How to Train Your Scaredy Cat

SPEAKER_00 0:05

Spooky season greetings and salutations, everyone, and welcome to another bonus episode elective brought to you by the faculty and staff of HackerSlash University. It is I, your Hackerslash University slasher in chief, and today I am joined by our esteemed Dean of the Damned Chell. They're all going to laugh at you. As we continue through the spooky season, we at HackerSlash University want to equip you with all the tips, tricks, and skills that you're going to need to make the most out of the season. Now, this is one of the many bonus episodes we are offering for free all season long to our listeners. And today's lesson is one that will focus on inclusivity, friendship, and a little bit of exposure therapy. This week, classes and session on how to train your scaredy cat 101.

SPEAKER_01 0:47

Yes, we we know them, we love them, we have them in our lives. Maybe we are reformed scaredy cats. They're the folks in our lives that they they promptly leave the room when you mention you get to do a horror movie for movie night, or you know, they're they're ones that that you gotta hold a little closer out of sleepover after watching a spooky movie because they're gonna see Freddy Kruger in the shadows, and every bump in the night is is gonna spook them. So we have them and we know them and we love them, but all hope is not lost, Chris, for them.

SPEAKER_00 1:18

Yeah, no, for sure. And that's such a great play, right? They're the ones you gotta hold a little bit closer after watching a movie. Yeah, that's that's real cute. I don't know that I have ever had specifically that experience. Like I've had scaredy cats in my life, and I am typically, well, I guess in more ways than one in other areas of life, but I'm usually the Sherpa of these kind of experiences, where I'm not gonna be the jerk that tries to just expose you to the worst of the worst or just what I think is the best way to enter horror, but really rather a curated experience. I found that I haven't actually maybe it's because I've been more selective of people, but I haven't had too much of the non-horror fan interaction. I feel like I had that a few years ago, and I I think I've gone a little bit more selective to just be like, all right, I'm I'm done working this hard.

SPEAKER_01 2:09

Sure. Absolutely. They're they and you know, sometimes they they you don't know that they're non-horror fans until you get close to them. Um, I am happily married to a proud and vocal scaredy cat. Uh I've often referred to him as the uh horror novice husband, Evan, but slowly but surely over the last couple of years, he has embraced the non-horror to horror pipeline a little bit. Yeah, he used to be anti-horror completely. Like even just a spooky, you know, kind of creepy episode of a TV show would would freak him out a little bit. We've done some exposure therapy and he's he's getting there.

SPEAKER_00 2:48

It's giving the season of healing, it's giving conversion, it's giving welcome to the family.

SPEAKER_01 2:53

Absolutely. So, yeah, and absolutely a lot of and you know, he has still has his lines, and we'll kind of talk about that as we get into some of the tips and tricks, but he's got his lines that I don't push. He's got boundaries that I don't that I don't test, but there are quite a few horror movies that I'm able to say, Oh, you should come watch this with me. I think you'll enjoy it. I th I don't think you're gonna lose sleep over this one.

SPEAKER_00 3:15

Yeah, I think such a delicate balance of just trying to bring someone into something that you love is the idea of being able to know them well enough to understand how to be a good steward of that experience. I think that's a really special thing. And the more you know someone, the more likely you are to be, I think, caught more cognizant and just more careful and aware of what that means. Like, for example, I know I've told a story in the past where I had an ex who could not do horror movies at all. All of a sudden we're watching House of the Devil at a friend's suggestion, and then bam, someone gets their face shot off, right? It that's too intense. You don't want to do that to someone. And if you do, wow, I don't know. That's not cool, man. Maybe maybe reconsider your approach to things. But I think the ability to know someone and to create a safe space with which to explore, experiment, and really just like start building up some muscle. I think I liken it to the idea of just doing a little bit of conditioning before you try to do an iron an Iron Man. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_01 4:17

That's that's a perfect way of explaining it. You're not doing a marathon your first time out. You know, you need to see what your strengths are, you need to see where the you know where the weak points or the sensitive spots are before you can throw them in again to a really intense horror movie. But kind of on the flip side of those things, you know, we again we love horror. And sometimes, you know, when the non-horror friends in our life decide, you know what, I want to watch a horror movie. It's the spooky season, I'd like to embrace this. Sometimes we want to just really, you know, throw everything at them. And, you know, that sometimes can be really overwhelming for folks. So yeah, it I think everyone who has ever tried to convert a scaredy cat has definitely come from a place of love with it. But yeah, sometimes we do get really zealous and excited, and then you know, you fly a little too close to the sun and you gotta walk it back a little bit.

SPEAKER_00 5:07

Yeah, all of a sudden you're really recommending like high tension, and someone's like, I don't know, this is a little bit too much for me.

SPEAKER_01 5:13

As a little bit much, and you know, and you gotta pry their shoulders down from their ears walking out of a out of a out of the theater a couple times.

