347: Beetlejuice Beetlejuice (2024)

SPEAKER_04 0:04

I will be right here waiting for you. Spooky season greetings and salutations and welcome to Hacker Slash. If you're joining us again, welcome back. Enter if you dare. If this is your first time listening, welcome to the party. We are a horror movie review podcast dedicated to telling you whether a movie is a hack, a total joke, a waste of time, or a slash.

SPEAKER_02 0:32

Totally killer, pun intended.

SPEAKER_04 0:34

We believe horror is for everyone, and as such, we're rating these movies with the perspective we gain from our varying walks of life and the flavors of fear we fancy most. My name is Chris, I'm your friendly neighborhood slasher enthusiast. This week I'm joined by the Superfly Space Guy Mac.

SPEAKER_02 0:48

Recognize this puss.

SPEAKER_04 0:49

And the classic horror connoisseur, Sean.

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He flew halfway around the world to watch birds do it on the beach.

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This week we're back in theaters to see the newly released sequel to an iconic 1988 film.

SPEAKER_02 1:02

And if you're a patron or Apple Podcast subscriber, you'll also get to hear our B side at the end of this episode where we talk about all the dumb stuff we can get into in the afterlife.

SPEAKER_04 1:12

Before we break into that very afterlife, though, we have some follow-up on our spooky season.

SPEAKER_01 1:17

Let's follow up on a season. The pumpkin spice season is upon us. That means more of you are searching the ear candy world for something to scratch that horror itch. If you're not aware, we go hard in the pain each spooky season. As this very episode hits the internet airwaves, we are kicking off our 2024 spooky season and our fourth annual New Blood Drive.

SPEAKER_04 1:36

Yeah, now the New Blood Drive is a celebration of horror, our podcast anniversary, and the expansion of our community. I personally love it. We've done it every year. This year we're actually going to be doubling up on our episodes in October to bring you content twice a week. And then we're also celebrating our birthday with a couple gifts to you.

SPEAKER_02 1:55

Yeah, absolutely. If you've been on the fence about becoming a member of our Patreon, why not test drive one of our best perks? After every episode, our members are treated to a bonus segment known as the B-Sides, which I mentioned earlier. And the best part about it is they are free during the spooky season.

SPEAKER_04 2:14

Now that's September 1st to October 31st.

SPEAKER_02 2:18

Absolutely. B-sides are for things besides the point: pre-game chats, bloopers, tangents that really take things off the rails. Experience how the other half lives with our free sides, we're calling it, on every episode this spooky season.

SPEAKER_01 2:33

If you're a new member who signs up for our premium Patreon tier between September 1st and October 31st, and you stick around, you'll get your very own print of our seventh anniversary poster.

SPEAKER_04 2:44

I can't wait for you all to see what we have up our sleeves this year. Last year was a final destination theme since we were traveling. We were all going to Orlando for our first live show. This year's poster is pretty choice.

SPEAKER_01 2:57

I can't wait to see. As we were getting ready to dive into the world of the recently deceased, we wanted to know what you all thought about the Total Classic, that is the one, the only, the singular Beetlejuice from only a couple years back, 1988. It's not that long ago. But not older than me. So the results of our poll, thankfully, didn't surprise me, and I doubt they'll surprise 94% of you, because that's how many of you, kind listeners, gave it a slash, and only 2% hacked it.

SPEAKER_04 3:25

Can't believe there's even hack energy on this.

SPEAKER_02 3:28

Yeah, there's no hack energy. Come on, guys.

SPEAKER_01 3:32

I want to know what the undisclosed 2%. What were they doing? You know, pick a side.

SPEAKER_04 3:36

Abstaining from the vote, which is really problematic. We need your voices. Get to the polls.

SPEAKER_01 3:41

Now a couple of our listeners shared some comments. Martin says the OG movie has some of the funniest scenes in cinema.

SPEAKER_04 3:47

You know, I remember it being funny, but I I hmm in cinema overall.

SPEAKER_02 3:52

Yeah, funniest moment in cinema for sure is a lot to say, but some iconic moments for sure.

SPEAKER_01 3:59

With some iconic people involved. Tom Kimball says Catherine O'Hara is stellar. The fact she was 34 filming this is wild. What a true icon.

SPEAKER_04 4:08

It's never too late. I'm 34 right now.

SPEAKER_01 4:10

Absolutely. We love Catherine O'Hara.

SPEAKER_04 4:12

Why am I not dealing a decent it up?

SPEAKER_01 4:14

You should be, honestly. We've also got Beetlejuice. Now, Strange and Unusual X says Betelgeuse is part of my identity and holds a special place in my heart. I resonate with that.

SPEAKER_04 4:25

Yeah. I feel like this might be Binks' burner account. Just kidding. They're not the same person, but they might as well be spiritually.

SPEAKER_01 4:33

Now, this whole thing, we've got mad Tim Burton energy, and uh J Vol says, A favorite since I was a kid, so much wonderful creativity, and had Tim Burton at the top of his game. All right, and and last up here, we've got Chrissy Pooh saying it's a really good movie, more on the comedy side, but still has good horror elements.

SPEAKER_04 4:49

This is really fun for the whole family, horror.

SPEAKER_02 4:52

Absolutely, yeah. It's definitely something that everyone can have fun with, I feel like.

SPEAKER_01 4:56

I agree. I think as an adult, you can watch it, you have a good time. As a little kid, you might be like, oh my gosh, that thing is so creepy, but everyone else doesn't seem affected, so I gotta push through. I'll be okay. All right, now let's take a minute to shout out some brand new members of the Hackerslash family. We got some new patrons here. Christopher, Meet, Jordan, Eli, and Melissa. Hi, hello, hiya Dern. It's good to have you, you know, just in time for the spooky season.

SPEAKER_02 5:20

Heck yeah, welcome to the family. Enjoy the fun. And that's our follow-up.

SPEAKER_04 5:25

Well, speaking of fun, after more than a decade of anticipation and endless rumors, we're finally back for a sequel in Winter River. This time it's three generations of the Deeds family at the center of the story as they return home following a family tragedy. Despite the passage of time, Lydia can't seem to escape the chaos that's been lingering in her life ever since the events of the first film. But now it's her teenage daughter, Astrid, who unwittingly stirs things up when she accidentally opens a portal to the afterlife. This film has been years in the making with Tim Burton agreeing to direct only after Michael Keaton confirmed his return as the title character. The project saw several delays, rewrites, and even moments where it seemed like the sequel might never happen. The day has finally come, here we are. And with returning faces in Winona Ryder and Catherine O'Hara and even newcomers like Jenna Ortega, the stage was set for a long-awaited return. But does the end product live up to the reputation of its predecessor? Time will tell, folks, so buckle up and enjoy the ride because this week we're talking about Beetlejuice Beetlejuice. What were you both expecting going into this?

SPEAKER_01 6:34

I had two minds about this. At its worst, I was fearing this would be something close to Fuller House. So cheesy and so out of time, it just doesn't match. But deep inside, I was hopeful we'd get something as decent as the Scream Requels of recent years.

SPEAKER_02 6:50

That's a good thought process. I think you almost have to have high expectations going into this movie. The first Beetlejuice is so iconic, it's a bona fide classic that I watch every year. Going into this one, I'm expecting some of that same Beetlejuice charm, the raunchy dialogue that only Michael Keaton as Beetlejuice can really bring. But I'm also wondering where they are going to go with this story, knowing that we don't have every single character back from the first one.

SPEAKER_04 7:20

Going into this one, knowing how important this was to Michael Keaton, Tim Burton, Winona Ryder, and Catherine O'Hara, there are all the makings of a promising project. But there could still be several missteps along the way. And that's what alarmed me and concerned me. Obviously, I have a deep appreciation for Beetlejuice. It's an iconic film from so many of our childhoods. I kind of see this with Binks last night, and when I tell you she was crying by the end of it, it was such a magical experience with her. But Beetlejuice has actually become more endearing to me over the last few months. So going into this, I walked in without I think the burden of the love that I have for Halloween, but the pure simple childhood adoration for it kept me from thinking, okay, is this gonna absolutely crash and burn? I was optimistic every step of the way. And honestly, I think that optimism was rewarded because sitting down in this theater, I felt so much joy, so much amusement, and honestly, like this warm hug of nostalgia. But I had a smile from ear to ear, and there are moments where my my mouth could have a break and the muscles in my face could break from smiling, but it never turned around from that energy.

SPEAKER_01 8:40

Oh my gosh. Sitting there in a theater, when we hear that title music open up, it was like being a kid at Christmas. It really was. It's not the original movie, of course, but it felt like an updated dive into the original movie's universe. It reminded me a lot of the 1989 cartoon. The feeling there, it was like this is in the universe. This feels lived in. It feels like the Beetlejuice world. And it felt like that with live action and with a bigger budget. It was quirky, it was silly, and it was so much fun to watch.

