the witch from from like Snow White or something. I don't know. It was a brief moment, obviously, probably just me, but it's all good. That's just the way my brain operates. So we go forward throughout this story, right? And then we start to we start to learn even more. These are all deaths that we don't really get to see. We kind of hear about. So carrying on with that, we we learn about Jerry, who's a great character in this movie. He's a great character, this random vagabond that lives in the woods and eats a bunch of m mushrooms or drinks mushroom milk. Who knows? He's tripping out in the woods. But we learn that his backstory is a little dark. He he kills his wife. We also kind of later on learned that he killed his wife as you know, what he says is a mercy kill due to her terminal illness. And he also was validated by this because he also was tripping on mushrooms and saw the ghost of his wife that he killed, who told him, Thank you for doing that.

Kris 41:51

Yeah, yeah. I mean, hold on a second. Let's just go on down to the county courthouse, let's go to the county jail, follow the next couple murder trials, and when it times for arraignment or indictment, let's just say, hey, hey, as it turns out, my wife was dying. It was a mercy kill dog.

Sean 42:09

Mercy kill. Mercy kill.

Binx 42:11

It's giving Silent Hill to James Sunderland. It's giving how convenient, how odd, how interesting and well timed that. She had it coming.

Sean 42:22

Yeah, put me in front of the jury and let me explain to you the trip that I had where my wife told me that I was validated and killing her.

Kris 42:29

Officers, we have had a doozy of a day. There I was, minding my business, tripping my balls off with mushrooms, and my wife was dying of cancer.

Sean 42:40

Yikes. Oh man. Yeah, it's not a great, it's not a great story. It's not a super compelling story for anyone that wasn't on the mushrooms. But then get into some really dark stuff, right? The movie kind of like really kicks off into this kind of like mystery, ghost story, witch story, this whole plethora of different things happening. And we see Fiona, who dies in the movie, a character that, you know, we kind of grow to like because she is someone that kind of didn't back down to Ohm and his bitchiness at in the very beginning. It's the only character that Ohm kind of like warmed up to a little bit. And she's the one that found Ohm, who almost tried to kill himself by hanging himself in his hotel room, but she was later on. We find out that she was killed by what we think could be either the witch that's living in the basement of the hotel, but through the honeymoon suite, or maybe died from malnourishment from being stuck there. Like it's a mixture of different things. So we're not a hundred percent sure. Either way, one of the creepiest looking bodies I've seen in quite some time. If you want to talk about a bunny, you want to talk about Donnie Darko, we're talking about Fiona in the fucking elevator shaft here.

Binx 43:57

That is a moment that will. be marked in the brain because holy Christ was that unsettling. And even though that it's shown in one of the trailers, I believe, first of all, the way that she looks, it's so disturbing that you don't, at least for me, you don't realize that it's Fiona. So I'm watching the movie, never thinking nor remembering that I'm about to eventually see a clip of a woman stuffed in a fucking dumbwaiter as a bunny.

Kris 44:31

Yeah.

Binx 44:31

Disturbing absolutely. Now this is a death though that I was kind of like curious about because to my interpretation of this is it was malnourishment and she was stuck because otherwise this witch, it's not a morality thing, I don't believe she will take anyone to the underworld. So and she couldn't have drawn a circle like in such a small dumb waiter.

Sean 44:57

So I don't quite know what's interesting though, because yeah like to your point why what was the purpose of her not being taken by the witch was it only because now I'm thinking okay now I get it. So now if we if we think back to this story that the hotel owner is telling these two kids in the very beginning when Ohm is checking into the hotel there's the folklore kind of story that he's telling the kids to scare them about this witch that will essentially capture you and drag you through the underworld and then there's another layer where maybe she might also chop your private parts off for fun. Like that was also a little hinted at thing, you know, saying it without saying it kind of thing.

Binx 45:45

And so now that I think about that specific touch like that specific point that was made maybe she only takes men I mean it seems that way because the only people that we see although not many options I suppose otherwise to really test this theory it is technically just men that she's taking.

Sean 46:13

All I do know is that if I can figure out where I mean this is probably like really expensive shit, but if I can figure out where they got the contacts for that body I would love to grab a pair of those for Halloween that because that seems like I can make a dead person come to life you know what I mean I'm in I'm in for it.

Kris 46:32

Are you about to be Fiona and the dumb waiter from my God can you imagine?

Sean 46:36

That'd be kind of cool.

Kris 46:37

I'd have to say it oh my gosh I'm kind of with it actually that'd be kind of fun I didn't find her body to be that disturbing I maybe I've just seen too much fucking Kris I don't know what's going on over there either. Yeah. Listen like I thought like oh man when I when we saw her again it just hit me emotional like fuck man and like when you see the state that she's in it's you just realize that she's been just trapped down there for months at this point. And so it's it was painful to me to see her and think about the suffering and just like the waiting and just being stuck there. But I mean reality is I think maybe like my brain just blocked out her looking worse because she is wearing a fuzzy bunny costume. So I think I just separated that I was like okay she got a little dirty I mean granted she's probably sitting there in her own filth oh my gosh. She looked incredible but also not so much where I'm like damn that's a great corpse you know what I mean?