SPEAKER_00 5:21

So we give the example that I would never show someone terrifier for their first horror movie with me specifically.

SPEAKER_01 5:28

Absolutely. Yeah, terrifier is a pretty intense one. Anyone that's really just especially gore heavy and kind of in for the shock value, the Saw movies are kind of tough. But there are also a lot of other people, like Horror Novice Husband, where he he can do the gore. He likes a good slasher, things like that. But if it's paranormal, he's out. He's down the street. He's i i you know, his reasoning being like, we live in a house, Chell. It could be haunted, you know, it's almost too real for him. He can he can he he can understand, like, you know, probably a masked slasher probably's not gonna come, you know. He hate one, he hates camping, so he's not we're not gonna get killed while we're going on a camping trip. But there might there could be a creepy thing in the house.

SPEAKER_00 6:15

Yeah, okay. Now I need to know has Horror Novice husband watched The Strangers?

SPEAKER_01 6:21

He has not, but that is one I have considered showing him, and I think this year, with every with the new one coming out, that might be one we show him.

SPEAKER_00 6:30

Yeah. Um listen, there's there's a reason why people are less afraid of a slasher and more afraid of faith and spirituality and paranormal stuff, right? Uh I'm just curious, what is your husband's background with that? You know, when you think about people who are raised with some kind of something, there's usually like a level of familiarity or a level of vulnerability where that feels like it triggers something, I think, from maybe our childhood, and it just like makes you a little bit more good soil for that kind of thing.

SPEAKER_01 7:03

I think a lot of it is he grew up, I mean, he grew up in the Midwest. He grew up being able, like, you know, if something's coming, you know, if I have to protect myself for my loved ones, I can fight them, I can fight them off, they're corporeal. But the paranormal, he didn't grow up particularly religious, but in the Midwest, we kind of have our own little spirituality beliefs kind of things, and just, you know, believes in the presence of evil. And, you know, sometimes it's a little bit trickier to to identify or maybe fight those off. So I think a lot of that is is he can't fight you can't fight that off as easily and you can't see more likely to kind of take you by surprise. Yeah, exactly. You can see uh a slasher coming walking a mile away sometimes, but you know, if uh if something's in your house, it's infiltrated, it's in, and you can't see it, and it kind of has the upper hand. So he didn't like not having the upper hand potenti potentially.

SPEAKER_00 7:54

I mean, listen, that's just good strategy.

SPEAKER_01 7:56

I get it.

SPEAKER_00 7:57

Being cognizant of the situation, right? People who are consistently on alert and looking around them to examine something, right? From a place of like a hunter-gatherer protector type of person, yes, versus someone, and I'll give you this example. Gosh, this was many, many moons ago, but we're reviewing the film, He Knows You're Alone. And during this conversation, we were just having exploring this dynamic of just the the concept of that movie, and Peege, who was on the show, was like, listen, I am an over six foot athletic man, and I've never been afraid for my life. If I go running in the middle of the night, or I'm walking in the parking garage, I am not as afraid of what's going to happen to me. But if you put a woman, even if I'm the nicest guy on earth, a few feet ahead of me, she's far more aware of just her situational uh surroundings and just wondering, like, okay, is this person going to do something to me? So I think there's like that interesting dynamic, right? That predisposes us to be into having a much different relationship with different types of horror.

SPEAKER_01 9:10

Absolutely. And definitely, you know, the gender side of things, I think definitely I know with the, yeah, with slashers and things like that, you know, I'm not I'm not very tall. I'm 5'3, I'm not very fast. So yeah, slashers probably scare me a little bit more than like a ghost, because I I dabble in some of those things. So I I kind of feel like, oh, maybe I could, I've already kind of opened my brain and my mind to that stuff. Maybe I could find a way or I'd be open to those non, you know, non-normal practices to address something like that. Where my husband, he wants, he has, you know, he has a bug out back, he's got all these plans. Like if A goes sideways, B is what happens. So, but you can't plan for ghosts, you know, especially if a ghost is in your house and knows every move. So I think it's the cut being caught by surprise that guys don't like.

SPEAKER_00 9:58

No, this is begging another question. When is his birthday?

SPEAKER_01 10:00

His birthday is the 4th of July, if you can believe it.

SPEAKER_00 10:03

Oh, he's a cancer.

SPEAKER_01 10:04

He's a cancer.

SPEAKER_00 10:05

He's a Virgo somewhere in his chart, I bet. All that planning.

SPEAKER_01 10:08

Oh, I'm sure. I haven't done his chart. Funny enough. Oh, I bet he has a Virgo in his chart somewhere.