SPEAKER_02 9:12

Yeah, I think that was the best way to describe it. The quirky, fun, silly. I had just a good time watching this movie. They brought just enough of the nostalgic vibes back from the original Beetlejuice, keeping that universe strong and alive. It was just such a fun watch. I I definitely kept some of that same quirky and dark comedic value that we love from the first one as well. And that's where I was hoping that we weren't gonna lose that because there's moments in the first one that has some jokes that obviously we're not gonna tie in today's cinema, we'll call it, right? Like it's just a different time, a different era, a different generation, but they still were able to give that same feeling in those specific types of jokes.

SPEAKER_04 10:00

That is an astute observation because this movie aged the way all of us have.

SPEAKER_02 10:05

Right.

SPEAKER_04 10:06

There's stuff that happens in the 80s, there's stuff that happens even the 90s, and honestly, even the early 2000s, where you look back on it and it's in poor taste. There are tones in the original Beetlejuice that it's kind of like, oh, okay, what's going on here? But the movie A doesn't take itself too seriously, and B shows that, okay, yes, it was a different time, but let's stay true to ourselves and give the same level of comedy, the same level of performance in a way that matches the temperature and the climate of today. And I think that's what's most surprising about this movie. There's so much danger that goes with making a legacy sequel or a requel of such a beloved film. And this isn't just horror fanatics. Cinema goers of any genre love Beetlejuice. This is in some ways a children's movie as well. So the stakes are even bigger. If this movie falls, it's gonna fall hard. But for it to play that evolution, that humor, I'm honestly surprised it was executed as well as it was.

SPEAKER_02 11:14

Oh, yeah, for sure. I was also actually surprised to see that this story or this plot was a little bit more complex than its predecessor. There was some layered substance here this time around, and I think it was just really cool to see. We'll talk about it a little bit later, but there's some areas that could have been flushed out a little bit more. They could have given us a little bit more, maybe go in this direction versus this direction. But the story overall just caught me by surprise because of how much stuff was actually going on and how much lore that we got in this new installment in the franchise. I was, however, disappointed in the direction with I would say just one of those plot details because I feel like I wanted more of that story as well.

SPEAKER_01 12:00

I'm I'm curious in the spoiler zone what we're gonna hear about that. But I mean, speaking, speaking about being fleshed out, these movies are 36 years apart. I know. And a lot of sequels, especially recent requels, you know, they don't seem to respect that. But this movie does respect that, both in its story and in its characters and the character dynamics. I was very pleasantly surprised that the characters and their lives for the last 36 years did seem fleshed out. It did seem like things have changed, things have grown. There are some characters who don't make it back into this movie, but with more than a mention. And there's logistical reasons for that. We can look at the cast, we don't get Alec Baldwin, we don't get Gina Davis, and there's reasons that make sense for that. One, they're ghosts, and ghosts don't age. Right. The focus here is not on them. And so it makes sense story-wise for us to really hone in and focus on some characters and create this three-generation story that we're working through. To have thought put into choices like that, both characters, their lives, and the story between everybody, I think was actually really wise.

SPEAKER_02 13:11

Yeah, it was super cool. And I love that Tim Burton went in that direction because I know he did have some kind of interview that was released where they brought up the question of not having Alec Baldwin and Gina Davis in the film. He just did not want to check a box for fan service. He wanted to make sure that it meant something for the story. I'm so glad that we didn't just go all out on just checking boxes for fan service, and we did pay attention to a good story.

SPEAKER_01 13:39

There's other reasons that you know things can happen like that. Jeffrey Jones, I think, is almost 80. And maybe he's not feeling up to it, or maybe he just doesn't want to do it. We don't know, but we don't need to know. Actors have real lives as well, and filmmakers get to make choices. I think it's really a matter of what do you do with what you do have.

SPEAKER_04 13:57

And the ability to execute on what you do have is so important. There is one small thing that struck me as a little bit odd when I was watching this movie. It is the only note of even remote criticism that I have. Ironically, it ends up being tied to one of the funniest moments in the movie. So I can't even be mad at it. You know what I mean? It was like a little bit of a what is that initial taste that's hitting my tongue, and then the flavor continues to evolve and develop, and you realize, oh, okay, now we're all friends here. This movie is not scary, but oh my gosh, I was almost roaring with laughter.

SPEAKER_01 14:37

There's some parts of it that are not quite kid friendly, both in language and in some of the graphic content. I think if you were a little kid, this might be a bit challenging. Or if you're a parent screening this for a little kid, you might think, nope, they gotta wait a couple more years before they watch it. But boy, is it big kid friendly. Dude. There's nothing about it that's scary. There's lots of humor, like you've mentioned. There is, I think, a good amount of graphicness in some of the scenes, and it's quick. But for the little, little ones, it's a little bit too much. For the rest of us, there is so much to chew on here. But there's nothing that's gonna make you shake in your boots.

SPEAKER_04 15:10

I'm so excited because I got to see this last night, obviously, with being some of our friends. I saw this with Allie tomorrow night and go see this with Allie, her son, who's like 11, and then uh another friend and her kids. So I get to actually experience Betelgeuse with kids for the first time since I was a kid, and I cannot wait to see okay, how are y'all handling this in the new generation?

SPEAKER_02 15:33

Nice. That's awesome. I do think this one is a little bit darker in some areas than its predecessor. That maybe because of the times and things we can do and show some other things that we may not have been able to do, but I do think it's a little bit darker. I would say that this is overall going to be arguably the same level of scary as far as true horror as the first Beetlejuice. There are some graphic things that may not be suitable for, you know, I don't know. I can see some small toddling tins getting scared, but this is the kind of horror, dark comedy that us horror nerds love to see. You know what I mean? It's it's not taking itself too seriously, and sometimes we need something that cuts through all the intensity that we're watching all year long. It's fun, it's weird, it's expressive, and I love it, but it's not super scary.

SPEAKER_01 16:25

You know, it's good that you kind of mention and compare it to the original movie because this movie did not need to be wholly original on its own. It just needed to deliver something worth making a sequel nearly four decades after its predecessor. And I think it delivered on that with a story that set it apart and really made it worth watching.

SPEAKER_02 16:43

I was actually really impressed with how Tim Burton was able to create this story and give us a sequel that felt like a new story with some of the same characters that we know and love from the first one. There are some of the same concepts and rules in this universe from the last one, but it also introduces some new lore and gives us a new story with more than one side story or quest going on with these characters.

SPEAKER_04 17:07

You're talking about how lived in these characters feel, how much more complete their stories feel in the world that it's set in. Wow, it it it honestly is remarkable to me to sit back and reflect. Because yes, you walk out of the theater with that feeling and that impression. But I'm also thinking about some of these other movies, like, okay, we have another trilogy that was about a group of three generations of women, and that was the Strode family. For as thorough as that story was, it was also inconsistent. Granted, that's a franchise that has so many weaving branches to connect into. But to see how even a great movie like that can be executed and have these missteps, it's incredible to me to see the direction that this story went and how natural it felt. This movie really does feel like it grew up at the same pace that the rest of us did. And I think honestly, that really ties into how great the ending was. The ending does remind me of a 1970s horror film that I saw earlier this year. If I say it now and someone obscurely fucking knows this movie, it'll ruin a lot. So I'm gonna pause that for the spoilers. But it was just absolutely riddled with good moments and good vibes. But when we get down to that ending, I was dying with laughter.

SPEAKER_02 18:30

Yeah, it was fun. This ending was hilarious. The third act as a whole was also super fun. I did want to see a bit more of another story that felt like we built up to this moment and it was a bit lackluster. But the song breakout, while not as good as the Deo scene, was still fun and made me laugh. Kudos to the entire way that they ended the film because it felt like a good way to just end a really fun time.

SPEAKER_01 18:56

It's fun, like you said. And the first one had a really fun ending too. They're different types of fun, and there's nothing wrong with that. I think it wraps things up really well in a way that also sets the stage for filmmakers to expand on the universe if they chose to in a couple of years. Maybe they don't, and that's fine, but if they decided to, it wouldn't be out of place, and they wouldn't even have to use all of the major characters. They could dive in further, and this would allow them to do that and have it make sense.

SPEAKER_04 19:25

Clearly, we've got a good thing going here, and I can't wait to see the direction that this takes in our ratings. But before we get there, Sean, we mentioned a little while ago, but how would you describe the gore score?