Sean 47:39

I don't know the face man it was something about it like there was moments mixed with the kind of the lighting and then the play on the the sound design and the score there were moments where like my mind was also like expecting her to move the whole time like come to life in some way I almost convinced myself she did move at a point but obviously it didn't there's also the thing where she kind of disappeared and then reappeared but then I think that's later explained once we figure out that Oh has been drinking the magic stuff for a little while so but okay we'll we'll continue with I'm sure there's more to say about Fiona I think I'm sure there's more to say about some of the scenes that surround Fiona but Jerry we'll get into Jerry because the next death that we get is Jerry he gets you know he's a strong character man like he is as much as like you want to be like man this guy killed his wife this seems kind of sketch he also for the rest of the movie kind of showcases that he has a really good heart and he's really trying to help his friends and stuff and so he is like this positive driving force in the film which he ends up getting shot in the head with a crossbow by Mal later on as he's trying to help Ohm escape the honeymoon suite.

Kris 48:52

Just as it seems like he's about to say all live it's just it's so shitty. I mean Jerry's death didn't devastate me but I enjoyed him so much as a character and so when he dies it was okay yes I'm not emotionally wrecked like I think I hurt more for Fiona but I was very much like oh Jerry damn I liked him he had a heart of gold quality that really hurt for me which is weird to think about like a fucking guy doing shrooms in the woods who killed his own wife okay he's weird for sure but he isn't cruel and I think everything that we see from him shows that he's not cruel which makes him so much more likable and so much more warm. So when Mal shoots Jerry with that crossbow it also feels almost even more like Mal's cowardice right because it's not like this big grand villainous gesture it's just like this desperate moment of cleanup and he's trying to erase every witness and burn the whole place down. And so it just sucks and it's so shitty that Jerry went out that way after everything he fought through to come back and to really try to help and his own conscious pushing him forward and trying to find Fiona.

Sean 50:05

Yeah it is it's complicated it's complicated this movie does this thing where like the characters outside pretty much like the characters between Ohm, between Jerry right you're kind of going back and forth on do you like this character do you not? And Jerry was you know despite what backstory he has just a really positive dude which is interesting. And then we get to Mal because let's just talk about this guy because there isn't any gray area here. This guy is just a genuine piece of shit. He is a terrible terrible dude we see all of the bullshit that he's doing he's not only responsible for Fiona's death and we later find out that it's because he didn't like she was going to have his baby and he didn't want her to have it and so like his his reaction was like let me just stuff you down this fucking you know elevator thing and just let you die and like what the what a crazy fucking dude this guy is.

Kris 50:59

You know obsession and hook them both really just teach us that men really do be sucking sometimes it was crazy this guy I can't believe it. I first of all needed to wrap my head around the fact that Fiona would even dare touch Mao with like a stick okay Bings this is Fiona to Mal as Nikki to Ian like what the fuck are these women thinking you deserve better we're settling we're settling a little too far on the deep end here.

Binx 51:32

I know things are rough but come on now.

Sean 51:34

Bad choices bad choices yeah so like he's he's just a he's just a bad dude he's responsible for Fiona's death he's responsible for Jerry's death he's trying to obviously also let ohm rot in this fucking honeymoon suite so like there's nothing good about him. So when this fucker gets dragged into the underworld by the witch uh it was definitely justified. But I will I will tell you all of these kills I think they hit in some way you see some stuff that I think is really well done.

Spoiler Zone

Sean 52:07

What I there's so many things we can talk about and what made this movie so like great to watch and just invested in watching and captivated I think for one we can just start with the set design. I think the set design itself was just incredible. I'm sure y'all have something to say about it. Everything about the way this movie looks is perfect from the creepy old hotel to the honeymoon suite to just all of like the little dream sequences that we get everything was so well done the dimly lit everything, the gothic look I love it.

Binx 52:40

Absolutely I have never been more afraid of sheer cloth surrounding four bed post bed frame. I don't know you would what you would describe that but if you can visually follow me here and think about it in your head fuck that noise. I would never I would never when I was a kid sure I wanted a little canopy moment you know surrounding my bed all cute after this movie throw that shit away hell to the no yeah it is okay it is so reminiscent Binks of the gosh what what is it it's all coming back to me now music video where it's just billowing curtains and billowing dresses from Celine Dion.

Kris 53:19

That's what it seems and feels like and that whole moment especially like just the way that it everything feels very old and musty and musky but also glamorous in a really fucked dingy ghosty way.

Sean 53:34

Oh that whole the whole honeymoon suite just feels like it hasn't been lived in in so long but the details that you see the little cherubs that are on like the fireplace the creepy little thing that is swinging that against the clock like oh man it's it's beautifully done.

Binx 53:54

It reminds me of the haunting millhouse it's perfect. And Adam Scott was saying at the event that they when they were shooting in that room they never turned an actual light on they were operating off of the natural light that was coming in from that room like they never turned on any of the lights he was by himself for I think like several weeks at one point like just to be in that atmosphere in space.