SPEAKER_00 10:13

I'd be curious. We're gonna follow up on horror novice, but we should. All of this to say, I think it's very important as you go out on this quest to bring more people into your passions to just get a better understanding of who you are, and also being able to put yourself in the experiences of others or the mindset of others to get a better understanding of what kind of horror you might want to introduce them to. Now, there's a spectrum, right? You can really start off in a place that's universally acceptable for genuinely every person, but it's going to allow you to really follow a good fork in the road and understand what is the end destination, what is the place where I think they could arrive and really build up in terms of the intensity of horror.

SPEAKER_01 10:59

Yes, for sure. I mean, even us big horror fans, we all started somewhere. We all, you know, we all have flavors of horror that we fancy most and ones that we would really rather not, you know, watch unless we really, really want had to. So I definitely think there's, yeah, there's some ways, and we're gonna give you some tips here in a few minutes of trying to gauge that out. And again, do it in a way that everyone feels welcome, safe. There's no pressure to, you know, hit the pause button to walk it back and sort of sort things out. But yeah, there are some good entree entries into the world of horror that you can get a read on of like, okay, you really responded well to that. This one, you know, you kind of got a little weird on this, or maybe we don't want to push this envelope a little too much.

SPEAKER_00 11:44

Yeah. No, I think that's a really good call. There are the folks who they are scaredy cats because they're genuinely afraid of everything. There are the folks who I think just don't like the idea of gore, who are into the idea of like maybe some more suspense, thriller action, but cannot do something horrifically violent. For example, we talked about the strangers, and I think about my sister, my oldest sister, actually, who loves horror movies. We grew up all watching horror movies together. But there was something that changed about her, and also changed with my sister when they became mothers, where they just have like a little bit less of a tolerance for torture and like brutality. My oldest sister, yeah, my my older sister can still pretty much hack it, but my oldest sister cannot stomach watching The Strangers because of the scene with a lot of direct stabbing and lingering in that. So I'm just I'm really excited to dive into the tips because I think it's gonna explore a lot of different styles of people who may be in your life, but also B some universal truths that really set you up for success.

SPEAKER_01 12:50

No, I absolutely agree. Yeah, that's we all come from different places, and there's a lot of folks, me being one of them, I avoided horror movie screws because I just didn't really know what to expect. I didn't know. You know, and then you watch it, oh is that wasn't so bad. So yeah. So there's there's a lot of great ways to bring them in, and we can, you know, we can help you give the rundown, uh nice little study guide here of how to train your security cats.

SPEAKER_00 13:17

Let's do it. Let's start with lesson number one, which you know, to my understanding, just ease into it. Take it easy, puppy.

SPEAKER_01 13:26

Absolutely. I know, like we said, it is when someone says, hey, especially our non-horror friends who are very much proudly non-horror, say, you know what? I think I kind of want to watch a horror movie. You get so excited. You've got a running list in your head of, oh my gosh, I want to show them all of these movies. Pump the brakes a little bit.

SPEAKER_00 13:44

Yeah, I think that's a really good call. You want to be able to pump the brakes, assess, really make sure that the first one you pick is a quality one that will allow you to really A, bring them alongside you, but B, spark enough interest to not be a total turnoff. I've made the mistake in the past because I feel like Halloween from 1978 is such a safe film to show folks because it's a little bit of violence. But at this point, it's so classic and it's so old that I find it to be very, very safe ground. I showed it to Allie and she was like, Oh god, I hate this. Like, I don't hate the concept of Marco Wars, but she found it super boring because of how slow it was, right? So there's that also kind of sweet spot that you have to consider.

SPEAKER_01 14:29

Yes, absolutely. I remember when Evan he wanted to start getting into a little bit more. We'd watched a couple slashers, he'll watch the Halloween movies. He's probably seen a nightmare on Elm Street, but he went the reason we kind of figured out the paranormal was not for him. We did watch The Conjuring. And that's a personal favorite of mine. I love it. I, you know, I grew up, it was one of my, you know, really special favorite ones in college. He was not, it was not for him. We were watching it in broad daylight. He was watching it, he had like his hat pulled down low, he was watching it through. So we learned pretty quickly, like, okay, that is that's a bar that's kind of the red zone there. We'll work our way down from there. But you know, and I know a lot of times people, yeah, you want to have this huge movie marathon and almost kind of think like, oh, if I go scary, super scary, like if I hit that top bar, then everything won't seem as scary. But they might not want to come back to the table after that real high bar that you've set of scary. So it's better to work your way up. It's a marathon and not a sprint when you're training your scary cats.

SPEAKER_00 15:35

Yeah, absolutely. And I think the other side of this spectrum, right? If you have a scaredy cat, or maybe you have just like an apathetic cat who's just thinks horror is a bottom tier genre and just is bored by it, not saying that anyone in my life is, but I have some co-workers who have who have said that phrase to me, which is wild. I think there's also something to be said about employing maybe a three-scene rule instead of squandering the rest of the runtime and trying to force something to happen, be able to be nimble and pause it, maybe change to something else and really just try to curate an experience that's gonna bear some fruit for you.