SPEAKER_02 19:35

Thank God this movie had the same visual look that Tim Burton created in the first one. That's just one thing that I want to point out that I feel like I would I really cherish because that's something you don't want to lose sight of. You're still gonna see those brutal deaths or like the aftermath of how these people looked after dying, but you are seeing this in a way that only Tim Burton and Beetlejuice can really show you. There are some things that would otherwise be really horrific to look at, but you add in this dark comedy to the mix and you're left with some amazing practical effects that are just really fun to look at. And while I would still say that this movie is staying in the low gore score territory, maybe medium for small children, it still has enough to please you gore lovers out there in a really fun way.

SPEAKER_04 20:23

And what about the Animal Report?

SPEAKER_01 20:25

It's not exactly safe here. You could say that there's some foul play in Beetlejuice, Beetlejuice.

SPEAKER_04 20:30

Well, let's go ahead and get into our ratings then. Beetlejuice, Beetlejuice from 2024. Was it a hack or a slash? And I actually want to kick things off because it's so simple. This movie is a sequel made with pure love, reverence, and passion that is evident in every fiber of its being from start to finish. I don't want to overhype this, so I do caution you to temper your expectations. But I will say that I didn't think a sequel could be this good. For me, it is undoubtedly, undeniably a joyful slash, and probably the most fun I've had with a technically horror film in a long time.

SPEAKER_01 21:11

Oh gosh, it is so much fun. This is perhaps not an instant classic. I don't even know if the first one was an instant classic at the time, but it is a classic. I don't know that kids are gonna rave about this and get it tattooed in them for decades, or maybe they will, who am I to know? But it's a really enjoyable sequel. I'm glad it was made. Nearly 40 years have gone by since the original, but it has such a strong place in many of our memories. You really have to nail things, not to upset some folks. But I think they hit the mark here. I think it's got the quirk, the fun, the funk, and the soul. And there's a group of folks who made this movie. It's not about them aging, it's about them growing. And like you mentioned, Chris, they grew along with us. What this movie gives the viewer is a strong follow up to a beloved classic. The sets are fantastic, the costumes are top notch, the characters are fleshed out, and it's quirktastic wibbly wobbly world is not. Missing a thing. It is an absolute slash.

SPEAKER_02 22:02

Well, Beetlejuice, Beetlejuice, Beetlejuice. This was a sequel that I never thought we would get. And I gotta tell you, I was a little worried when they announced this movie. I didn't want what happened to many other classics where they waited too long to make a sequel and only carry a glimmer of that original feeling. But thankfully, this was not the case because while this movie did not necessarily have the exact same feel as the first one, it did have enough of it, and the acting from literally everyone was fantastic. Everyone really found a way to bring their characters back to life for this movie. The way this movie looked felt just like the original, but in a slightly more modern way. The set design and the lighting off the charts. The soundtrack was on point. This is just a really good time and a really good sequel, in my opinion. This is a sequel we didn't know we needed. The juice is loose, and I'm on the Soul Train straight for the House of Deets because this one is a slash.

SPEAKER_04 23:07

Well, so far we are united in the Universal Slash, but we do have a surprise rating submitted to us from our dear lovely Binks.

SPEAKER_00 23:17

Hey listeners, I'm sad that I can't be on tonight's episode, but if you thought you were going to go on without hearing my rating for this one, then you're sorely mistaken. Last year I shared how much of an impact early Turn Burton films, specifically Beetlejuice, had on my life. So you can only imagine I went into this film with lots of hopes and prayers that it would be good. That being said, I definitely thought this film was about one thing and it entirely wasn't. And although that kind of surprise tactic can be a hit or a miss, I can reassure you that in this sequel's case, it's a hit. This film was a blast from the past in a tasteful way. The nods to the original were strategically incorporated and coded in humor that landed every single time. Michael Keaton, of course, blows his performance out of the water, and Catherine O'Hara, just as much, literally the star of the movie, I feel. Obviously, I need to bring up Winona writer, my queen, Lydia. She's not what you expected, but what we needed, because seeing her act alongside Jenna Ortega feels like millennials and Gen Z have joined forces for good and not evil. My only gripe, though, is an anticlimactic character that felt more like an origin story than someone worth seeing all film. It added another subplot to the greater story that felt distracting at times, but it built up anticipation for an ultimately disappointing conclusion. That aside, this was an emotional and mega fun roller coaster ride of a time for me. And as I surround myself with all of my Beetlejuice memorabilia, right now, I can proudly say I'm still a mega Beetlejuice fan because this sequel was for sure a slash.

SPEAKER_04 24:50

And look at that, almost as if from the afterlife herself, Binks has secured our universal slash. There's a lot more to discuss when we return from the break. If you haven't seen this movie yet and you want a refresher primer on Beetlejuice and where you last left off, there's a link in the show notes to that original episode. If you have seen this one already, please let us know what would you rate it. Join the conversation for free in our Discord server and you can find the link to that conversation in our show notes. But let's say we're fast forwarding to the future here. If you haven't seen it and it's post its theatrical run, you can check the link in our show notes to see where you can watch it streaming right now. But when we return from our break, we'll dive deep into the spoilers on territory and unpack this character that it seems we're all aligned on. Still have a segment to finish.

SPEAKER_01 25:49

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SPEAKER_02 27:11

Yeah, man, we have a surprisingly high kill count for a Beetlejuice film, and I'm not even counting all the dead folks that we see in the afterlife. There are 11 kills or deaths in this movie, and despite the generous amount of soul sucking, we do also get some pretty gnarly ones as well. So I gotta know which kills juiced you up.

SPEAKER_01 27:34

Delia. Delia Deeds. Just one of the best deaths of this film because of the comedic timing of it all. Now they they really nailed some comedy here, and this one was so quick. Her facial reaction, she's a such a great actress. I love her so much. And this was so perfect because she sets the stage for it early. She says, No, they've been definged, it's not gonna hurt anybody, whatever. And when we get to that moment where she takes them, I thought she was just gonna look at them. When she takes them out, you're like, oh dude, it's game over. Like, this is not gonna go well for anybody here. You just knew. Come on, don't handle them like that. You know, you're asking for trouble. And they come up. The lightning fast response that she has from the strike of those asps was fantastic. It was like, oh gosh, of course. Just nailed it. It was so satisfying uh because it was like closing a loop, and immediately she's down there, and she already recognizes that she's there, she knows what's up and is so not here for it. And everything about it, just her performance all the way through, was perfect.

SPEAKER_04 28:34

Oh my gosh, absolutely incredible stuff. And really, Delia Dietz as a character went from zero to hero for me from the first movie to this one. I absolutely loved her performance. I'm gonna shift for my favorite kill over to Charles Dietz because this is the moment where I was a little like and then ultimately fucking died laughing because the claymation was a little odd for me. It was such a harsh introduction to that moment. We get to see this honestly, you can't mistake him. It's so recognizable, even in this animated form. But to see him with the plane crashing, and then you have the voice over Adelia explaining it wasn't even the plane crash I did it, he survived, but then got the shark. Oh my gosh. What I loved was then Charles' body meandering through this whole fucking movie, first saying he's lightheaded. Charles was way better in this movie because I didn't have to fucking look at him. He was just a perfect set piece for the rest of the cast.

SPEAKER_02 29:41

It was really too good, and that claymation segment they did was I think really just tasteful. Like it was just a really fun way to depict what happened without having the need to have this actor in the movie. And it also felt very celebrity deathmatch. That's immediately what I go to when I saw that segment.

SPEAKER_04 30:01

So celebrity deathmatch was such a big moment in my childhood, and in retrospect, I can definitely appreciate it. I think it was just how sudden and out of nowhere it felt. But then the more we get it, the more that Charles is struggling with the plane crash and then washing up, then actually getting eaten. It just got funnier and funnier and funnier, but largely because Delia Dietz and Lydia Dietz were just going back and forth the whole fucking time.

SPEAKER_01 30:35

Yeah. That comedic back and forth was so perfect because it draws it out without having to draw it out, you know, and it's like, oh, that's how we do it. Oh, so the plane crash, oh my gosh. And she's like, no, he survived the crash and then climbed aboard a thing. Oh, so he drowned. No, and it's like, oh, keep going. This was like such a brilliant moment for Catherine O'Hara.

SPEAKER_02 30:55

Gotta say, there were some darker moments in the film. And when we talk about Jeremy's parents, you know what I mean? Like that was a darker element that I think was handled well. Like it wasn't so over the top that it was like unsuitable for, you know, if you bring your to the theater with you to watch this movie, but it was one of the darker undertones of this movie when you think of the reveal in the plot of what Jeremy was all about. And I gotta say, Ari called it from the very beginning. As soon as they met in the tree house, she was like, This dude's a fucking ghost. This dude's dead.

SPEAKER_04 31:30

I caught it this the second we see him for the second time, because he he didn't change clothes.