Sean 54:16

So it's like Jesus even as like knowing that you're doing a movie fine but being a normal human being just acting showing up to work and that's where you're going to work is a big hail to the gno he's like yeah I just spent you know my night sleeping in that bed I just really soaked it all in that if I had lived in that space for that long and that I mean I feel like eventually I guess you would get used to it but like it just feels like such a creepy environment to just be chilling in I don't know I don't know it was really well done either way. I think the other thing that really stands out is the sound in this movie. Everything from the score to the sound effects and and the sound design as a whole it was incredibly atmospheric. It's a huge addition to why this movie feels as creepy as it does. It really just proves what a good score will do to a movie.

Kris 55:07

It's really proof right here all the way to this point where there's like moments in this film where the sound adds to jump scares that aren't even that that just gets you even though they're so stupid like there's the there's a moment where you're just living in this space it's like this lurking dread the sound the score is just kind of there it's humming you're just like moving around and then all of a sudden it's quiet and then all of a sudden the fucking clock hits and the little ding hits on the clock and you're just like uh oh oh my God it's uh it was hilarious it was absolutely great I love when movies can do that for sure and I really want to just shout out for a moment here the sound the sound design especially when we have the children show and he's like obviously surrounding this we see the show and everything seems really fucking normal and it then becomes almost like this welcome to dairy Pennywise esque situation where it's like there's some kind of sentience here and we're understanding that this character and like this manifestation of the show is pr is is his own is Ohm's projection and his guilt for everything. And I remember just hearing and stop me if you I also had the same thought do we remember all that yeah on the Pelodeon yes so when in the children's show he's like dear Jack that's me I was also he's like dear Ashley that's me Amanda Bynes yes yes 100% segments yeah and then I'm thinking about how everything worked out for her. I hope she's well yeah but aside from the sound in this movie which is honestly stunning one of the things that I really really loved is actually just the opening and again not just the framing of it and how we get this like moment into into glimpse in this glimpse into what his process is like how he's stuck but it is specifically the little things that tie the sequence together. And it's a beautiful moment of editing where you see this ring in the sand and then you cut to him actually fucking writing this story and it's the condensation ring from the glass and that's what I'm saying it's like this beautiful blend of not only his reality but the fiction that he's conjuring and how these things both influence each other's I just absolutely fucking loved it.

Sean 57:34

It took me I think the second watch to really appreciate that even more because I think the first time that I watched it I was so taken aback by how odd it was to open the movie that way that I didn't once I got through the movie I was reflecting and I'm like okay I kind of get it. And then when I watched it a second time I was like okay now I'm getting the the parallels of what he's writing to how it translates to what he's going through.

Kris 57:58

Yeah and oh my gosh even from again the drinking that he's doing in real life to cope and to numb to then the drinking and like the the quenching of thirst out in the desert searching for something in this like duality this companionship but then to go straight into what he's being haunted by with his parents again just the way these two things kind of like cut back and forth and that's again I think another just strong aspect of what this film does well technically it makes it clear that his writing is a pressure valve for his guilt.

Sean 58:35

Yeah it's really really good I think all of this stuff works to to really bring this movie to life I will shout out I love absolutely love how Damian McCarthy connects his horror films. We touched on it a little bit earlier and he connects his horror films through these subtle shared items these characters the kind of these reoccurring motifs I think they're these movies kind of exist in the same universe and it this is something that I brought up even in the Oddity episode as well. We have in this movie a a a few different things that connect both oddity and caveat to this one which I thought were really great we have the desk bell in the in the at the desk that's obviously the haunted desk bell from Oddity um we have in the beginning where you know we're first introduced to Ohm checking into this hotel we have the couple that is checking into the hotel that's played by the same characters from caveat and they are actually seen with the stuffed rabbit sticking out of their luggage. So that all ties back to caveat and then if you caught it if you caught it you can see the moment where Fiona is introducing this Irish folklore book and on the book it says that it's written by D Odello which is another nod to oddity from Darcy Odello.

Kris 59:53

Man this is giving Mike Flanagan a midnight mass and hush yeah which I am all about it.

Sean 1:00:01

I think it's just fun. I think he adds this layer of of things that like if you're a fan of his films like obviously his filmography isn't super vast right now but if you're a fan of caveat and you watched Oddity and now you watch this there's and you don't even have to watch him in any specific order. If you just watched Hokum and you really liked Hokum go back and maybe watch the other two films as well there's just these kind of nods that you'll kind of notice if you pay attention and I think it's just kind of a really fun thing to do. I don't know how long you can carry it but it's kind of cool.