SPEAKER_01 16:12

Yeah, 100%. I mean, especially in this day and age with streaming, there is so many other options. So, yeah, after a half hour, maybe you can kind of see the you know, the actions ratcheting up, or maybe there's a first kill. There's kind of something that's gone on. Check in, you know, pause. Hey, how are we feeling about this? Do you want to see more? Do you want to do you wanna just pivot? Is this not for you right now? Because you can always go back to it, or maybe not, but yeah, be willing to press pause and pivot and change mid-movie if you need to. Life's too short to watch movies that you're not into.

SPEAKER_00 16:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 16:46

That goes for horror and non-horror fans alike.

SPEAKER_00 16:49

Absolutely. And I think another thing to consider here is when you think of the principle of just like easing into it. A good way to do that is to starting with what's known, uh really known variables. For example, how many people already know who Ghostface is? How many people know who Michael Myers is? Uh and is that a safe place to start if their faces are just so iconic and familiar?

SPEAKER_01 17:14

Yeah, absolutely. It definitely helps, even down to the Pennywise and yeah, the Freddy Kruegers and Chucky. They're they're all over the place. They've been memed, they've been parodied on different shows, and they're they're everywhere. So it they're already kind of desensitized to those creepy, those creepy imagery, you know. So introducing, and sometimes that's how you bring them. It's like, oh, well, that's I've seen that guy everywhere, Freddie Kruger, and like, oh, now I get the backstory. So it and it helps them feel like they're not at a disadvantage. Because again, us horror fans, we can rattle off horror trivia like it's it's nothing. But for a lot of these folks, they don't have those backstories.

SPEAKER_00 17:56

Yeah, which I think it's it's a really makes it even more important when you go to start with a familiar, pick out an entry that has an easier price of admission. I don't know that jumping straight into the end of a franchise that has a lot of continuity is the best take to make, right? Don't create a lot of confusion. But if you were to say, like use a Halloween franchise, for example, there's so many different points of reference within that timeline where you can you have a selection of movies that you can start from. For example, I think not that I think I should really start the Halloween experience with Halloween 6, but if I knew that one of my friends really loved Paul Rudd, my approach to that would be hey, do you want to see Paul Rudd and what was technically the first movie he did that was filmed before Clueless? When you get them to kind of hook into that, even outside of like the iconic figure, I think there's something to be said there.

SPEAKER_01 18:51

Oh, I totally agree, especially, yeah, with like the Paul Steven Rudd or a lot of jokes. I know we joke about Buster Rhymes. Oh, yeah. So I I made enough jokes to enough people that they're like, okay, well, what what is this? And then you show them Halloween resurrection, which you could spend a whole ton of time explaining it, or you can just say, you know what, let's have fun. Like, here's here's Michael Myers. It's a Michael Myers movie. Enjoy the run. You get a little Jamie Lee Curtis in there who is thankfully very widely known outside of the horror sphere. So that helps too, is kind of having this be like, oh, I know that person, and kind of reminds him, oh, it's it's just a movie, you know. I've seen Jamie Lee Curtis and Freaky Friday, so like it it takes you out of it a little bit, which sometimes horror non-horror fans need that exit to be able to step out of it.

SPEAKER_00 19:42

A hundred percent. So I think there's something to be said there, obviously, familiar villains. We also have familiar faces and just people to hold on to. Chell, what's another tip for you that you have?

SPEAKER_01 19:54

I like to give my scaredy cats the power to what I call pick your poison. So if, you know, of course, I I could rattle off all these different recommendations, but for them, it's just names. It's just titles. I guess that one sounds good, but who knows? So a lot of times, especially with Horror Novice Evan or a lot of some of my other friends who they dabble in horror, but they they don't love it all the time. I'll usually give them either like, well, these are these couple movies. Maybe they're coming out on the Hackerslash Podcast soon. So I'm like, well, I want to watch these anyways. Do any of these appeal to you? Or I'll even give them a theme. I'll say, you know what? I'm feeling a zombie movie. Like, you, you know, I'll tell them that morning before I go to work, like, I'm feeling a zombie movie. Look around, listen, read some synopsis. If you want to read the whole Wikipedia article before, fine. I let them kind of pick their poison of like, hey, what do you think sounds interesting? Because then we get to learn what they like, what really appealed to them. And they're a little bit more bought in because they picked it. They're not, it's not happening to them. They chose to have this experience.

SPEAKER_00 21:05

Yeah, there's something different intellectually about suffering through the pain that you've chosen than suffering through the pain that has been thrust upon you. That is honestly power move there, Jell. Brilliant, absolutely brilliant.