SPEAKER_02 31:34

Right, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 31:35

So when he didn't change clothes, I was like, Oh, look at this, and then he did go in the house, and I'm like, his parents are gray as fuck.

SPEAKER_02 31:41

Right, it was weird, and they don't see their faces at first, which I thought was okay. Now I I'm with you. Now I'm telling Ari in the theater, I'm like, okay, I'm I'm tracking now. Like, I get what you're saying. And when we do get the reveal where they do show their faces, and Jeremy's dad had like what the power saw type thing that was stuck into his head, and his mom turns or comes around the corner down the hall, and you see that I don't even know what that was, some type of kitchen utensil to the eye. That was gnarly, absolute gnarly.

SPEAKER_04 32:10

But that's the brutality that I think we needed from the first Beetlejuice movie.

SPEAKER_02 32:15

Yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_04 32:17

We have a couple deaths for our main characters in that movie that happen largely off screen because it's a car accident, and then they wake up in the afterlife. And obviously, you have in that original movie a lot of these characters who have really gnarly deaths that you don't see. You only see the aftermath of. I think even that darker tone, I hate to say it, but I think it's also more reflective of the day that we're in now. I think we've been desensitized as a population because of how much war we've seen. Honestly, like a lack of humanity we've seen in so many commonplace things and and areas and spaces. So I think even that darker tone is a way of this movie saying, Yeah, this is what horror was in 1988 for the whole family, but this is what it probably looks like now.

SPEAKER_02 33:04

That's a really good point. I do want to also point out before we move on from any type of talks about kills, is Richard, because even though we don't see the kill, we didn't really know what happened to him until maybe we saw him in the afterlife, and he's just covered in like piranhas that are hanging off of him. But it's really, it wasn't even the kill that I think really was great. I think it was just the way he looked and in the scenes, just the sound effects. It was just hilarious because you keep hearing these squiggly fucking fish hanging off of him the whole time. And I love that they kept that in there because it it wasn't even that it was distracting, it was just enough to be super funny as like there was a serious conversations in a sense happening, but you're just hearing the little little fish flopping around off of him.

SPEAKER_04 33:53

It's an added detail that is so necessary, and again, it's a no-stone left unturned approach. And I want to remind you that we've seen piranha. We reviewed the original piranha on this podcast. How are these fucking piranhas better than those fucking piranhas? That's the real question.

SPEAKER_02 34:11

That is the real question.

SPEAKER_04 34:12

Yeah, but I do think that the practical effects there also I love that the piranhas are also alive in the afterlife.

SPEAKER_03 34:22

Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_04 34:23

But the fact that we get these little floppy bits, it really is this nice underscore of all the serious tones of this movie. We have a daughter who's reeling in the loss of her father, and they're able to have these beautiful, heartwarming moments as a family, but it doesn't get too sad because this dude has fucking piranhas hanging off his face.

SPEAKER_02 34:46

It's so true. And I know we can wait until we jump into like talking about really breaking down these characters later on, but I do just have to point it out right now that Dolores' death was the most lackluster death that I could ever fucking imagine. Like, if you're gonna put an entire plot point, a backstory, an origin story, and really bring this character of Dolores and Betelgeuse, and this is like how he died, and this is like what he did to her and this whole thing, and she's out for revenge, and this whole movie is building up to her trying to find Beetlejuice. Man, you gotta find a different way to end that because it just seemed so sudden and almost like I don't want to say unreal, because obviously this movie is unreal, but it just didn't feel right.

SPEAKER_04 35:33

Yeah, it wasn't climactic in any way, and I think that's where I'm a little disappointed as well. That was going to be my worst part of the movie, but I think if that is the worst part of this movie, it's got a lot of great stuff going for it. It did kill me that Dolores is like this Morticia Adams adjacent figure who seems so menacing. How do you kill what's already dead?

SPEAKER_03 35:58

Right.

SPEAKER_04 35:58

The fact that there's so much power and she just goes out with his douchebag Rory. Like, I'm okay with them being suddenly dispatched, but I think I needed more of an event because she walks into the church and then nothing really happens.

SPEAKER_01 36:14

Yeah, we need a showdown. That is a good point. And you know, that scene was a tougher one for me. I think that's what made kind of the end not quite as fun as the original for me, but I think what made this movie either as fun or more fun than the original was the glorious set that we got and the costumes. Just both of those things were so nailed here that we lived in Beetlejuice's universe. The afterlife as a vibe here, if you will, was amazing. Literally, one of the first scenes we get there shows us the wibbly wobbly door frames and the hallway, and everything's askew. And it was so perfect, let alone the fact that we get a nice little cameo in blue face paint. That was hilariously fun as well. But everything about that just like puts you there. And I think it was done so well because it could have been done so cheaply with excessive CGI, and everything could have felt super fake and flash through. This was like, I actually want more time in that space. And I think it's almost deliberate that we get more time there later, that we spend a lot of the movie there.

SPEAKER_04 37:20

Yeah, and oh my gosh, the set design, the props in this film, the practical effects in this film, all of them are stellar. There are moments where I'm like, uh, why do I want to be there?

SPEAKER_02 37:32

Right, right.

SPEAKER_04 37:33

It shouldn't be fun. I shouldn't want to be in the afterlife, right? But I want to break into the afterlife. Give me some fucking chalk, I'll draw my own portal and knock three times. Every other detail here, right? We have a lot of Delia's art pieces that come from the original film into this one. We have the iconic house itself, but one small one in this, you know, I'm thinking back to Macy Your Favorite Kill being Delia. I'm sorry, a glass headstone shaped like a fucking shark fin with his photo. Amazing.

SPEAKER_02 38:06

It's so good.

SPEAKER_04 38:08

Every ounce of this movie just felt so good.

SPEAKER_02 38:12

It was so good. Delia can definitely make my gravestone someday, you know. I want to know what that would be. If it's gonna pertain to how I die, I don't know, but I know that I want her to make it. Absolutely. I think, man, the set design is absolutely fantastic to watch. I think the soundtrack is a vibe in and of itself. Very well-placed songs. I think I just really loved listening to the movie. I gotta say, my favorite thing about this movie is gotta be their use of practical effects, and thank god they stayed true to the spirit of the first film for this one because there were some really great shots with some really great practical effects. I'm such a big fan of practical practical effects, as you know. I talk about it all the time when we get a movie that really does it right and uses practical effects and doesn't solely rely on CGI. It's just so great because the work that goes into making this shit come to life is just so awesome. I also loved how we get to see even more characters in the afterlife because it was just fun to see how everyone died and what they looked like and things like that. So, definitely my favorite part: practical effects. I will say you were mentioning a couple of things, Chris, and a lot of them are Easter eggs, and there's so many Easter eggs that are riddled throughout this movie that you just can't not have a good time if you're a Beetlejuice fan. You know, you have like the the opening segment opening in a very similar way to how the original did with the kind of the model town segment. You get to see the covered bridge there. You mentioned the statues, Delia's statues that kind of appear, the Deo song at the funeral. There's just things that happen in the story that are are really directly tied to the original. You've got Lydia being bullied into another wedding somehow. Miss Shannon's school for girls, the Beetlejuice Flyer. There's so many fun things, and I love that they brought back the original wedding attire. You gotta shout that out.

SPEAKER_04 40:17

You know, Sean, you mentioned the whole fun aspect of it. I actually want to give a shout out to my favorite scene in the movie because oh my god, was it hilarious? Couples therapy. Beetlejuice as a therapist, a mental health practitioner saying he's willing to do the work. But not only do we have him meeting Rory for the first time, Rory being shocked and dropped into the reality of this situation, Lydia having her mouth sewn shut and just absolutely pushed to the edge. But beetle fetus?

SPEAKER_05 40:51

Fetus juice? Fetus juice. I don't know what we would call it. Not the fetus juice.

SPEAKER_04 40:58

But oh my gosh, this thing expelling from her body and then getting kicked.

SPEAKER_02 41:04

Or punting those babies across the room.

SPEAKER_04 41:07

That baby got punted, like everybody says they would punt chunky if presented the opportunity.

SPEAKER_03 41:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 41:13

But holy shit, it was like dead alive, it's alive. There's a 1974 horror movie called It's Alive, and it's about genuinely uh a husband and his wife are at the hospital, he's in the waiting room while she's in delivery, yeah, something's going wrong, a doctor comes out dead. When he goes in there, this demonic baby thing that was born has killed everybody and then escaped through the sky. Like it's like this this baby is a fucking killer. That's what that shit reminded me of, and it was hysterical.