Binx 1:00:32

Well I hope in the next movie he has an Easter egg for Jack the Jackass because personally him as a character or just him being in this movie I thought that he was incredible and terrifying. And yes although halfway through I couldn't quite discern if he was a bunny, a donkey or what have you I don't really care. He looks strange. And I think like his introduction we've talked about it already with the children's show like it was incredible because any setting like that I find very compelling and eerie and fucked up because you're mixing in this concept of like innocence, right? And and this curiosity of children and they're having fun with some elements of like uncanny valley a little bit with I guess like his look to an extent from a distance. Everything just feels bizarre and off and unfucking safe. And I'm so glad that you brought up it and welcome to Derry because I think that there was definitely some inspiration there or at the very least it felt so similar because it's a character that I'm sure as a child you're not thinking or looking too into what Jack the Jackass looks like. But I almost thought of like fuck it like what if Barney you know what I'm saying like not to not to say that that's next in the IP horror adaptation but Jesus Christ like if you look at Barney long enough I would almost be curious to see what Damien McCarthy could do to Barney at that point.

Kris 1:02:10

Because Barney is so fucking obsessed with Barney that is for horror movie potential I love you love me. There's something there about a killing spree there's something there.

Binx 1:02:21

We'll workshop it oh I listen I think that there's definitely something there to absolutely destroy your childhood memories a thousand percent oh man somebody's gonna do it.

Kris 1:02:31

Watch now there's gonna be a fucking Netflix or Hulu doc on the rancid like fucking drug scene that was that befell fucking the guys who played Barney or some shit. It's gonna there's gonna be something dramatic out there.

Sean 1:02:45

Any moment now oh my gosh well there were so many I think effective moments in this movie little ones and then there was ones that were really spread out and I think that you know for me there were there was themes that really stand out which we can get into but the moment there's a scene that happens when you're when we're really in the thick of it when ohm is in the honeymoon suite and he's like he's definitely stuck like he he's up you know he he spends some time up there he goes through some shit he sees some shit he ends up somehow falling asleep well now we know he fell asleep because he was on the magic mushrooms you know what I mean he got he got kind of slipped some mushrooms in that whiskey flask and so there's the you know there's that whole sequence but it's after you know he figures out that he's stuck there and he has to find he has to find a way out right so he he's going down this elevator shaft or whatever we're calling it I don't even know but he's going down this thing to get down into the basement the thing that Fiona was stuck in and there's so much happening with this when you really think about it. There's a lot of the eerie atmosphere that's happening there's a mixture of what I think is really brilliant to the story is there's this mixture of this tape recorder that was his that Fiona has that she is leaving these messages and her like ghost is basically playing these at like the most perfect moments to kind of like guiding him through some things like talking through her story and her experience and there's moments where she's like you know you have you're gonna have to kind of rig this up because you're not gonna be the button doesn't work down there. So if you have to get back up you're gonna have to rig it somehow so he kind of rigs it up he goes down there and he's kind of like lurking around and we get this we get this wailing throughout the whole movie. We get this thing like throughout the whole movie and we're like what is this is just part of the sound design and we later find out that it's like the howl of what the the sound that his mother made when she died basically is what is like latching on to and he keeps being haunted by this and and so like he's down there he's hearing this this wailing that's happening the whole time and then as soon as like this tape recorder kicks in and he starts to hear Fiona talking saying like she doesn't think she's alone down here and then it shuts off and he can start to hear these chains and he can hear the witch that's down there that has been trapped down there by the owner of the hotel that's part of the folklore and we'll get into it I want to hear what y'all think about the witch aspect but like let's just talk and live in the scene for a second because like the witch is coming you can hear it. You can't see shit it's dark as hell down there. It's like a dungeon there's like very dim lighting along the walls and he's like he realizes oh shit this is not a good time he hears the thing potentially going off so he's got like maybe seconds to get back up there. So he runs back up there but it's not working. Of course it's not fucking working why would it work when he thinks it's gonna work so he's sitting there and you can see he's like he's really trying to see into the darkness and like we're reacting probably at least I was reacting in the same way. He's like ducking down to like look and I'm ducking down to look. I'm like, yeah, do you see anything? I'm not seeing anything. I'm like talking to this guy. I'm like, oh, do you see anything? I don't see shit. I'm looking. And then finally it dings. He starts to go up and you see like this slow emergence of like the witch, but you don't really get a full picture and he's going up, right? And then it starts to go down when he gets up, he jumps out. This fucking thing starts crawling up the fucking shaft. This thing, it's creepy. This whole scene doesn't let up. If she's coming up, the witch is coming up. He closed the door, her fingers are coming out. He chit, she chases him through the whole honeymoon suite. He somehow, well, one, he falls into that nasty water in the bathtub, and God knows how long it's been there. But he draws a chalk circle around the bed and he's able to like save himself in that moment. That whole progression had me on the edge of my fucking seat. That shit was wild and so effective. And it doesn't even give you that much like visual of the witch. It's just like a perfect level of restraint that I thought was really, really well done.

Binx 1:06:57

Def I I literally was holding my breath throughout that whole scene. And the way that you just retold it, I was feeling that tension all over again. Some kind of level of like, oh shit, I'm I'm back in that space. I'm back in that scene. Not fun. Not fun.

Kris 1:07:14

Yeah. I mean, listen, that was the most tense moment of the entire movie. It all really builds up to that, which I respect. One of the things that stood out, especially when you talk about the wailing and how we realize it's his mom sound. You know what it reminded me of, and what I couldn't get out of my head when I heard that. Undertone and waiting for the fucking death rattle. That is what was buried in my head the entire so true.