SPEAKER_01 21:19

And honestly, there are some times, especially with Evan, where he will bring up, like, oh, well, I noticed this one. I think to his credit, which one was it? I think it was Maggie, the zombie movie. You know, the one with Arnold Schwarzenegger?

SPEAKER_00 21:32

I haven't seen it.

SPEAKER_01 21:32

Oh, it is, it it's wonderful. But I'm pretty sure if I remember, I was like a zombies thing. It might have been during 31 days, might have just been a vibe or something. But he was like, Oh, well, I looked at this, you know, Maggie and Arnold Schwarzenegger, he loves Arnold Schwarzenegger, he's an action movie guy, so girl, watch it. And I was like, Yeah, it's an incredible movie. So sometimes from a non horror perspective, you get some gems that maybe you wouldn't think of before because you know, you've got blinders, you see everything all the time. So Oh yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 22:01

That's great. I love that. Okay. So just a recap so far. Tip number one, ease into it. Tip number two, start with the familiar faces. Tip number three, the Chell special. Let them pick their poison. It's like summoning a demon. You know what I mean? I I absolutely love that. Okay. I can't say that I've had a lot of experience with that. Typically, when I have a lot of folks choosing the movie, it's because we are well on the path, and then they see on TikTok or see online that there's another movie that they're they're hearing about that think they'd be up for and interested in. I think that's great. I think I I I too often have been asked, like, hey, what's a good movie I should watch? versus hey, I've seen I've heard some stuff about this. What can I do? So maybe I need to create some more space to give them the power of choice.

SPEAKER_01 22:50

Yeah. And that goes back to the familiar. There's been a couple horror movies that Evan has seen, you know, scrolling on TikTok, like, oh, well, what do you know about this one? And sometimes I'm like, knowing you, that probably wouldn't be the best. But there's other ones who's like, yeah, you know, we could we could go see that together. And again, he gets to kind of be like, ah, I chose a horror movie. So yeah, social media can be great for that.

SPEAKER_00 23:12

I love that so much. Okay. So we've talked about our first three tips. Tip number four, and I think this is honestly a brilliant one from you giving TMI. Now you could think about this in a couple different ways, right? One, kind of the homework that you alluded to, spoiling the movie up front versus be maybe like a trigger warning. I think people get used to that. But the other aspect that you have have highlighted here, Chell, is the ability to demystify and make it less scary by sharing a lot of insight and information about how these things were achieved on film.

SPEAKER_01 23:50

Yeah. I mean, again, us horror fans, we we know our horror worlds inside and out. We know how special effects are made. We know the greats like Tom Savini. So use that to your advantage, especially if you kind of see maybe this is the movie where maybe they're getting a little squeamish because it's gory. It's this is a great one for gory movies. Is mentioned like, oh, well, that's like like, oh, you notice how it ran this way because it's made with this. Or in the evil dead, they're the the blood is green. Why? Because he didn't want an R rating. So kind of giving them just yeah, too much information. Oh, where did you see that actor before? Like, oh, so and so is in this comedy movie. Great, kind of helps him loosen up the shoulders a little bit because it's just a movie.

SPEAKER_00 24:35

Exactly that. And you've also highlighted even a couple folks, right? Like, we know Alvira is really good about giving context to a movie about really jumping into how this movie was made, etc. I know that you're a big fan of Joe Bob and the last drive-in. I personally haven't partaken in the last drive-in, but I know that's something that people really latch on to, which also makes me think hey, if you're a patron, listen to our watch-alongs. You can have me and Paris, or me and Binks, me and Chell, me and Nathan, me and Sean all watching a movie with you and giving that context as well.

SPEAKER_01 25:12

Yes, and those are so fun, especially some of the ones, the Black Christmas one that you and Binx did. Like, that's a great one because again, it's that excitement and that passion, and kind of shows like, all right, well, clearly, you know, we've watched these movies and came out on the other side. They can do the same. And walking back to the last to the last drive-in, I owe Joe Bob Riggs so much of my horror movie education because again, I kind of came in, didn't know a ton, was starting to listen to some horror movie podcasts and stuff, but Joe Bob is really the one that started talking in an academic way to me and explaining about these directors and how behind the scenes these producers were acting this way, and this is why this movie had this, and you know, and again, kind of just breaking it down to its parts for, and a lot of people need that, you know, when it's an overwhelming situation or an overwhelming scenario in a scene, being able to break it down into its parts or focus on just the one thing of like the blood is green, the blood is green because they didn't want an R rating kind of helps you maybe, you know, fuzz out some of the other stuff that maybe is a little too intense for you. So fat knowledge is power, always is 100%.

SPEAKER_00 26:25

I completely agree with that. The other side of this, right, and this is just the duality of really looking into giving TMI throughout a movie, it requires you to talk during the movie, which may be something that people aren't into and don't want to do. Another big no-no actually leads right into our next tip. So it may seem a little counterintuitive, but I honestly think it's a really great one, which is spoiling the ending and letting them know exactly what it is that they're walking into.