SPEAKER_01 41:45

Gosh, that was my favorite scene as well. There is so much to like here. This, I think, was the first time, though, that Michael Keaton delivered the truest Beetlejuice voice of this movie. He he does, of course, his voice well throughout the film, but there's something about the way he speaks there that's like guttural and got a little bit of Keaton Twang going on that really feels like the original Beetlejuice is back and like he hasn't aged a single day since. And it was perfect. The guts being so graphic was amazing. Yeah, that was such a nice touch. Like that was explosive and unexpected, and there was just so much that catches you off guard there. His timing when he's delivering his lines is amazing. Everything about it was like this is a forgotten scene from the first film. This is not brand new. This is something that's from a classic movie that we all love. That's how they delivered it. It was fantastic.

SPEAKER_04 42:39

I'm sorry, I also got a shout out to that fucking musical number at the end.

SPEAKER_01 42:43

Yeah. It was great.

SPEAKER_04 42:45

Incredible. We need Michael Keaton as Beetlejuice on Lip Sync Battle.

SPEAKER_01 42:50

Ooh, oh my gosh, somebody please. Put it on whatever streaming service you need to, and and we'll subscribe for a month to see it. That was a fun scene. Good one. It felt felt a little felt a little fake when we get to the stapling, but even that was enjoyable. But I think just the interaction, the interaction between her and what an amazing person to pick to be opposite her in that scene. Talk about comedy chops going on with Danny there.

SPEAKER_02 43:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 43:17

So much fun. And like the music going full blast when the headphones come off, or whatever was going on in that scene. I don't know. But then like you hear that the music is still coming out of a little speaker at the end there, and he's still a grouch.

SPEAKER_02 43:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 43:30

Oh, dude, everything about that scene was like, Yeah, this is the way to start off this movie right here. I don't even know who she is, but I'm here for it. I like her already. Which was unfortunate later when it was kind of you know a fizzle in the end. Right. But that really I think showed us like this film was not playing around with how much fun you're gonna have and how it's going to pay attention to every tiny little speck of detail.

SPEAKER_02 43:52

Yeah. Well, you know, she's Tim Burton's new love interest, so there's that.

SPEAKER_04 43:58

But Okay, Sherry Moon Zombie S.

SPEAKER_02 44:00

I think the the stapling, despite how ridiculous it may be, I loved that it was happening because it just looks great. And you're not sewing yourself back together, you're just staple gunning yourself back together, which is hilarious. It's absolutely hilarious. And my favorite scene, I'm sure if you know me, you probably can pick it out. But I do have a couple of scenes that I want to highlight that we haven't talked about before I get into that. And the early scene we get in the beginning of the movie, the ghost hunter scene in the beginning with Lydia in the ghost house situation with the night vision filter on and this all this crazy shit going on. And the next thing you know, this little dog is on the fan blade somehow. I mean, it was just so fun. I was like, this is how we're starting. I'm in for it. Let's do this. Let's absolutely do this. And I also really liked this reference where Jeremy and Astrid are in his bedroom up in the attic, which that bedroom was fucking awesome, by the way. Like, that is so good. If I can eventually get a house with a nice little attic and make a little office up there, that's some life goals right there. I hope it happens. But there's that moment where they start floating, and I'm like, well, this is fucking Casper right here. It is. This is Casper.

SPEAKER_05 45:17

Killer Casper. Can I keep your soul?

SPEAKER_02 45:20

You're right. It was great. But my favorite scene is the scene where they cut into the backstory of Beetlejuice and Dolores and really go back to the beginning because I just love that they made it this classic horror feel. It's got this black and white vibe to it. It does feel like something that you would watch in the 30s or the 40s. And I fucking ate that shit up. Even Ari called it. She was like, I know you're fucking loving this scene right now. And I did. I loved that scene. I love that they threw that in there. It was so cool.

SPEAKER_04 45:56

Also lore accurate because he survived the Black Plague.

SPEAKER_02 45:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 46:00

Absolutely. It reminded me of some of the standout moments for movies like Inglorious Bastards, where somebody's telling a story, and that story itself could launch and be its own thing. Right. And I think you're so right that they did it period accurate. But that movie, when he starts lip syncing Italian, I was like, what is about to happen? And then we flash back and start the story. I was like, honestly, I'm here for a movie about this. Right. That's how well they did it.

SPEAKER_02 46:26

Yeah. It was great. I loved it. Mac, you mentioned the exchange between Dolores and the janitor, who is Danny DeVito in his little cameo. And I think Danny DeVito's small little segment was so fun and also kind of a reference to Tim Burton's Batman Returns, where he's Penguin, because he's chugging this cleanser in this movie, and he's got this nasty gooey shit dripping out of his mouth. And it just brought me back to Danny DeVito as Penguin in Batman Returns as he's got that bluish-black goo just constantly dripping from his mouth.

SPEAKER_04 47:00

I had the same feeling, and oh, was it glorious.

SPEAKER_02 47:04

Right?

SPEAKER_04 47:05

It just makes me remember how badly I wanted to see Michael Keaton as Batman again, and I'm so depressed that we're not gonna get the product of that film being made.

SPEAKER_02 47:15

It's so tough.

SPEAKER_01 47:16

It's tragic, and there's something about the combination of the three of them working together that is kind of unprecedented and has not been repeated since, and makes me think, oh, DC is struggling. You know, what how do we make our movies with our extended universe and then our regular universe? And let's choose some no, go back to the basics. Somebody already nailed it. Take Batman and just put it in the theater again. You fix DC right there. You don't need to do anything else except let them share that magic they created. Even if they were a little bit different from like a comic, that's okay because the actor is contributing such a major portion of what that character is gonna be for people's brains for decades. And I think the same thing happens here. I think you have people in small bits that are able to really achieve visceral characters. And Danny DeVito is one of them. You know, Michael Keaton, of course, is another one. Easily any other actor could have come back almost 40 years later and been like, all right, I'm gonna do this character I did 40 years ago, and I really enjoyed it. And you would get like this lackluster thing, and you'd be like, Okay, I get it. They had fun, they missed it. No. He was like, I know what I did in the first one, I'm gonna do that, but I'm gonna take it up a notch. Beetlejuice just got richer. Yeah. Not in money, but in value. Like it just that it's just so much here that makes you enjoy every moment you get on screen with him because honestly, you don't get a ton on screen in the first movie.

SPEAKER_02 48:39

Right, right. Which I'm glad we got more Beetlejuice in this one. So that thank you. Thank you for that. And I know he loved this role, so I didn't really have any doubts that Michael Keaton was gonna show up for this. I I know that Tim Burton was not gonna do this movie without Hinna, and I'm so glad that they made it happen. But yes, he brought that character back. It was great, it was almost better than before. I feel like Michael Keaton as Beetlejuice in this one really was the ghost with the most.

SPEAKER_04 49:12

He absolutely was, and that's where I think we really shined with comedy being punched into every moment of this movie. Everybody gives such a great performance, but if Michael Keaton misses, anything Winona Ryder would do would just be falling flat because these characters need each other to play off of. But Michael Keaton's delivery is Beetlejuice, it felt like he didn't age a day. Right? And that is insane to me. While Catherine O'Hara, on the other hand, is someone who, you know, I d haven't seen Shits Creek, but I know that everyone's obsessed with her.

SPEAKER_03 49:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 49:47

But for her to emerge and continue to grow with her talents over the course of her life, and for us to have Delia Deets, but also Catherine O'Hara as who she is today, Michael Keaton is making a more refined Beetlejuice, but he's still giving us 1988 Beetlejuice. But this Delia Deets is a new version of Delia, and I was obsessed with the dynamic between her and Lydia, and her holding over Lydia karma and karmic balance for the way that Lydia treated her. That was incredible.

SPEAKER_05 50:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 50:22

But also the looks. Oh my gosh, there was this moment where she says, Are you calling off the wedding? turns around and gives such a like pleased with herself grin to Astrid.

SPEAKER_05 50:32

That's so good.

SPEAKER_04 50:33

Incredible! She was the shining star of this movie for me, and I feel like she stole every scene she was in. Yeah. And again, it wasn't a Catherine O'Hara thing, but it was just a Delia Deeds thing.

SPEAKER_02 50:43

Yeah. Yeah, that's interesting. I think Catherine O'Hara really pulled from Delia to make Moira in Shits Creek. I really do think it's like Moira, like Moira is Delia like on crack. Like that's how I feel. But I also feel like it also added to what she could bring in this movie because now she's got both of these iconic characters that you can almost intertwine and make one super character. And I think that's it. You could see both of those characters shining through in this one. And I thought it was really great to those expressions, to those reactions, to those lines that she had.