Sean 1:07:40

Dang. That is true. Super effective use of that for sure. And like how you don't really know what it is throughout the whole movie, I think adds to another level of that. But yeah, when you think of all the different layers of what's happening, once we're in and living in this space in the story, I I know you you all have kind of mentioned like what you what you thought was, you know, like maybe what we thought should or shouldn't have been in the movie or whatever, we think there's too many layers to this. To me, I will say, like, I get the whole the whole witch aspect and the whole folklore aspect of the things. Like, um, I could see that it's like, okay, well, this is just like another thing in there, but we have so much going on with Ohm and his haunting, and like, did the witch aspect need to be in there? I don't know if that's what you all were alluding to, but I think for me, what made this movie work was that there were there were a couple of different kind of entities that added to the spookiness of this film, and I think that they didn't give you a lot about the witch. They don't really dive into like the backstory of this witch too much, and I think it just kind of added to me, it added to the film. I kind of liked it.

Kris 1:08:52

I think for the layers that we got, we have so many different things, right? We have a guy and his guilt, a guy and his grief going to a place to try to get some kind of closure and spread his parents' ashes. That's one. You have going to this hotel where his parents were, weird shit going on in the hotel, actual murder. That's two. You have Jerry and his whole life thing in the in the mushrooms, that's three. When you get down to it, and even what this movie even like acknowledges up until the very end, when uh Albi admits that he drugged Ohm with the mushrooms and he spiked his whiskey with it. Yeah. It becomes this like momentary question of oh, did any of that really happen, or was that tripping balls? And then obviously you see the marks on his wrist, and it opened up his mind to the supernatural. Okay, we acknowledge it. But for me, I almost I can I get it. I I get the comparison there and like the vulnerability of that, but I still just didn't love the stacking on stacking on stacking. For me, the witch angle, I think there was enough for me that was compelling and scary in his own mind without there needing to actually be a supernatural witch angle. That's just me personally.

Binx 1:10:11

I'm with you on that to an extent, because like I actually think that I would have traded something else to be omitted instead of the witch. Like, for example, Jack, I was a little disappointed that he is not really the main antagonist or just really isn't in the movie that much at all. Because I think his character design could have done wonders to be something terrifying long term or whatever, right? So that was a little disappointing. But I think ultimately for me, what I would have probably removed was Mal, because personally, first of all, I can't even just comprehend what she could have seen in him to begin with. Secondly, the very little chemistry that was established to let me buy into that whole story. Third, quite frankly, at one point my best friend was like, wait a minute, why should I care about this? Who the fuck is this guy? Isn't he just like the bellhop or something? And then I had to be like, bro, apparently it was said, and I had to recollect that he is the son-in-law of the owner. But why is the groundskeeper, Virgil, the one that seems more like his son-in-law than Mal? Like it's just a weird red herring situation that didn't need to be there at all. I think that there could have still been this like murder mystery element with it being the witch ultimately and not having to include a whole other plot line of Yeah, like she like she did go up there just to see, like she got fucked up at the party, she finally got like the the nerve to go up there and then she got got by the witch kind of thing. Or or even if if we were to kind of change a little bit when the m suicide attempt happens, right? Or something to that effect where it would prompt her to want to find where he is or Ohm is. And maybe she finds herself in that room, she finds something that piques her curiosity, but she still continues to look for Ohm, saves him, whatever. But ultimately, she found something that draws her to want to go back into that honeymoon suite. Something along those lines, I guess, it just seems a little bit like we need to find some random guy where we can give her enough reason to get killed. And we're gonna pick that guy. Like it just seemed very random.

Kris 1:12:35

You know? I was just thinking about this when you're talking about okay, Moll, yes, we can get rid of him. As they're reflecting on this, Binks, and you're like, fuck, I wanted like the witch angle to be there, I wanted Jack to be there. I'm just thinking, Dan, you really are the paranormal paramour because you want some spooky shit where I'm like, give me the real person, give me the murder mystery, give me the groundskeeper who's a little angry and a little jaded and wants to fuck some shit up and have a great revenge plot. That's where I'm at. I mean, leave it to me to want the slasher energy in the fucking paranormal movie. But going back to Jack for just a second, Jack had as much to to impact in this movie as you remember in The Shining when there's like that guy in the fucking bear costume or the dog costume, he's getting a blowjob from the other fucking guy that's opened in. That is the equivalent exposure here that we got, and it's just a criminal underutilization. Yeah, I wanted more bear blowjob, okay. I wanted where was it? Did you just have obsession?

Binx 1:13:36

I did.