SPEAKER_01 26:54

Yes, yes. It's again for us, us horror fans, we do not want to spoil the ending. We go, I think that is why there's been such a surge of people going to see horror movies in the theater as opposed to other things, because you don't want to if if you want to be scared, you don't want to be spoiled at the jump scare or the craziness or the twist, the act three twist. We don't want that, but non-horror friends, they're they're they're clearly, you know, not as loving. They don't love that adrenaline rush of being scared, and the fear of the unknown can really freak a lot of people out, make them turn around. So yeah, tell them, spoil the ending for them. A lot of times, and I like doing this with some of the formulaic movies, and I've gotten my husband into this. If he's watching something with me, even if he's just kind of coming in midway through, where we guess the jump scare. Have you ever done that, Chris?

SPEAKER_00 27:48

Guessing the jump scare? 100%. I've played it less of a game though, and more of in the moments where I am bringing someone along. I've thought about this with a couple ex-girlfriends that I've had, where I know that they cannot take a jump scare and it's gonna turn them off of the experience. Listen, folks, as horror fans, we know where the hell that's coming. I don't think there's a lot of guessing. So I used to have little signals of like squeezing a hand two times, or just like putting my head on the top of her head, like and just like they give her a moment to cuddle back in. Little gestures like that indicate, okay, something's about to happen. Let me just take off the sting, and then I can really look in and see what's happening.

SPEAKER_01 28:27

Yeah, a hundred percent. That's that's great, little little signals and everything like that. And and again, then then they get to start doing kind of the calculus on their own of like I know pisses him off, and it's so funny, but he's watched the scream movies with me, and the amount of times that they open and close fridge doors, he oh, because he's thinking like because that's one of those things that he's gotten ingrained in his brain and stuff like that. And I think it was in the most recent one, or maybe it was where yeah, where uh where the the West character dies, uh Marley Shelton's dies, and they they were opening and closing it, and Evan was like gritting his teeth because he's like, oh, like because he thought he had it. Guessing the jump scare is a lot of fun, and then I have found even when they fool you, you're both like, oh, that was good. Yeah, like it's almost out of respect, like game respects game, of like, oh, we thought we had it, and they got both of us on the jump scare. Like, and then you can kind of laugh about it.

SPEAKER_00 29:28

Yeah, what I really love here, Chell, is that your approach to this is helping build a lot of skill and understanding the formula to demystify it. And it actually reminds me of just even as I'm like led people through a horror haunt in like Halloween horror nights or a local haunt, etc. You can kind of give away the tricks on what to look for or the pacing, and just you can anticipate what's about to come when you're really good at like spotting patterns and developing that, yeah, then it becomes a lot easier to assess the things that are happening around you. So I think helping others build that skill is a great way to bring your scaredy cats in, make it less scary, but then also help build an appreciation for the genre.

SPEAKER_01 30:11

Yeah, absolutely. Appreciating like all these tension points and the music and things like that. Because again, because eventually they're going to maybe get get used to those tricks, and they're gonna say, you know what? Maybe I want a bigger challenge. You know, I've figured out this puzzle. Let's let's level up to the next level because I know I'm not batting zero. I've got a I've got some info in my artillery. So yeah, it's just a way to help them trump over the scariness. The director and the actor and whoever is not gonna pull one over on them because they know the game.

SPEAKER_00 30:46

Yeah. Now, listen, I think it's a really great strategy, but if you're still in a place, let's say you've tried all of our tips so far, and they're still pretty scared, or they're just like, oh, I can't do this, but you're still in the mood for something spooky, and you really want to try to find a way to bring them into that spooky season with you. There's a couple other movies that you can recommend, and it ties into your last tip, Chell, of falling back on the classics, the things that are just proven safe ground.

SPEAKER_01 31:18

Yeah, I mean, you can have a lot of fun during spooky season without ever having a jump scare. It's there's a horror, you know, we talk about all the time, is so inclusive, and everyone's welcome. And that includes the folks who were maybe, maybe it's a Beetlejuice watch. Maybe you're turning on, it's got the creepy Tim Burton vibes, but it's really not meant to scare you or pull one over on you. It's just to kind of let you soak in the creepy, kind of funky vibes of it.

SPEAKER_00 31:48

Yeah, that's a really good one. Beetlejuice, which again, if you start with Beetlejuice and you move over to Edward Scissorhands, maybe you can go into Sweeney Todd.

SPEAKER_01 31:58

Absolutely. And it's a great way to work it up of like, okay, so you like this atmospheric, you know? Like I know for for Evan, he liked the atmosphere of of the the Timp Burton, and he felt empowered to look at the David Egger stuff. I came home one day to him watching the new Nose for Otto. Yeah, you know, because it was the vibe. He liked watching the vibes, you know, of it all instead of the scares.