SPEAKER_01 51:19

There's an energy to her in everything that she does. Home alone is something that we all forget that she was a major part of. And like you watch that, and you're like, she plays such a very different mom from Beetlejuice. She plays such a different mom in Shits Creek. And here it's like evolution. There really is growth throughout the years where I think they're letting her shine through more in all of her roles. And when you have a great actor, that's what you have to do. You have to let them be themselves and morph that character into what the character should be, not just what you imagine that they could be. That first one, yeah, you'll love to hate her. That's the point. She's supposed to annoy you. She's the evil stepmother or whatever, right? But in this one, it's like you can be a contemptible character that's also human being. And that's what you get here is yeah, there's character traits there that like could annoy the crap out of you, but in reality, it's still a human being. And on screen here, not annoying at all for me in this film.

SPEAKER_04 52:20

Oh, okay. We just talked about the human being of it all, and I'm sure there's so much more to say about Delia. But I also have to say, maybe this is just like a weird thing. RIP to Bob. I felt so sad when Bob died.

SPEAKER_02 52:33

Bob, he didn't need to die. Come on. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 52:36

No, his soul got sucked way too hard, bro.

SPEAKER_02 52:40

Dude, sucked way too hard. Saddest moment of the film by far.

SPEAKER_04 52:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 52:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 52:45

Astrid seeing her dead dad in the afterlife, psh, move over.

SPEAKER_02 52:49

Absolutely heartbreaking. We were both reacting in the theater. The fear that they were able to show.

SPEAKER_01 52:54

No, no. It's crazy that, like, that's a fake head with a fake face, but when those emotions are coming through, you're just like, oh, poor Bob. He's he's out here doing his best. I know. He really is. He's really trying to be the supervisor of the year. And in reality, you know, he was just cannon fodder.

SPEAKER_04 53:14

Yeah. He tried. Okay. But him having to stand against all the other workers at the call center before they make their escape, and then hiding under the desk cowering from Dolores, only to get got by her at the end.

SPEAKER_02 53:28

I do want to know what your all thoughts are on Jenna Ortega as Astrid in this movie, because I know that some people feel like we're getting way overexposed to her these days, but I think, in my opinion, she's been perfectly casted in many of her roles, including this one. The chemistry between her and Lydia in this film, I think was really great. I think even Tim Burton said that Jenna Ortega had this quality about her that really reminded him of Winona Ryder, which was probably why he wanted to cast her for the role. And I just think it was a perfect casting choice.

SPEAKER_04 54:00

I also agree. I mean, she was perfectly placed in this movie. During that dance break, it felt like we had moments that call back to her dancing in the Wednesday TV series. But listen, she's a spooky girl, and I'm here to embrace it with open arms. I thought she was great in the role. I thought she's someone who obviously we see her as Jenna Ortega, but we see her as Wednesday. We've seen her as this younger sister in Scream. We have seen her in X. She doesn't stick out in such a way where I have a hard time believing the character she is.

SPEAKER_02 54:35

Right.

SPEAKER_04 54:36

And that to me shows that her casting is not a stretch. It's Jenna Ortega a role effectively.

SPEAKER_01 54:42

I I love what they did here though, because they used Lydia Dietz in a smart way. And it was almost commentary on like a rise into stardom from being a young person all the way through to adulthood and seeing what happens when you reach your 30s, 40s, and 50s. And they did it in such a realistic way as well, because one, you know, she was just somebody who experienced what she experienced, and now suddenly it's become a career, but then that career has to go somewhere. Is it gonna get washed out? Is it gonna make you a has been? But here she's actually still relevant, but in reality, her own daughter won't even believe her. And she's got this kind of like manic mom feel, which we get in Stranger Things as well. The good contrast to that was having Jenna Ortega play a character who is just somebody who doesn't believe any of it.

SPEAKER_02 55:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 55:32

And doesn't like buy into it, doesn't trust her own mother, has no interest in talking to her, is so detached from everything. Being that skeptic character was a smart choice because I think it would be easy to put her into similar roles that you would give one in a writer 40 years ago. And thankfully they were like, no, no, no, no. She's a good fit for the mood, for the feeling, for the attitude, and everything, but she's got to be a different human being in this film. And contrast, Lydia Deeds, having that dynamic between them was brilliant because we had such a similar difference of character between Lydia and Delia in the first Beetlejuice. If they were both the same character, if they were both like, you know, that whole gothic thing, we'd be so bored by it. Yeah. And we'd have already seen it. We didn't need that, and we got what we needed that we didn't know we needed.

SPEAKER_04 56:19

Yeah. Jenna Ortego plays a really good skeptic.

SPEAKER_01 56:22

Definitely. Definitely. Have you seen Only Murders in the Building? We've got Selena Gomez. Her like neutral tone and flat affect is perfect for the roles that she's in. And so I'm glad when you have an actor like Jenna Ortega, you're like, okay, we can't just have her being hammy, right? That's not who she is. That's not the vibe that she gives off. She needs to be that skeptic. She needs to be like the straight man in the joke. Otherwise, you wouldn't buy into it. And here I think you do, because her responses are never over the top, except for the moments where they need to be.

SPEAKER_02 56:54

Absolutely. You know, though, William Defoe as Wolf Jackson, I think was one of the sleeper performances in the entire film. I thought he was fucking pure gold. The shit that he did, the mannerisms, the character that he brought, the little one-liners, his little handguns, all that stuff, so good. I think it was great. I did read somewhere that Christopher Walken was originally offered the role, which could have been good. It definitely could have been good. But I don't know, I don't I don't honestly know why he didn't end up doing it. But William Defoe, fantastic.

SPEAKER_04 57:28

Okay, let me tell you how I don't even really care for that man very intensely, but I fucking loved every moment he was in. He brought a level of hilarity that I think this movie in that role desperately needed because it plays into that classic cop, but also he's a total fucking joke because he's just an actor. So I loved that play. It was great. Wow.

SPEAKER_02 57:52

It was great. The little exchange that he has with Beetlejuice, where he's like, you just gotta keep it real, and Betelgeuse is like, it looks like you kept it a little too real.

SPEAKER_04 58:00

Yeah, but also, I'm sorry, he keeps calling him Mr. Juice, and it was just I was like, okay, Harley Quinn.

SPEAKER_02 58:07

Mr. J.

SPEAKER_01 58:08

Oh my. Yeah, totally, totally underrated. If we can even say that, because like this is one of the first ratings that I'm even aware of of this film, but you know, underrepresented perhaps in the media and in all the trailers and teasers and everything that's been out there. Like, play up this man because he really delivers a performance here that is so much fun. You know, American Psycho people are always going to focus on Patrick Bateman, right? They're always going to focus on our main character. You've got Willem DeFoe in that film as well, really delivering a very different cop that is equally as enjoyable to kind of play off the main character. And this one here is so ridiculous. It really makes me think that this film is more meta than the two latest Scream installments because its commentary on acting, on Hollywood, on fame and celebrity, on art is more on point, I think, than anything we got out of the Scream franchise since perhaps the first, I don't know, one or two movies.

SPEAKER_02 59:05

I know Rory is a character that everyone probably immediately hated, and I think that's the point, obviously. He was such a douchebag, but Justin Thoreau, kudos to this guy for bringing this character to life. He is actually really good at being a douchebag. We don't like this character, we don't want to like this character, we want to see this character go away, and I think it speaks volumes to what he's able to bring to life to get you to feel that.

SPEAKER_04 59:33

Yeah, I don't know if I love or hate the fact that the only context I have of who he is is Jennifer Anison's ex-husband. But yeah, absolutely a character that you love to hate because some of the stuff he was saying was infuriating, but he played it so straight.

SPEAKER_01 59:50

Oh, yeah. Here's here's another American psycho alumni, and his performance was kind of like grading in parts. You know, it's supposed to get on your nerves. And I think you you're right there in camp. There's there's other moments of this film that border on camp, but this was an entire performance dedicated to showing you campiness. The haircut was was super campy. All of the facial expressions really delivered on that. And this is, you know, from the from the first film, we have a couple characters that you're not supposed to like. All of that was like squeezed into one character here, and then he just nailed it. I actually do like him as an actor. No, for sure. He he was in uh the Mosquito Coast TV show, and I believe his uncle is the writer of the original novel, which is kind of cool as well. But the leftovers on HBO uh was right such a such a great piece of TV a couple of years ago. It's only been, I think, less than a decade since that ended. But his appearance in Parks and Rec is one that I'll hold on to because it's such a small piece. But he is, like you said, able to really be a douchebag when he wants to. He's also really like able to be endearing and someone that you want to see succeed. But I think had you chosen another actor to be in this role, you wouldn't have hated him quite as much, and you wouldn't have been grossed out by him quite as much. I think this was just like a nice choice.