Sean 1:13:38

I did. Oh my god. I lost it again. I think so. This is what I was kind of talking about earlier in saying that I also agree, and to some extent, that Jack was genuinely a creepy looking aspect of this movie. Uh from the trailers, I was like, fuck this thing. Like, I don't I don't know what this is, I'm not into it. It's creepy as hell. I think it did add to that level of creepiness, but to me, to your point, Binx, like maybe we maybe we needed a little bit more of Jack in the story because it did end up feeling like we were just kind of finding a reason to throw that in there to an extent. But then, like, that was one that was my initial reaction to watching this film. And then if you like watch the film again and you really kind of like dive into all there's so many little things that this movie is trying to tell you. So, like, there is a lot. There's a lot where this movie, you know, you you gotta you gotta think about it, you gotta think of all the little things that are said, all the things that are mentioned, the references, all what all the characters are saying, because there's a really interesting moment, or there's a interesting point that is brought up early on in the film about the goats. And the goats in this movie are uh, you know, one, they they're like killing off these goats because they're just like trampling on top of these customers, these guest cars, right? But there's this moment where Jerry's kind of introducing like the goats, and they're saying, like, the goats like to eat these mushrooms too. You know what I mean? The goats are tripping on these mushrooms in the woods, and they kind of like to jump on cars because they like to stare at themselves in the car. And there's like this point that they can, when you stare into reflective surfaces, you can see deeper into things, and like, but he's like, Well, but you gotta be careful, man. Like, if you tripping too hard and you look in a mirror, man, you're gonna see you're gonna trip out even harder, you know, man. Like, he's like really like, you know, it's Jerry, man. He's he's tripping on mushrooms the whole time. So it's interesting. So what I'm thinking about that, I'm like, why the fuck was this like a such a centerpiece in the dialogue? And then I'm thinking at the moment that Ohm is looking into the TV screen, it's a reflective surface. And so, like, maybe he's actually looking at himself and seeing Jack because it's like a repressed memory of this childhood, you know, I don't know, TV host that he was watching at the time that this happened. And so he's haunted by the visual of this and he's remembering this. And I don't know how factual the moment where he's reading a letter that's sent by Ohm. Like, I don't know if he actually did send that letter in. I don't think so, but I think he's just like, you know what I mean? But I think, you know, he's tripping, he's looking in a reflective surface. I think so. Now I'm like, okay, I can kind of buy into Jack a little bit more, but I still think ultimately it did feel like kind of like we're just sprinkling it in there for effect.

Kris 1:16:35

Listen, that was the aspect that I was okay with being sprinkled. I want more Jack Less Witch. Okay. Give me that. Give me the repressed trauma, and I am satisfied with that.

Binx 1:16:45

He was a jackass, Ohm, at the very least. So okay.

Kris 1:16:49

Speaking of Ohm being a jackass, I want to talk about one of my favorite fucking moments in this movie, which is honestly so fucked up and so shitty, and then obviously comes back at the end. Ohm is approached by Albi and he calls him an ob and he calls him an oblivious charisma vacuum. I can't tell you how many people I know on a regular fucking basis that I I honestly I went to I shouldn't say that. Yikes. You know, I was out in just life today and I saw at least six people that I wanted to call an oblivious charisma vacuum. Not unlike an energy vampire. And I I absolutely love and hate when he calls him that because it shows how dismissive Ohm is towards someone who genuinely looks up to him. It is cutting, it is an insult, it is so disrespectful, and it's a deep lack of generosity. So, you know, obviously when Albi asks Ohm to read his manuscript, I mean this moment, it's like you you see you hear this quote, never meet your heroes. And you have this moment of like, okay, he he idolizes this person. He is a creative person, he is proud of his work, he wants to share his work. And I think from Ohm's perspective, okay, how many people are gonna ask you to re read your fucking read their manuscript? But when Albi asks, and then Ohm declines, and then Albi uh says no, or asks uh when I'll be asks why not, he burns his hand with a fucking spoon that's he was like holding over a flame. It's fucked up, but also really well timed, and says that he needs thicker skin than that if he wants to make it as a writer. It's brutal, it's it's funny in a really fucking mean way. But as fucked up as it is, I think it does a really good job of showing how deeply wounded Ohm is and how jaded and bitter he is, which I think obviously serves the change that he ends up making really well because it makes it more meaningful.

Binx 1:19:05

I wrote the same thing basically about that cautionary never meet your hero's tail, because it it definitely is something where it facilitates this opportunity to humanize your heroes, even if what you're humanizing them into is something not so great down the line, right? Ultimately, some of your heroes are gonna be extremely flawed and broken people. So that's exactly what we have here with Ohm. And he is an incredible personification of guilt, cynicism, grief, suicidal ideation, like all of these very dark thoughts and feelings, right? Um, and an artist to boot, of course, like the mega passions and extremes of conveying emotion on paper. And I I think that it's like they're the polar opposite of people ultimately at the end of the day. I do find it curious, not to go back to Jack, but I hadn't realized this in the moment, that the actor that plays Albi also plays Jack, the Jackass. So I don't know if that's supposed to be some kind of other thing. Maybe it's just like, hey, let's save some money and throw some makeup on you, bro.