SPEAKER_00 32:24

Okay, here's the pipeline that we think we can recommend here, right? I'm thinking about a co-worker of mine who is of the younger generation and had never seen Dracula before, but had seen Dracula in Hotel Transylvania. In fact, when I described who Dracula is, he said, Oh, the ble ble guy. Well, bleh ble. You start you start with ble ble ble so that you can go into Nasratu.

SPEAKER_01 32:57

Yeah, a hundred percent. And getting them getting them used to it, you know, another great one that is all over the place, and it honestly spans multiple seasons as a nightmare before Christmas.

SPEAKER_00 33:08

Oh, yeah, that for sure for me is a November 1st movie, though. I get it. But I get it. Me too.

SPEAKER_01 33:14

Hey, yes, I get it, I get it. I have some students that I teach that firmly believe it's a Halloween movie, but we digress. Yeah, it starts on Halloween.

SPEAKER_00 33:22

How the hell is it a Halloween movie? No, it is a perfect continue the energy of Halloween movie.

SPEAKER_01 33:30

What? Yes, I totally agree. Absolutely. So, but that's one, you know, and that's got some creepier imagery to it. You've got some, you know, if you're kind of thinking like the monster movies, the Frankenstein of it all, that's a good monster movie sort of foray into it.

SPEAKER_00 33:49

Yeah. And I really love that.

SPEAKER_01 33:51

It's it's a great one. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 33:52

Okay, another pipeline here. Start your friends with Hocus Pocus so that you can read to the witch.

SPEAKER_01 33:59

Yes. Yes, a hundred percent. And the best part about witch movies, and they can go so many different directions. You can go David Egger's The Witch, again, with that atmospheric, which I and I will say, Horror Novice Husband Evan, he likes an atmospheric slow burn better than I do. I like getting to the point, but he likes those. He likes to sit and chill in the in the creepy vibes. So absolutely with Hocus Pocus, that pipeline I think is great for him. But we got a lot of other movies where witches are really actively playing into it. I'm thinking of the Wretched, uh Hillbender. Yes, the craft. That craft is a great level two almost. Like, oh, you want you want some uh lady witches?

SPEAKER_00 34:41

Yeah, I'm taking practical magic.

SPEAKER_01 34:43

Practical magic, that's a good one. I actually just watched that this morning. That's a feel-good rom-com for me. It's so good.

SPEAKER_00 34:48

Love that. That's so good. You can also spike in charmed, if you like, or Sabrina the Teenage Witch, or The Chilling Adventures of Sabrina.

SPEAKER_01 34:57

Yes, absolutely. All really familiar IP from different angles. Another great one is supernatural.

SPEAKER_00 35:04

Yeah, that's really good.

SPEAKER_01 35:06

A lot of the a lot of the movies, especially around witches or folk horror, especially. There's a really great pipeline from like supernatural into some of the folk horrors, like the ritual and things like that, kind of because those legends are there and they've already been kind of framed in like a maybe a little bit more of a lighthearted monster of the week way. And then, of course, you know, they can they already again, it's familiar, they kind of know the rules of like ooh, mirrors or things like that, that they can go in not fully blind, they feel like they've got something in their in their corner to hang on to.

SPEAKER_00 35:44

You know what I think we need to do, Chell? Tell me. We need to do a blog post or a presentation, maybe a community event where it's like a keynote party or a PowerPoint party. And we do pipelines. We do starter to I don't know what the last grade is, but the starter kit and then how it graduates up in steps following the same theme, right? So, like witches, for example, thinking about urban legends and thinking about even Candyman. Man, I think there's there's some good stuff there.

SPEAKER_01 36:18

Yes. And uh, we would be remiss if we didn't mention probably the best gateway IP that can go in so many different directions, but it's Scooby-Doo.

SPEAKER_00 36:27

Oh, Scooby-Doo-Be-Doo! Where are you? Where are you? I love Scooby-Doo so much. I'm a big Scooby-Doo fan. I used to have Scooby-Doo sheets and plushies when I was a child. I was I was fucking down. Scooby-Doo is a reason why I want to be a detective for a significant portion of my life and get into private investigation of some sort.

SPEAKER_01 36:48

Yeah, I mean, and especially, and I remember looking back, I loved Scooby-Doo. Watched it all the time growing up. We had the movies, the Alien Invaders, Zombie Island. Didn't realize it until a bunch later. I'm like, oh, I've always kind of been around horror. Like, that is I watched Zombie Island the other day. I'm like, this is a fucking horror movie. It's fantastic one, but you know, and that's one, you know, you put it on. Everyone loves Scooby-Doo, and they have that comedy balance to it, but yeah, it's a good litmus test.