SPEAKER_04 1:01:07

I do think he brought what we needed. But let me tell you about something else that I personally needed from this movie, and I guess it's not really fair to hold over it. I've already shared that I had a little bad taste in my mouth about the claymation style of Charles' death, which ended up being hilarious, so it's great. We already talked about Dolores not being all she was cracked up to be. But the real sin of this movie is the fact that we're not getting a fucking Beetlejuice, Beetlejuice house at Halloween horror nights. The second we saw that afterlife when we're introduced to Danny DeVito scene, oh my gosh, I thought I need to walk in this space, I need to have scare actors popping out of this space. It is a crime, it is a travesty. Listen, that's not really any diggy this movie. I love this movie, it's incredible, but I do want to directly write anyone I need to. How do we have a Denny's menu for the afterlife, but we don't have an afterlife scare house? Forever 21 is showing me ads about their Beetlejuice collection, which honestly, all this shit is fire. I'm not mad at it. But come on, Halloween Horror Nights. What the fuck are you sleeping on? You knew what was coming.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:23

It's so true. Oh my gosh. I'm gonna one-up you we don't need a house in Halloween Horror Nights for Beetlejuice, we need a permanent installation at Universal Studios. That's what we need.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:33

No, you're absolutely right.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:35

Yeah, it's tough because I I know that Halloween Horror Knights has done Beetlejuice houses in the past, and they did one not that long ago, like a couple years back, and that kind of sucks that they didn't just maybe that was a thought process of they're like, oh, we just don't need to do another one, but I think it's a miss because we do need to do another one. This is now the second house that we have failed to get at Halloween Horror Nights this year, and I feel like we may need to be in charge of Halloween Horror Nights because we definitely need the Beetlejuice house, and we also needed an alien house. So I don't know what the fuck is happening here.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:10

And I bet we needed a fucking Terra Fire 3 house. Yeah listen here, man. Here's the other thing about this. If we can have Stranger Things come around so many times, if we can have the weekend getting his own spot multiple years, fuck that. Give me Beetlejuice.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:28

Seriously.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:29

Alright, I'm off my soapbox now.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:31

Well, I know, Chris, look, you already talked about it, but I am gonna say it because as much as I liked the cutback scene where we get the classic Italian horror movie feel of the backstory of Dolores and Beetlejuice, I just feel like that plot point isn't as impactful if you don't handle it well. And they didn't handle it well because they built all this up to only get like this fizzled out conclusion. And I really just wanted to see more of this love feud between Beetlejuice and Dolores. I wanted to see more action. At the very least, we needed to see that showdown we were talking about earlier. But that is the worst part for me because if you're gonna throw something like that in there, we probably know never say never, but we probably know we're not gonna get another installment. You never know, but I just don't know that they're gonna do another installment. It would have been cool to get that kind of a maybe like a backstory type feel, or maybe find a way to bring her back and then there's this feud. I don't know. But for this movie specifically, I just wanted a little bit more of that story.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:39

Yeah. If we could get Beetlejuice, Beetlejuice, Beetlejuice, incredible, but also you're not supposed to say his name three times, so technically these motherfuckers can get away with not making it.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:50

I know. I I'll I've I'll add, you know, the the resolution of our two secondary antagonists was probably the worst part of the movie for me. I think, you know, her her resolution at the end is so sudden and kind of silly. I was really hoping that they were gonna be forced to live together forever. I truly was. I was hoping that she was gonna get close enough to attempt to suck out his soul and it didn't work. And then for all eternity, they somehow got banished into somewhere awful and were forced to live like married with with children. Just complete suburban non-bliss is what I had hoped for the two of them.

SPEAKER_04 1:05:27

How great would it have been if she tried to suck his soul but couldn't because he had already bargained it away and he is just not in possession of a soul. Or give us like a good little karmic balance that Delia Dietz kept talking about, give their lives to Jeremy's parents and make them stuck in that house forever.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:48

Yeah, yeah. Oh my gosh, that would be a hilarious ending. That in the end, Beatle Juice is stuck in suburban non bliss with his ex wife.

SPEAKER_04 1:05:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:00

And then because his soul is permanently devoted at this point to Lydia. Yep. And of course, she's going to hold that over him for the rest of eternity. I don't know. I'm just saying there could have been more fun ways to wrap that up. And as far as Killer Casper goes, it was a fun addition in a way, but also completely unnecessary. Because had she found that book in the attic and just played around with it and ended up in the same kind of situation where she's stuck over there, all the rest of the like points of the story would have worked out just fine. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:06:31

Actually, you know, maybe not. Because as a skeptic, she probably would have looked at that book and still thought it was bullshit.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:06:39

So maybe she wouldn't have been willing or open based on how things were between her and her mother to actually crack that book open and move forward for a few years.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:49

True.

SPEAKER_04 1:06:50

Let me tell you this though. I am so excited because Friday night I'm watching it again. And I can't wait to experience it with more people. I can't wait to experience it with kids. And I cannot wait to put on Beetlejuice before I go back into it. Because I just want to soak up every ounce I can and identify anything I miss on the first watch.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:13

Man, I wish I was able to see this one in theaters another time. It might still happen, but I do have a lot going on the next couple weeks or so. So I don't know if I'm going to really be able to get into it in a theater, but I feel like I have to watch this one whenever I watch Beetlejuice now, because I feel like they go hand in hand. This is a sequel that can really stand up and pair well. You know, you think of like, I know it's a little bit cheesier, but when you think of like Hocus Pocus, right? Hocus Pocus is iconic. We watch it in the spooky season, we love it. It's great. The sequel wasn't as good. And I don't really feel the need to watch the sequel when I watch Hocus Pocus, but right now I'm feeling like I need to watch when I watch it during the spooky season. So it's definitely getting another watch.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:59

Easily. You know, I was supposed to watch this originally with my wife in the theater, and plans changed. I ended up watching it alone, and I cannot wait to watch it again with her because I know that she's gonna have so much fun with this, you know. I think as a sequel goes, most of them you can kind of see like, okay, like it's fun, they were able to work with it, and I could probably watch it. This is one where it's like, no, it this is now part of Beetlejuice, like you said, Sean. Now the two of them belong together, and now anytime I want to watch it, you gotta do both.

SPEAKER_04 1:08:30

I cannot think of a better way to execute your sequel than to do so well that it belongs as a companion with its predecessor. And I think that's a mark of success because there you have it, folks. Beetlejuice Beetlejuice has earned a resounding universal slash. And we've certainly had a robust discussion here, but the conversation about this movie and its success and its highlights doesn't end here by any means.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:53

Yeah, if you want to find out how you can go further than this episode, consider supporting the show by subscribing through Apple Podcasts or visiting patreon.com slash hackerslash where you can enjoy even more of the show, including bonus content with early access, extended episodes with our B sides, which are free sides for the spooky season, movie nominations, and of course, live shows.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:18

And if you had fun listening to us talk about Beetlejuice Beetlejuice, and are now as eager as he is to say I do, leave us a five-star review wherever you get your podcasts. That helps us continue to deliver great content for all your horror fiends out there.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:30

We'll see you next time, folks. And remember, confronting the unknown, conquering your fears? There's nothing harder.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:38

You don't want to spend eternity with me.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:50

Okay, so we're we're in the scene when we realize that Astrid's dad has a job uh in the afterlife. And that just makes me think, you know, they have this whole other life once they reach the afterlife. Like you have to get a job, you have to have stuff to do because you have eternity effectively. Like, what else are they doing down there? Like what other kind of stuff? You know, do they go home and kick their shoes off and turn on the TV? And do they go to the nightclub? Do they get afterlife coffee? Like, what is it like?

SPEAKER_04 1:10:19

Yeah, let me tell you, the last thing I want to do is die and still have to work. Thanks.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:24

But that's what it seems like. It seems like you get assigned some kind of job somehow. Maybe you find yourself in a good career path. You can smooze over some kind of idea that you have, you know what I mean? But it looks like a lot of people are doing some bullshit work, man. We got some janitors, you know what I mean? We got some office desk action going on, and it does seem like a very bad way to spend eternity.

SPEAKER_04 1:10:47

Imagine being the conductor of the soul train, though.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:50

Oh, a party all the time. Fucking sick. Are all of those people just getting on the train and getting off and just partying throughout the entirety? Just for the vibes. Just for the vibes, because you ain't finding that many people dancing on the soul train every single trip.

SPEAKER_04 1:11:06

Yeah, think of them as like the seat fillers at the Academy Awards, like you professionally just take up space, except these folks take it up with the party.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:15

Oh man. Yeah, it's crazy. It is crazy. I do feel like, man, so if you were to have like this assigned job situation, you know, just think about like how that would work. Like, would it would it be just like kind of what we see when you're checking into the afterlife? Do you have to go to some form of DMV experience, pick a number, wait to be called up, and then assigned a task? Do you get to assign some kind of haunting task? Like that would be dope. What if you just have a mission? It's like your mission here is to go to this house and haunt this family.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:48

It's like Monsters Inc., but for for ghosts.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:51

Yes, exactly. Just like Monsters Inc. Damn.