Kris 1:20:15

But maybe it's that's what I thought for nothing here. One range for that actor, great job. Two, okay, stares into a reflective surface high as fuck and looks back into this repressed memory. Yeah. That's one when he does that, he is subconsciously looking into the face of someone who in their own creative field is not encountering the same stuck points in grief. And almost okay, you look at someone towards the end or like the middle or end of their career, someone who's at the beginning who still has the wonder and the magic and the belief in writing. Is he looking back on his past self in that way too? So I think it's an interesting thought.

Sean 1:21:00

Yeah.

Binx 1:21:00

Yeah, that positivity. Yeah.

Sean 1:21:02

Yeah. It's a lot, there's a lot going on here. And I think when we really just look at, you know, we're even touching on like how Ohm has treated people and how he treated Albi and all this stuff in the beginning, and then we're getting like the journey that Ohm goes through throughout this movie, and how he eventually gets to the end of this movie where he has kind of let all of that go and he's and he's been able to move past some of his guilt and his grief and his trauma. And I think like there's there's such a good moment in the film towards the end where he is essentially chained up, like he is down there because he has he's he's trying to figure out a way to like you know, he you know, Jerry's dead, the place is on fire, Mal is you know trying to chase after him for the keys and whatnot, and so he goes down into the basement again, and you know, there's a moment where he is being chased by the witch. He thinks he's gonna like draw the whole chalk circle, but he clearly doesn't finish it in time. And the the witch, we get the first like full face frontal of the witch, which is kind of interesting. Maybe like looks more like a like a goblin or something, but he gets chained up, and then we're introduced to Mal coming down, and Mal gets chained up, and now he's getting dragged by the witch down the hall, and he runs into Ohm, and then he gets dragged past Ohm into like the underworld, which is wild. And then he has this moment, and he has this moment where the ghost of his mom comes down and like hugs him, just like she hugged him when he shot her. And it's such such an emotional moment where she's like, You can't stay here. Like he's saying, like, I'm sorry, I didn't mean to do it. It was an accident, or whatever he's saying, it was an accident, it was an accident. She's like, I know you can't stay here. And like the it's just such an emotional moment. Like, physically, yes, you can't fucking stay here, and emotionally, you cannot stay here. You can't stay in this space, you have to move on, and you have to get out of here. And he has that kind of moment where he finally is able to feel like he can come to peace with what happened, and he's able to escape and get out. And it's like that whole thing where you know he gets out of that and he finally wakes up in the hospital. He's reintroduced to Albie, who is now serving ice cream next door. He's a jack of all trades. Uh, and it comes full full circle, right? He's nice, he he wants to read the manuscript now. He's you know, he he's moved on. You can tell he's come, uh he's shed a new light. And I think the journey was was was really uh interesting and very, very heavy, but but very emotional. And I kind of went on that journey with him.

Kris 1:23:41

Yeah, I mean, listen, you go from Ohm being abrasive, dismissive, super blocked and stunted emotionally and cruel to then extending the most basic form of generosity at the end, which I really, really appreciate. Because again, think about it like that framing. He is doom-centered in his writing, he is stunted creatively, he cannot finish his own story because he hasn't been able to resolve anything from his life, and even in the way that that's reflected to how he treats Albi, and uh to see the the pivot that he makes from being an oblivious charisma vacuum to then suddenly like relenting towards the end, like, okay, yes, I he doesn't even like acknowledge it or say it in a way that feels really warm, but there's a shared understanding between the two that I appreciate.

Sean 1:24:33

Yeah, 100%. Oh man, what a crazy time, this whole movie. But the atmosphere was so spooky, it was genuinely a creepy vibe to be in this movie, to live in this space. I'm just like, if you could go and spend the night in this honeymoon suite, would you do it?

Kris 1:24:51

Man, Sean, listen, I'm still trying to go to Lizzie Borden's bed and breakfast. Abso fucking Lutley. If that shit's haunted, I want to be there.

Sean 1:24:59

Oh man, if this is like a real hotel in Ireland, I think this is a destination trip for sure.

Binx 1:25:05

I y'all, I can't with y'all. Look, will I go to see it? Yes, fine. Will I stay there? Hell nah.

Sean 1:25:17

Nope, nope, nope. And would you go to the basement?

Binx 1:25:20

Oh fuck the basement. Now you're asking for too much. Now you got me fucked up.

Kris 1:25:25

You really think she's gonna tiptoe anywhere down there? Oh, yeah.

Binx 1:25:27

Stop it. Oh my god. The way that I sat at the movie theater and could not escape the trailer for the new and that was hell. That was something that I did not account for. So going to the movies has really sucked. I'm gonna purposely miss the trailers now. It's quite the time.

Sean 1:25:49

Wild.

Binx 1:25:50

Well, listen. Go ahead, Tom.