SPEAKER_00 37:18

Ooh, I'm thinking about the hex girls do. Okay, here's my recommendation for you all, folks. I want you to start with Scooby-Doo, whichever cartoon you want. Then I want you to progress into Scooby-Doo and Zombie Island, then progress into Scooby-Doo the live-action films, then progress into I know what you did last summer, and then progress into Scream 2 with Sarah Michelle Geller, and then progress into one of the newer scream movies, etc. You know what I mean? Like just take it in almost six degrees of Kevin Bacon, but Scooby-Doo, and then wind up at the hardest fucking horror movie that you can possibly latch on to. Not that scream is, but like keep it escalating from there.

SPEAKER_01 38:00

Yeah, a hundred percent. And I mean, I don't think any of us realized, but we were already being introduced to the slasher calculus. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 38:07

We were really introduced.

SPEAKER_01 38:08

You got the pretty girl, you got the stoner, you got the the leader of the pack, you got the smart girl, the final girl almost, even though obviously Scooby-Doo, no one's ever really dying, but you were already introduced to those tropes. I mean, there is a pipeline from Scooby-Doo to the cabin in the woods.

SPEAKER_00 38:24

Oh god, this is its own blog post journal.

SPEAKER_01 38:28

I was gonna say we could go down this rabbit hole, but and then of course, from there, Cabin in the woods. That's one horror novice husband. First time I watched it, he called it from the beginning.

SPEAKER_00 38:39

I love that.

SPEAKER_01 38:40

He was like, Oh, these are oh, it's fake. It's this, it's that. And I'm like, Don't they introduce you to that though? The fact that it's fake pretty early. Kind of. I mean, they try to make it coy of like this is happening and this is also happening. Like, I literally, like, I'm pretty sure it was when Bradley Whitford and Richard Dreyfus like get on the golf carts and are driving around. Like, I don't even know if we'd met the people, like, oh, so it's all fake. Like, oh, it's all crafted. And I'm just like, what? Like, so the calculus is there, but then yeah, you get the Scooby Gang. How many times do we see a Scooby gang in Evil Dead and in Friday the 13th, you know? So we're already introduced and laying that groundwork for for anything.

SPEAKER_00 39:22

We were indoctrinated at a young age show. We were God blessing to be indoctrinated by though.

SPEAKER_01 39:30

I mean, it was so great. It was such a pivotal moment. And it was funny because it was from the 60s. I didn't realize that until I was in like middle school. I'm like, oh, this wasn't just coming on every week in the 90s. Like, oh no, this was like from the 1960s that was still, you know, still forming minds of children all over the world today and making them love horror.

SPEAKER_00 39:48

Oh gosh. So great. Incredible. So great. We owe Scooby-Doo a debt of gratitude on this podcast. And while I absolutely think we need to continue the Scooby-Doo love and perhaps do the Scooby-Doo to insane horror movie pipeline, I also want to draw back, Chell, you wrote an incredible piece last year at a spooky season all about how to trade in your scaredy cat. And I think you provide an excellent starter guide there.

SPEAKER_01 40:18

Yeah. It was actually one of my first blogs last year that I wrote for the for the spooky season and for Hacker Slash. And yeah, again, very much inspired by the work I had done with my own resident scaredy cat to at least make him comfortable with watching horror movies every now and then in the house or, you know, going on a date night to the theater. So yeah, that blog is still up. It is called How to Train Your Scaredy Cat 101. So very much an inspo for this for this bonus episode, but definitely go there. Check in. There's a lot more info and suggestions for you to pull from. And hopefully that sparks it in your own life of who are the scaredy cats in your life? How do you identify them? And how can you bring them into the fold and make them feel welcome and part of this community?

SPEAKER_00 41:00

Absolutely. And speaking of that community, listen, with these tips and tricks, you're gonna be able to convert your non-horror friends in no time. We're confident in that. And then when you successfully do that, please bring them around. Enroll them in Hackerslash University, bring them into the Discord, have them follow our socials. We wanna meet them and we want to hear what their pipeline was to that conversion. There's always more room for our fellow uh scaredy cats here at Hackerslash University and in our family.

SPEAKER_01 41:30

Yes, and that is the best part about Hacker Slash because there is such a wide breadth. We, you know, we all have the flavors of fear we fancy most. We introduce that at the beginning of every episode. And we, yeah, we want you to come in. We want, you know, even our seasoned horror fans, we were all scared cats at some point. I don't care if you were three years old or 33 years old, there was a starting point for you. And we'd love to hear, you know, about the scaredy cats in your life, current or reformed, and where you started. What started it all for you? What made you turn towards the horror dark side or light side if you'd like to think of it that way?

SPEAKER_00 42:07

Oh, yeah, we're looking forward to your reports. That is your homework. The assignments are due by the end of spooky season, but for now, class is dismissed.