SPEAKER_04 1:11:54

I could get into that. It'd be way better than I think the Futurama possibility, where you get chipped and then pricked and then just randomly given something. But I do think if I could present some kind of posthumous resume, I would like to think maybe I could land like a radio gig in the afterlife.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:15

Oh yeah. Dang. That would be that would be legit.

SPEAKER_04 1:12:18

Yeah, fuck the bureaucracy shit. That military experience, get over get out of here. Irrelevant.

SPEAKER_01 1:12:24

Yeah, that would be cool. They they've gotta have like music that they listen to down there. Is it just the same stuff that we listen to up here? Or do they have their own like new musicians? Like people find a new purpose once they reach the afterlife and now they're all chapel roan down there.

SPEAKER_04 1:12:39

Well, it's chapel grown down there. Or it's the Monster Mash. It really maybe it's just my spooky playlist playing 24-7.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:49

It would be it would be interesting, though, I think, just to have yeah, like do the artists that die get to just be artists down there, like in the afterlife or wherever the afterlife is, right? Like, do they get to just start a new career and just entertain the masses? But you would have to come up with new content, right? Let's not play the same old, same old. Let's let's put some ghostly tweaks on our content.

SPEAKER_04 1:13:14

Undoubtedly. But do we think that there's any correlation between the art the value of an artist rising after death? Do we think that is in any way linked to their uh celebrity ascension in the afterlife?

SPEAKER_02 1:13:27

Ooh, you mean like they get more popular because they died? Is that what you're talking about?

SPEAKER_04 1:13:32

Yeah, so art costs more when the artist is dead. Right. Because there's not gonna be made anymore. But what if that's like just their newest form? You know what I mean? Like, what is that is their like Charmander to Charizard pipeline?

SPEAKER_02 1:13:46

Damn. Damn. Now I'm just thinking of how we can smuggle some of this, you know, content or media out of the afterlife into the living, the life of the living, and just create some really good underground releases, you know? This is shit you just have never not heard before. This is the epitome of underground.

SPEAKER_04 1:14:08

Undergrave releases.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:10

Undergrave releases, yeah. Crazy.

SPEAKER_01 1:14:13

What if what if you've been making art your entire life? You're a musician, you're an artist, you're whatever, right? And then you get down there, you're like, I don't want to do that for a turn. Like, I did that, like I'm done. Like, I just want to chill out, play with my crystals like David Boreanus, and and you know, just just like have a have a go at at being relaxed.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:35

That would be interesting. Yeah, I mean, who's to say? Maybe you did enough of that in your life that you get down there and you just want to do something else, and yeah, now you gotta find a different path, a different, a different uh hobby or passion.

SPEAKER_04 1:14:48

Yeah. Right. Is that like just how men want to go play golf all the time? Imagine outrageous how golfing or the afterlife, golfing.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:58

Golfing in the afterlife.

SPEAKER_01 1:15:00

It's gotta be sitting at a like a desk and being ground to dust in the bureaucracy. That is basically all the all the jobs we see down there, it's all bureaucratic hell. Yeah. Nobody has a nice tidy. If somebody down there had a nice tidy desk, I might be like, I'm interested. Like they got nice post-its, they got a nice swing line. Like, uh, okay, you're getting me.

SPEAKER_04 1:15:21

Okay. Hear me out. What if in life everyone who's a dick to a DMV employee is then a DMV employee?

SPEAKER_02 1:15:31

That's perfect. Yeah. That's so perfect.

SPEAKER_04 1:15:33

You had this opportunity to be nice to someone during a finite experience that is your life, and you were a dick, so now you had to spend all of eternity paying it back to the government.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:44

Hey.

SPEAKER_04 1:15:44

That's karma.

SPEAKER_01 1:15:45

That is karma. Yeah, who ends up on the goon squad? You know, how do you get that job?

SPEAKER_02 1:15:49

Right? Yeah. I mean, I'm telling you, there's no yeah, there's no way I'm gonna get roped into doing some bullshit gig for eternity. I will find I will find the loopholes, you know what I mean? And I will cross back and forth and and I'll be like a Beetlejuice. You know what I mean? I feel like that's just the best way to live. Like you live in between the rules, you know what I mean? You don't really follow any rules, you kind of just do your own thing and just scrape by.

SPEAKER_01 1:16:18

But telling Sean to take a number, and he's like, No gods, no mashers, I do whatever I want to.

SPEAKER_04 1:16:23

I give you the number.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:16:25

That's right.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:26

Uh well, yeah, just like in the first one where he just takes, he swaps out for the earlier number, he gets up quicker, man. You know, you just gotta find you gotta find your own path.

SPEAKER_04 1:16:36

Innovation.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:38

Innovation.

SPEAKER_04 1:16:39

But in this movie, we have the call center. Also, fuck that. I'm not doing a call center in the afterlife. Fuck no. However, what about the real estate?

SPEAKER_02 1:16:50

Yes.

SPEAKER_04 1:16:51

What kind of spa are you owning?

SPEAKER_02 1:16:53

This is an interesting topic. The afterlife real estate, you know. I was I was thinking about this also. Like, where do they live? Like, what does the real estate look like in the afterlife?

SPEAKER_04 1:17:03

I hear it's a really competitive market with like absorbent prices.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:07

Well, it's constantly booming, you know, tons of people dying every day.

SPEAKER_04 1:17:11

It's also based on the cost of living.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:13

Oh fuck. Oh no.

SPEAKER_04 1:17:16

I got that joke straight from Rob Zombies and the Monsters.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:20

Love it. Love it.

SPEAKER_01 1:17:23

But like there's there seems to be two different spots here because you have the place where everyone arrives and they have to have regular things going on there. You know, they've we've got to have uh dry cleaning, apparently, around these parts. But then when they get on the Soul Train, we don't know what it's like where they're headed. You know, and maybe everyone gets like a suburban house, or maybe they just shuttle them over to an apartment.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:17:45

Well, there was the description and the sign of where they were going, and none of those places sounded good, except for the Great Beyond.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:53

Right. The Great Beyond. Yeah. So oh man, yeah. I guess maybe all of these jobs that we're seeing are just uh if you are employed to just, I don't know, keep the afterlife moving in the right direction and keep the living from doing dumb shit.

SPEAKER_04 1:18:13

No, thanks. I do enough babysitting in my regular job.

SPEAKER_01 1:18:16

I mean, they have forever, right? And so, like, this could be like step one, you know, you gotta make it through this and then you get where you're going. Some people just head there right away. Other folks were like, we're not we're not quite sure. We gotta give you a job first and and figure it out. It's you gotta do an internship effectively.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:32

Oh, hell no. An internship for the great beyond just to cross over.

SPEAKER_04 1:18:36

Oh my god. Imagine your internship being having to hand Willem Defoe a cup of coffee every five seconds.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:45

The worst.

SPEAKER_04 1:18:46

This man was drinking coffee as often as Donnie Wahlberg was shaving his face in that fucking movie that we watched, Dead Silence.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:54

Dead Silence. It's so true. Oh.

SPEAKER_04 1:18:58

Yeah. Yeah, he was definitely the Donnie Wahlberg of this movie, except way better.

SPEAKER_02 1:19:02

Yeah, not even really drinking all the coffee, just holding the coffee and crushing it, you know?

SPEAKER_04 1:19:08

Squeezing it, throwing in the trash, making stains, doing kind quick spins, finger guns, literal guns.

SPEAKER_02 1:19:15

Finger guns. Just keeping it real the whole time. Keeping it real.

SPEAKER_04 1:19:20

Tim Burton was really Tim Burtoning.

SPEAKER_02 1:19:23

Yeah, it was.

SPEAKER_04 1:19:24

Which is a really fucking dumb statement for me, but it's true.

SPEAKER_01 1:19:28

It was the top of the top. You know, you've got scissor hands going on that sets the stage, and then years later we get like Nightmare Before Christmas. Tim Burton created a genre of Tim Burton movies, effectively.

SPEAKER_04 1:19:42

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. He sure did. But I think I needed more of an event because she walks into the church and then nothing really happens.

SPEAKER_02 1:19:51

Yeah, we need a showdown.

SPEAKER_04 1:19:53

We need a hoe down throwdown.

SPEAKER_02 1:19:55

We need a celebrity deathmatch.

SPEAKER_04 1:19:57

Oh shit. Okay. How great would it have been if she tried to suck his whole wow. You know what I meant. Holy shit. Okay.