Sean 1:25:52

Listen, I love to play on this kind of like it's hard when you talk about like what is the the best and the worst part of this movie. I think they they did on one end of the spectrum, I think they did like a really good job with this kind of like double haunting scenario where you essentially have this story of the witch and how the witch is kind of haunting this honeymoon suite. Oh, andor basement or whatever the fuck, but it and then you have the haunting that Ohm is dealing with, and it's like this really crazy thing of like you're mixed with this feeling of is the place haunted or is Ohm haunted, or both are two things that are happening at the same time, and Ohm is coming in haunted to a haunted establishment and it adds to this layer. I think that part of the aspect for me, I think it worked really well. I think where you know, I think some people can see, and we've already kind of touched on could be like one of the things that works against the film is that they add other layers into this film. Some people may not like the witch folklore layer, some people may not like that they threw in this character of Jack, uh, or the or adding in all of the layers of Jerry and his backstory and Mal and you know his devious fucking plots of killing these people and killing Fiona and Fiona's ghost and all of these different things. So there is a lot happening here. To me, it doesn't really work against the film. I don't think so, but I think I could see it being a worst part for a lot of people, any given one of those things. So it's unfortunate, but I think for the most part, it worked really well for me. I can I can definitely do more horror like this. I think we're probably living in a reality where a lot of horror is doing stuff where they're kind of like maybe not to this level, but kind of giving you multiple entities of things that are happening, multiple layers of things where it's more psychological. So I don't know. I liked it, but I can see it working against the film.

Binx 1:27:42

Yeah, and I just certainly can think of a few other movies, sure, that kind of mix the two. I think if anything, I just wish that the actual lore itself was standing on like all four pegs of a Stool or like 10 toes down in what it actually was, because it felt like a quick moment in passing. And then aside from the actual story, we just know that you never go to the honeymoon suite. And I think with that, I kind of just forget because I'm too bought into what is clearly the main focus, at least in my interpretation of it, which was this murder mystery. And it never really is quite good at convincing me that the murder could have potentially been this honeymoon suite or this lore or this witch at all. It always felt like no, it's actually someone or something actually happened. So I think that if they were going to mix these two things, it could have just kept at two and not focused on trying to give us 25% of every single thing. Just give us the 50-50 of two.

Kris 1:28:53

Yeah, agreed. I mean, listen, I've I think I've outspoken ad nauseum of how much I wish we had just gone more of the straightforward. Okay, we mix the drugs, so I like the idea of maybe believing that something supernatural is going on, but to truly get it and then to wrap things up with the marks on the wrists. I'm like, yeah, okay. We didn't necessarily need it. And I think that's an interesting taste that this is leaving in my mouth because was this movie good? Hell yeah. It really was. There's a lot to sink your teeth into here, and there's a lot of good stuff happening. And and could I re-watch it? Absolutely. Again, aesthetically, this movie is a a sight to behold. It is a technical feat, but would I re-watch it? I don't know that I'm gonna be super impressed. And I'm not saying that you shouldn't. To be clear, I'm not saying that you shouldn't re-watch it or that it's unworthy of it. But I think for the type of horror that I like, I'm really glad that I watched this, but I don't necessarily need to revisit it.

Binx 1:29:56

Yeah, I think me, obviously, the opposite spectrum of this, it's definitely up my alley. Not only just for like the murder mystery of it all, it's mostly the paranormal, obviously. So aside from the fact that I obviously have great memories of having watched this movie, that definitely adds a little bit of the bias. I I won't lie. I really had a good time with this movie and would watch it again. If I ever go to Ireland, hell yeah. I feel like that would be terrifying, but would it could be fun to watch. Um, but for the time being, I think this is a really good Halloween watch, spooky time.

Sean 1:30:31

Yeah. It is. I mean, I think, you know, for me, this movie hit a lot of like it checkmarked a lot of things for me. I I feel like I'm someone that really does like a good ghost story. I'm someone that really likes kind of like a true crime. I'm like a true crime junkie, so I kind of like it, kind of scratches that itch for me. It's spooky. I I think it's just all of it just is really well done for me. And so for me, like I've watched it twice now, and the second time around was just as good as the first time. It makes me want to watch it again. So when this comes around and it's something that I can purchase, I will 100% probably be owning this. Hey, you give me a Damon McCarthy bundle, I'm probably just gonna buy the whole thing for sure. It's definitely a resounding rewatch. There's a lot of rewatch values, a lot to take out of this movie. So you watch it once, maybe you don't catch everything. I think just for that alone, you should re-watch the movie.

Kris 1:31:23

Yeah, that is that is fair. I think I would re-watch Oddity, but I don't know that I would get through this one. I am curious now to see caveat and to see how I feel about that and where I would rank Damian McCarthy's work. But for now, folks, Hokum has earned a universal slash,

Toodles

Kris 1:31:42

and yet there is still so much more to unpack. Now we were faced with another movie built around grief, folklore, riders tormented in haunted hotels, but we all collectively stayed for Damien McCarthy's scare first approach, Adam Scott's abrasive lead performance, and whether the atmosphere of this hotel was enough to hold the whole thing together.

Sean 1:32:07

100%. And you know, the real question is would you go up into this honeymoon suite and fuck around and find out? Would you drink Jerry's magic milk? You can go even further than the show and continue the conversation in our subreddit. Check us out at hackerslash pod and continue the conversation with us.

Kris 1:32:25

We'll see you next time, folks. And remember, with that attitude, you can stay lost.

Sean 1:32:30

The bleak endings.